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Chaos Space Marines
I'm starting on War40k, but I'm stuck between these two choices...
Emperor's Children or the Tau?
Which is better on these five categories? (easier, cheaper is better)
How much models cost...
How easily can it adapt to differing situations, scenarios and army lists?
Easier to paint? Better paint scheme?
Better at advanced tactics? esp. versus MEQs and Orks. Competitiveness?
I think CSM wins this one...
Live for the Swarm!
As a Tau player I can say the following:
Will be quite the same ... the tau starter box is quite nice, I've bought two of them during building my army. But other than the starter box it doesn't really matter wich army you play, they cost all about the same.
Tau do have their own special gameplay. For example you'll find yourself avoiding close combat as far as possible. If you play a mobile tau force you will be versatile altough. However, tau are a very unforgiving army. one or two mistakes and you'll loose the game easily. that's not that bad since you'll learn the tactics quite fast this way, but don't expect to win the first games as a new tau player.
Tau can deal with everything , we even got weapons that are excellent against every type of enemy. For example the railgun of the hammerhead. you can shoot a single shot of pure ownage and it can kill everything on the battlefield, or you can shoot a blast munition and wipe out infantery. It's the same with our crisis battle suits. You can equip them with a huge amount of options, although only about 3-5 builds are worth playing. However, they can also deal with every opponent. The main problem as a Tau player isn't to decide which unit to play but to decide how to equip them.
as i said, tau aren't easy to win with. If you start playing wh40k with tau you will loose at first. You will also spend a lot of time building your army list and thinking about your tactics. Modelwise the Tau models are quite easy to build and to convert. But I do not have any reference here since I only play Tau.
My personal opinion:
If you like the style of the tau and their weapon profiles and if you're fine with the lack of close combat. Then take them. They aren't regarded as one of the best races, but since GW is redoing their codex (as with anyones elses for the 5th edition) that's not an argument.
Please remember to put a closing date on your poll. I have made this 14 days.
Having an army and not owning a rulebook is like owning a car with no steering wheel.Originally Posted by amishcellphone
Welcome to 40K
I recently changed up from Tau to Chaos Marines,
COST: Youre gonna pay aboot the same for a box of CSM as you are Fire Warriors.
VERSATILITY: I wanted to say that the Tau are a little hurting IMO with 5th Edition. All the cover saves provided now made it a lot harder to really make your opponent fear your firepower. For versatility, Id say go with the CSM. you can create you army around shooting, or melee. The Tau are always playing half the game with shooting making or breaking them.
PAINTING: This is up to you and your particular style. The Tau have smooth, flat lines that look great when painted. The CSM can get a little busy with they many different spikes, chains, skulls, tassels, extra weapons, and mutations which can add time or complexity to your paint scheme.
TACTICAL: Woo. this is a loaded question. At high level play the CSM have have this configuration called "Double-Lash Prince" and its arguably their most competitve army build. I have yet to see a really good alternative. Tau on the other hand, dont seem to have this problem. As long as you pack tons of Railguns youre usually okay.
Tau vs MEQ: Tau does well with many low AP weapons. This has been offset somewhat by the proliferation of cover saves in 5th. (IMO)
Tau vs Swarm: Tau just doesnt get the quantity of shots (compared to Eldar or IG). Most swarm armies just have too many wounds on the table or move too fast to effectivly shoot them all down. You have to play smart to beat a swarm.
CSM vs MEQ: CSM have fair options for thier units, so you are able to equip a lot of melta's, plasma's or power x's. This will make you able to have a way to deal with just aboot anyone.
CSM vs Swarm:I frequently play against Orks, and have had fair successes against them. Ive also played against Tyranids and squeaked a win. The ability to have 2x flamers per unit as well as a beefy assualt will help clear up those swarms.
BEGINNER-FRIENDLY: CSM wins this one: point them at what needs some killin's and let'er rip.
