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hi guys! well i just got done with like my 10th straight battle against various flavor of space marines and i've noticed a realy intresting trend. all but one army used a full squad of terminators and at least one dreadnaught in only 1k points!
i personally cant understand it as i play chaos and love having just a ton of power armored guys running around. and every battle where they take terminators they just foot slog it and get shot up before they do anything. but almost every player i talked to insisted that terminators and those other very high point cost guyswere worth it, even though they neverdid enough to warrent a good 5th or 4th of their points.
has anyone else noticed this? people taking big models and just expecting the huge price to justify their exsistance?
HA! LOL read the Tyranid forum.
speaking as a nid player, it's a different situation.
Marine HQs, terminator and Dreads can all be killed in 1 shot. Carnifexes and Hive tyrants, by and large, cannot be killed by 1 shot and are less prone to injury in the first place.
Silvanest raises a really interesting point though.
On the Chaos forum, you'll get beaten down with the stick of sense if you bring Terminators or raptors to a list which is less than 1850 points.
Yet, on the marine forums, i've seen 1000 point lists with only 14 models.
I'm not a marine player, so i don't want to speculate or comment.. but maybe there's a method in the madness.
I personally can't see it though. And further more, i can't really interpret it as a threat either.
Any marine players to comment?
personally, i would never take terminators under 2500pts. i'm all about loads of basic troopers. it seems that the majority of inexperianced/ new players think to highly of terminators and use them inapropraitly.
Right here Karmoon, and yes Terminators are great to have. However, I have neither a Dreadnought nor a squad of Terminators in any of my army lists.
Even with many models, it is rather hard to take down Terminators. Throw a couple genestealers at them though, rending claws or not, they melt. Terminators suffer in closecombat, and all you need is a higher intiative with more attacks to break them. Rending weapons are killer too.
Dreadnoughts aren't even worth mentioning. For the points cost, I feel they are worthless. A Dreadnought is a large target, and draws fire from all over the place the moment an opponent sees one. What's the point in having one if Lascannons are all over it before if makes a move?
I honestly can't see why you would have Terminators in an army list 1000 points or under. They'd be more efffective in larger games, just because there would be more units giving them some cover.
Dreadnoughts honestly, will be fired on no matter what the points are at. Have one if you must, but I would never go more.
thats what i though! haha, after getting immence amounts of help from the chaos board and essentially being told that big units come later. the worst list i played againts for marine's had 13. two units of 5 marines. a tooled up dread, a landrader, and a hq.On the Chaos forum, you'll get beaten down with the stick of sense if you bring Terminators or raptors to a list which is less than 1850 points.
Yet, on the marine forums, i've seen 1000 point lists with only 14 models.And further more, i can't really interpret it as a threat either.
that the thing. termies just get shot up. dreads get locked into a pattern of crew stunned or 'splode (i guess thats most armour acctually) and a hq gets destroyed with a hidden powerfist.
i guess i would love to hear input from a marine player (or any army guy that likes expensive 'leet' units)
wow? a termi squad in 1k points? Being a marine player its probably just "Ooooh! New shiny plastics?! With 2+ saves?!" I gotta have some in my small army!
I use 5 in 1.5k but thats just me.
But dreadnoughts I can see in a 1k list as they are walkers and can tie up a lot of CC
Raven Claws Space Marine Chapter........2500 points
Waagh Rotskrag (in building process)
Member of the Fluffmaster Clan
it might be quite fluffy i guess.
the 13 man termie list i mentioned VS a vanguard genestealer list would be fluffier than wizened peach on a cold day.
But tactically, i don't buy it.
also zephyr, i don't dislike dreads in 1000 point lists at all actually. Dreads are coolio.
Termies in low points lists are painfully common. However, so is people only equiping squads with what weapons came in the box they bought and not questioning what weapon makes sense. It is a simple fact that many hobbyists don't apply any critical thinking to warhammer.
Actually this is why I don't keep track of wins and losses. It is a pretty vain way to remind myself of all the unthoughtful poorly conceived lists I have faced. I have played hundreds games of various gamesworkshop games spanning back to the days of the first edition of 40k. However, I learned long ago to not look at my record. If you want to know if your good or your list is solid, play the best opponents you can find and TRY to avoid playing people who you know don't know what they are doing.
Ruthlessness is the mercy of the wise.
Originally he was going to buy the battleforce and a commander (The old batleforce, with the command squad) but our local shop was out of battleforces (I didnt buy the last one theyhad and convert it traitor... I swear!)
Instead he bought one tactical squad, one of the packs with 3 snap fit marines, a commander and a box of terminators (And a codex, of course). Back then he figured they would be all but invincible in such a low points game... He now has realised the error of his ways and is not buying anything but more troops untill christmas... He admits he was an idiot foing it (5 terminators in a 500 points army... not a good idea.)
Oh my God... I dont believe how old this thread was! Many apologies to everyone for this horrid act of thread necromancy (It was still on the first page, so I thought it was a new-ish thread.)
Last edited by Riptor; December 20th, 2006 at 16:38.
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