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In everyone's expert opinion,
Which army depends least upon dice to have a decent performance?
It sounds like a strange question, but I have to factor rolling a 1 or 2 50% of the time into my strategy.
Eg. With a squad of 8 CSMS with 2 Plasma and bolters, rapid firing against a squad of 6 seraphims, over the past 4 games, I tend to cause 4 wounds them and 3 (he tend to save against 2-3 wounds if they aren'T plasma. I'll fail about half of my armour saves) against myself. it's a little worrying that my mate is starting to rely on twin linked bolt pistols to send a squad of CSMs running.
The only way i've been able to get around is by rolling as many dice as possible. Having squads that roll a whole bucket load of dice in CC assaults. But even then, the opponent will still get his saving throws.
The only way I can think of dealing with this is by starting 'nids or necrons, which is something that I've been thinking of for a while now.
It sounds like a whinge, but I'm still happy with my chaos army. I think that even persistant bad dice rolls are something which can be overcome with experience and superior tactics.
But, the question remains, is there an army, no matter how difficult, that dice don't factor in as much?
And using different/loaded dice is not an option
I don't think that will happen, mate. After all, why have the dice if they don't matter. But I think the closest thing to what you are talking about would be Necrons. They don't do much other than shoot. And besides, even if you force a TON of saves, still about 1/2 to 3/4 still gets up. Just making things more frustrating.
I guess so. That sounds about right. I decided to go Nids for fluff reasons and army list building reasons.
This so called law of averages must exist though, even if it's over the course of a year rather than a game.
I though it would be necrons.
If being cursed by the dice gods really does concern you, remember that the more dice you are rolling at once, the larger your sample size of the population of potential dice rolls becomes. The larger your sample size becomes, the more likely it is that you will sample the right proportion of dice rolls that is present - i.e, 1/6 of your rolls will be 1, 1/6 will be 2, and so on. That means it's more likely that you'll get what you paid for in terms of points - your BS 3 guys will hit 1/2 the time, your 2+ saves will function 5/6 of the time (barring AP, of course).
Certain armies have an advantage in the predictability of their rolls because they roll so many dice at a time. GW did a good job in designing 40K so that the rolls never get large enough to achieve a great sample size, but swarm armies come pretty close sometimes. Infantry-heavy Imperial Guard armies, Tyranid swarms with cheap gaunts, Eldar guardian swamping armies or Feral Ork Hunta mobbing armies all come to mind as being pretty predictable in their roll results. The idea is to build a list out of unit choices that, when shooting or assaulting, rolls at least 30 dice at a time even after a few casualties.
Necrons are probably the only MEQ army that does this well because of their 20-man warrior squads, but there are other options. Try horde-style tyranids with a few very large gaunt squads and some decent synapse, and see how it works out.
That must be why people like baal predators, LRC's and leman russ exterminators.
You don't need to count out the dice, you just throw them all
Necrons do really well typically due to high BS and average to high strength weaponry, they suffer against other MEQs because they get a save, but against eldar or orks necrons don't need great rolling since they (generally) wound easily and ignore armour.
I noticed that actually, so cheers for the support. I tried to rapid fire some power armour and ended up with 1 casualty from about 14 shots.
But when i assaulted him with a different squad and threw about 26 dice, i think i got a massacre from the sheer amount of dice that I rolled.
It all makes sense now, and now I get why autocannon Chaos Havocs and Devil Fexes are so effective.
You're dice rolls aren't particularly bad. Bolters are a str 4 weapon, Seraphs are T4, right? 4 wounds is about right.Originally Posted by Karmoon
Secondly, there is no "law of averages". It's hype strung by fools to get other fools to do their bidding. It's also why you never place a chance-based bet without ignoring earlier results. Just because a coin has flipped heads 23 times in a row does not make it any more likely to flip tails on the 24th time.
Actually, Seraphim, like all Sisters, are T3. He should theoretically kill 4 Seraphim with the squad he described.
Thanks for the comments, I've just discovered (I'm a slow learner) that WH40K is based on buckets of dice mechanics to iron out inconsitancies and luck to a greater degree.
In game play terms, this works too. The above plasma example, I tried it with 4 havocs instead. I got 3 over heats and 1 dead marine, but the squad they shot into.... heh heh, there wasn't really anything left but steaming bloody shoe soles. You know it makes sense baby!
But I like a challenge. So next I will try nids. it'll be a challenge to throw stuff against an army in which every squad has a flamer. Next month, you can expect a whiney thread about template weapons.
Ah, then you are cursed by the Dice Gods. The way to appease them is, as you've discovered, to roll as many dice as possible. This makes them happy.Originally Posted by tuebor