Quote:
Originally Posted by weaponunit  why dont you just your BA,DA,BT armies with the new space marine codex, surely you would be able to represent your current armies by picking appropriate traits.
that way the only money wasted would have been on your DA codex or whatever |
Traits are gone, dude. So you can't give your average Brother Joe the option to swap his bolter for bolt pistol & close combat weapons, or give your assault/tac/dev squads tank hunters/infiltrate etc and more. So no more BA, SW, DA, BT wannabe chapters...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaybird meh, as a bt player, i'm not complaining about anything. 5th ed just gave every single one of my initiates master-crafted chainswords, neophyte meatshields to take plasma hits, the same speed as a jump pack marine, nigh-invulnerable transports that can STILL fire everything moving at 6", AND 4+ cover saves everywhere. i love it! |
Hate to rain on your parade brother ( and I say this as a fellow BT player ), but the new 5th ed actually screws us up quite a fair bit ( imho ). I agree entirely with you on the preferred enemy vow's advantages & the unfortunate neophyte meatshields. But lets see:
1 ) Righteous Zeal: We cant zeal into close combat anymore. Thereby removing the once interesting dilemma for our enemies to decide whether to shoot us, we take casualties, chance of passing leadership and running into base to base contact and denying them of charge bonuses. I posted this issue for debate on the rules section, but this gentlemen who replied, believes that we can MUST MOVE ( from zeal rules ) UP TO ( from 5th ed consolidation rules ). So we can choose to move from
ZERO UP TO ( insert whatever you rolled for D6 ) inches. Therefore, we can choose to move
ZERO inches. I personally disagree & think thats a cheesy interpretation, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Also, without Combat Tactics & being fearless in CC, means you're stuck in til you win or you die. Can't choose to disengage via Tactics ( & re-engage following turn ), so we die trying once in HtH.
And no use running D6" in lieu of shooting when we don't have fleet & can't charge. Might help for scrambling into cover though... And running forward might not be a good thing when the enemy can use your zeal to bring you even closer to be charged...
2 ) Kill Them All (aka target priority ) : BT rule that you MUST take the target priority test at -1 LD to shoot another target other than the closest. The latest FAQ has clearly stated that this rule is still in effect, and therefore our AT sqds must
still test to shoot pass screening enemy infantry at that big fat tank behind ( no more large selection in 5th ). Just imagine what would happen if you fail the test.......
You can have a look at my post if you need details:
http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...o-kidding.html
3 ) Sad Fisties: We don't get sergeants ( except in command squads ). Therefore the powerfist wielding Initiate just got shafted to 1 basic attack & 2 on the charge. Albeit with re-rolls to hit IF you take the preferred enemy vow. Think CC with walkers ( esp Eldar Wraithlords with T8 that S4 from your other ordinary Brother Joe templars can no longer hurt in HtH )
4 ) Disgruntled Heroes: Used to be only a select few gentlemen in the Blessed Holy Imperium of Mankind has WS6, like Dante, Mephiston, Grimnar, Ragnar, Ulrik & our beloved Emperor's Champion. Now every tom, dick & harry Chapter Master & Brother-Captain has WS6 in 5th ed. So our heroes & our fellow esteemed heroes from BA & SW ( except above named chars ) get hit on 3+ by arrogant lil, newly-promoted Chapter Masters/Brother-Captain whelps from other SM chapters, when BT, BA & SW are supposed to be the best CC chapters in the Imperium!?
And the Emperor's Champion has 2+/4+ saves, S6 power weapon ( aka the famed Black Sword ), yea? Well guess what, check out the new Chapter Champion from the Honour Guard Squad. He gets 2+, WS5 & re-rolls to hit
and wound on enemy ICs. And did I mention he can purchase something cool and
new called the
relic blade- S6 power weapon? ( as do all his Honour Guardians & Chapter Masters/Captains ) (
note irony, LOL )
5 ) Points Costs: As stated by many previously. Hurts more for BT because our basic Brother Joe costs 16 pts & needs 1 pt more for frags to be effect at their CC role. Thats 17 pts. With mandatory zeal tests, gw's trying to encourage larger squads. But larger squads at higher costs per model = fewer Crusader squads = fewer scoring units.
6 ) Vehicle & Equipment Function: As stated by many previously. Obviously, someone in the BT, DA, SW, BA's Departmento Armourium screwed up & forgot to order the
improved equipment from the nearby forgeworlds... Might have been some malfunctioning red tape servitors or those criminally incompetent pen/paper-pushing Chief Techmarines ...
Now, hold on here .... even DH? The vaunted Grey Knights? The famed Chamber Militant of the Ordo Malleus!? Saturn's moon of Titan being less than 1,764.290904 million kilometres away from MARS itself?!? Gasp *shocking silence* ..... Anyway, enough said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Paris DA, BT, and BA all get new faqs to make them match up with the new SM rules. SW will get a new book anyways. |
Quote:
Originally Posted by je_suis_roux |
But all thats said, the important thing ( imho ) is not that Space Marines are getting buffed in 5th ed.
The Question is:
Are the other Divergent Chapters getting buffed/updated with them?
ie, we need those frakking FAQs & hopefully
updated army lists & stats else we're screwed.
Thats why news like above, supposedly 'accurate & first hand from primary sources' really worry me .....
Hate to whine, but my 2 cents.