Summary: IMO I feel Tau got a little bit of a raw deal with 5th. CSM have a good selection of scoring units, with some effective terminators and Heavy choices. The Tau are a medium-fast army able to move and redeploy effectivly with the Firewarrior still being a deal for *thier cost*. It could come down to what you think your play style will be, and how you like the look of each army.
Last edited by Typhoon Jetson; October 8th, 2009 at 19:08. Reason: Forgot aboot the points
"So, how did you become a Renegade Space Marine?"
"..... Tax evasion...."
Typhoon, fire warriors are not X points. They're more like XX.
Please don't post points costs of single models - Alzer
on topic, I'm not too sure, since I am just starting. According to what people are saying (various sources I've read on the internet, from tau veterans), once you learn how to use them properly, the tau can be very good. I personally am fine with losing some games at the beginning, and the losses would probably happen anyway.
Last edited by Alzer; October 8th, 2009 at 18:48.
As A Chaos player, more specifically the army you are looking at (Emperors Children) I'm not going to lie, it will get quite expensive IF you want to run sonic weapons in every squad. (This is what I do) by the time I'm done buying a box of CSM and then buying sonic weapons and Emp Children shoulder pads, it's roughly 70 bucks for a 10 man squad. But don't let that deter you! There are plenty of other ways to run your Emperors Children w/o Sonic Weapons.
Versatility wise there is no comparison! Tau can only sit there and shoot, a chaos marine will not only out shoot tau, out combat tau, and out armor save tau, but your army will look considerable more cool! Your customization of a chaos army is almost endless. Tau (If you ask me) is a pretty straight forwar not many conversions needed army. Chaos, the sky is the limit.
Painting, again there is no compatition. There is nothing quite like painting an army of Slaanesh worshiping, noise loving, sex crazed maniacs who get pleasure from everything! Just think Pinks, Purples, Baby Blue's! Your army will not only look stunning but you will have pride in playing it.
Tactical abilities of both armies can be quite differant. Tau you really have one option sit back, shoot, and hope they dont get close. Chaos on the other hand can be customized for a strictly assault army, shooty army, or a mix of the two! This gives you much more of a tactical advantage in that your army can adapt to what your opponent is doing much more easily with chaos.
If you are a beginner then I say choose the army in which you think is the coolest looking or sounding. That's what I did 8 years ago when I thought that Space Wolves were the coolest army (and still are) out there. My buddy on the other hand went with Chaos and he prefers them over anyone else. It is really a personal choice. All the armies out there have differant abilities and cool fluff so pick the one you think will suit you best!
The Wolf time is upon us!
Rep for the Rep God! Positive for the Positive Throne!
Armies: Space Wolves, Imperial Guard, Emperors Children, Necrons, Eldar
If you like the idea of crased anarchistic space marines with extra spikes n skulls, go CSM.
If you want thecnology, go tau.
They're a must more challangeing army and have some pretty good options in my opinion.
Chaos space marines are pretty boring in the new dex,it's pretty much Lash Obilit lash Obilit etc...it gets dull after a while,trust me i play CSM's and i'm even saying it's dull.
Tau you can customize your weapons and unit choices most units in the Tau army are half decent if not usable.
Well good luck with whatever you pick.
we tau do also have some crap in our codex (vespids/etherals/krotox) but the interesting part is this:
With marines you can build a moderate list and perform well with it but with a moderate Tau list you will fail most of the times. Also just one or two small mistakes during gameplay will make you loose.
Playing Tau is a real challenge. Marines will forgive mistakes, Tau won't.
It takes time to become a good player but I'm really proud of playing Tau. Winning with Tau against good players is a real achievement. We aren't the best army out there and we know it but we got the tools to win the games, you just have to use them the right way.
As I said, at first you will loose with Tau very often. Don't give up. Learn from your mistakes, become a better player.
If you go for CSM's you'll have an army that is forgiving and can easily develop in any direction you want. Fluff, paintscheme, conversion and customization-wise you have many possibilities. I would avoid the battleforce though as it comes with the Possessed which are not that useful.
Take a look here: