Heretic Debate - The Emperor - Dead or Alive

[Inquisitor_Domovoi]

Put simply is the Emperor still alive, or is he dead, and the Lords of Terra covered it up? Is it really his 'great mind' that projects the beacon of the Astronomican? I noticed that the latest Warhammer rulebook focused on the people who worked for the Emperor instead of the Emperor himself (remember the picture of the Emperor on the Golden Throne?) So here it is the debate that is spoken in hushed whispers across the Imperium.

Is the Emperor alive? Or long dead? And your reason^^

[techmarine Rannon Zriker]

He is dead, I know I killed him!

but seriously 10000 years in a throne rotting and still alive? thats impossible!

[darkreever]

Last fluff about him I remember reading, he was alive but neither speaks nor moves anymore. I believe the emperor now has his mind wonder in the warp as if looking for something or hiding from something, but he is still the one powering the astronomicon. (They still bring thousands of psykers before him and they are still blinded or killed by him to keep it running, so something of him must be alive in one form or another.)

Rannon, the golden throne was made by Rogal Dorn so the emperor would not die. It was made to keep him alive (well, remade; he had a throne before that after all) so even after so much time it will still be doing its job.

[Grephaun]

Nah, the Emperor is still alive – sort of. Specifically, He exists in a ‘deathless state’, kept alive by the souls of psykers sacrificed to Him ‘so that He may never truly die.’ It’s stated on the first page of all the Black Library novels. Furthermore, the existence of the Astronomican also proves that the Emperor endures, at least in spirit, as the Astronomican is the psychic manifestation of that spirit. Were the Emperor to die, the Astronomican would be extinguished forever, plunging humanity into a ragnarok of darkness and chaos from which the species might never recover.

As for the Emperor surviving 10.000 years in the Golden Throne, that’s nothing considering He was born in the year 8000 BC and therefore at the time of the Great Crusade and Horus Heresy was already around 40,000 years old. His immortality, as well as the techno-magics of the Golden Throne, keeps His soul bound to this reality.

In fact, it might even be possible to use the Golden Throne to revive the Emperor and bring Him back as He was at the time of the Great Crusade; however, as mentioned in the Inquisition rulebook, the High Lords of Terra are not particularly fond of that idea, since this would cost them their power and likely their lives as well when the Emperor awakes to see how His Imperium has been mismanaged in His absence.

And of course, if you’re a believer in the teachings preached by the heretical Illuminati, the death of the Emperor would also have produced a new warp god, the Star Child, from his disembodied soul, and you can bet the filthy xenos and warp-cursed traitors would have had a thing or two to say about that! Considering they’ve been surprisingly quiet on the subject, I suppose the Emperor has yet to ascend to true divinity.

Not to mention that when Inquisitor Jac Draco went to the Imperial Palace and sought an audience, the Emperor spoke to him from the Golden Throne. (Then again, this being Jac Draco, there’s every chance he was stark raving mad at the time and hallucinated the entire thing.) However, Alicia Dominica, founder of the Adepta Sororitas, also visited the Golden Throne; she was guided by the Emperor’s personal guards to stand in His presence and be filled with righteous anger at Goge Vandire’s treachery; though it’s unknown exactly what happened, she returned from the Emperor’s throne room to execute Vandire and end the civil war caused by his evil machinations.

And of course all Astropaths are also taken before the Golden Throne to be soul-bound to the Emperor to prevent them from succumbing to the temptations of Chaos, blinding them in the process. Grey Knights are also soul-bound to the Emperor, but their willpower is strong enough to keep them from losing their sight.

So all in all, I’d say there’s pretty good evidence the Emperor is still alive, if not kicking so much at present.

~Greph.

[The_Giant_Mantis]

I don't mean to rain on Greph's superb knowledge, but just a disclaimer to say that some of that fluff is bordering on the shakey end of things, especially the Star Child and the Draco bits.. This doesn't mean it's automatically wrong, just that it's old and in some cases GW has either ignored or ridden roughshod over it. I believe there's even a mention in Inquisitor to the 'cult of the star child' as a heresy which was exterminated by the Inquisition, for example..

Maybe I'm just bitter because I really didn't like any of that stuff.

Inquisitor does also suggest, however, that over the years the Emperor's body has entirely healed of the wounds it sustained from Horus, but his warp presence remains adrift in the Immaterium.. The origin of the puritan and radical divide in the Inquisition largely stems from its original 4 founding members, 2 of which wanted to preserve the status quo with the Emperor as a living God of eternal saccrifice, and the others who were seeking for ways to revive him.

Unfortunately, noone alive understands how the golden throne works. There's a subsect of the Thorian faction called the Revivicators (mentioned in the Thorian sourcebook) who delve into such things, and end up very creepy as a result, but generally noone has a clue how to reinsert the Emperor's soul into his body.

[Inquisitor_Domovoi]

I gotta say i though i was fluff-wise but you two are enlightening ^^ I recently read that in the Inquisitor rulebook and I think the Emperor's wrath would be funny hehe. Which trilogy is this Draco character part of? I've forgotten and am too lazy to look

[FabricatorGeneralMike]

Originally Posted by Inquisitor_Domovoi

I gotta say i though i was fluff-wise but you two are enlightening ^^ I recently read that in the Inquisitor rulebook and I think the Emperor's wrath would be funny hehe. Which trilogy is this Draco character part of? I've forgotten and am too lazy to look

Jaq Draco is the main charactor in one of Games Workshop's worst Inquisitor novels of all time. The triligy is called the ' Inquisition War's' and it is made up of three books; Draco, Harliquin and Chaos Child.

Now you have to remember that Draco was written way back in 1990, the fluff was both different and not as fleshed out as it is now. The writing is dodgy at best, the plot is horrible and the most improbiable things happen in it. If you are a casuial reader stay away from these books they are really really hard to read. But, if you want a look at how alot of things used to be in the 40K universe, or you are just a uber geek like me and have to know EVERYTHING about the 40K universe, then take a look at these books.

[Jaffar_Hasad]

Whoa. I didn't know the Emperor was born in 8000 B.C. I remember reading that way before 30,000 there was a shamanistic tribe on Terra that were powerful psykers. For some reason they were dying, and they reincarted as one and that made the Emperor. This may just be wikipedia rubbish or an old non-GW 40k game.

The Emperor is alive, but not spiritually. The details of his rebirth are everywhere, you just have to know where to look. Necrons will seal off the known galaxy from the warp, and hopefully the Emperor can be awoken before that day. Hopefully Cypher will reforge the Lion's Sword and free Him, otherwise necrons will harvest everyone (with no good, there can be no evil. sorry chaos lovers, your gone too).



His spirit has gone but his stench remains. Long live the Corpse Emperor

[NiteRabbit]

The origin of the Shaman theory stands as thus:

The shamans of Holy Terra were once channelers of pure Warp energy who feared that the evolution of mankind (and other sentient races) was polluting the Warp with negative thoughts, simultaneously bringing the Chaos Powers into being and making it harder for them to tap into their own powers for the good of mankind. Therefore, they agreed on a "final solution" of sorts where they all ritualistically commited suicide and their collective powers and experience formed the being that we would later come to know as the Emperor of Man. Therefore, if you believe the Shaman theory, the Emperor is the physical incarnation of the Warp as it was, uncorrupted and pristine.

If you believe such things.

[Inquisitor_Domovoi]

This thread could almost be considered blasphemous