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I think this is where i should put this, anyway.
I have issues with the people who write the codecies (read my rantings berating them in general disscusion) but none the less i find myself forced to seek from the cavernous void of my dark angels codex clues on how to appropriately assemble a 'themed' army.
In this case my themed armey, rather than say the 2nd company ravenwing or the First Deathwing, I want to collect, paint/mod, and play a themed army based off the tenth company darkangels space marine chapter, and i need help understanding the subtleties and contradictions within Codex Dark Angels...
A brief overview, according to the chapter roster on the back cover the tenth company can have scouts, masters, and chaplains. Thats about it.
I have used the more developed roster of the tenth ultramarines company to get a feel for numbers and such, and decided it was a waste of time. Basically i am evenly distributing my scout forces between three types, assult, short-ranged mobile fire, long-ranged stationary fire (bolt pistols and CCweapons, bolters/shotguns, and snipers respectivly).
i am considering scouts on bikes but i am to cheap to buy any seriously right now.
Right now, my current dilema is the breakdown of my three HQ units. I figure since scouts are 'in-training,' or close to it having ample HQ support in the form of decked out command squads is acceptable. Also, i need to get some points in my army somewhere and i can sink alot into HQ. And,after all the tech marines and apothecaries have to get their recruits from somewhere too.
The |3itch of it is that since all HQ units have like 4 attacks standard, using command squads for fire support is a dumb idea, so they are all being fitted for close assult, small command squads with tricked out characters/sub-characters that are fighting machines. My reasoning is that the command squad has to be based on a tactical squad and they aren't great for assulting imho.
Also, command squad and character continuity is an issue. If you look at the codex only the specail characters and standard bearers have robes, as well as the generic 'robed' marines that are standard troops. DA techmarines, chaplains, and librarians come from the standard issue generic marine models, but their standard bearer has robes.
I think its pretty dumb to have a command squad full of 'standard' looking marines, and then have one character and a standard in robes.
One way to fix this is to custom MOD my own 'robed' people, which is doable. For instance a standard medipack and the reductor bit[z] from the BA honor gaurd set ought to fix nicely on a generic robed marine.
Here is my question, when is it appropriate (as far as fluff is concerned) to create such Modifications? I'll give a brief list of my conclusions but I would welcome feedback and suggestions.
1. Techmarines come from the chapter armoury, since robes signify inner circle and the armoury isn't a part of that it SEEMS that no matter what, a DA tech marine will never wear inner circle robes.***
2. Inner circle robed figures are supposed to be from the inner circle so haveing a command squad based on a tactical squad made of robed marines would escape my reasoning altogether. Inner circle also implies veteran status. Therefore it seems if i upgrade apothecaries and standards and sergeants with terminator honors (the standard mark of a veteran) then they could and should wear the robes, but not the rest of the non-characters in the squad.
3. A possible exception to the above that might occur is that if the command squad was accompanying a librarian (specifically the specail character in robes)-(librarians are exclusivly inner circle, so whenever they appear it would seem they are 'on lone' to the company using them). One could reason that a librarian would choose a personal command squad and use the same one all the time, if this were the case then it could make sense that the librarian chooses his command squad from troops already in the inner circle. Then you would have a robed librarian and an entire command squad of robed marines (barring the tech marine at least) and as far as fluff is concerned it MIGHT make sense.
4. Veteran sergeants, and veteran sergeants inducted into deathwing but assigned to other companies are a stumbling block for me. The cause of it all is with the good veteran sergeant Naaman, who happens to both wear scout armour and be part of deathwing. Naamans only noticeable modeled on 'innercircle/deathwing' status is a small DA pendant on his back, and a cape that when painted by GW people tends to be white, as opposed to the camo capes worn by snipers.
Naaman being the only deathwing/inner circle scout sergeant already modeled presents a problem for me when modeling other veteran sergeants and veterans of deathwing who happen to lead a scout squad.
One side benefit is that my current 'Master' of the company (the tenth DOES have a master according to the roster in the back of the codex) has a similar, if longer, cape to Naaman that i painted white and Masters are innercircle/deathwing. this means i possibly don't need to worry about representing robes on my master because Naaman sets up precident for the Tenth company to use cape in place of robes. (however, if thats the case then everyone has to have capes, not robes, and i really like my Master the way he is, and i don't want to turn him into a lowly 'leader' but i may have to)
Also note that for scouts full-blown robes would get tangled as they infiltrated and went through wooded areas and such so it also happens to make sense that scouts from the inner circle do this, but does it hold over for my current Master?
*** Except that parts of the inner circle are interspersed throughout the chapter in the form of interigator chaplains, Masters, and deathwing veteran sergeants, so it could be this spreads into the armoury as well, as long as the tech has terminator honors making him veteran maybe it could be done, i dunno.
I'd love to see your scout army once it's completed. Your whole army can use the infiltrators rule!
ANYWAY... The reason Techmarines and Apothecaries can't be bought as special DA variants is because they are a completely different 'breed' of marines. They are made from the same gene seed and have the same basic scout training as other marines but then they are taken away to complete their specialised training elsewhere. Because of this GW kinda assume that all Techmarines and Apothecaries kinda follow the guidelines of their training
However, this wouldn't necessarily mean that they wouldn't throw on a robe when they get back home to Caliban. I like the idea of Techmarines and Apothecaries wearing robes and I'm sure it would look exellent with a little conversion here and there (don't forget the Apo's medi kit on his arm).
As for the colours of these guys I think it would be cool if their robes matched the robes of everyone else but their armour was the right colour of Techmarines and Apothecaries respectively.
As for your captain, this guy has to be old and covered with cruxes and stuff. The position of captain of Tenth Company is one of the highest honour an old veteran can have and is only given to the best of the best among the older marines. Give him terminator honours (or even a suit of termy armour!) and make him look old and respected.
8O Seriously? 8O The captain of the tenth is actually a position of honor rather then a back water assignment for newbie captains? Kickass!
I hadn't really thought of giving my captain terminator armour. Since the first company is all terminators i had the logical phallacy of assuming then that all terminators were therefore first company.
Hey, maybe i could see if they have bitz of older armour varients, like pre-mark-6 and use them for some cool parts on the old captain.
Anyway, I love the suggestion for the really old kickass captain covered with honors and stuff, my current company master just got demoted . I just hope my moding skills can do it justice.
I don't know how good you are with green stuff but you could try to make robes with that.
Ze titles yez...
When in doubt,
Smite.<SilverMane> I would trust BID with my life
<SilverMane> HEIL BID!
<Adrian-> BiD is Omnipotent; All Knowing, All Powerful!
<Scary_Troopers> I see you as an optimist, GT. : D
But what of the midgets!?
=]Front in favour of Moderation of the Harshest kind.[=
Personally I'm not sure if I would put your captain in termi armor, but then I have the advantage of already knowing all of your current plan... I think it might be worth it to keep the captain in a Razorback or Rhino or some such so he can keep up with the scouts. I'm just picturing the captain in the back of a transport in the middle of no where, with his command squad members acting as battle coordinators and looking at a map trying to figure out where his troops are, where they should go, etc. Since the scout company would probably be more dispersed than most companies during its engagements, it would make sense to keep him mobile. Also, since he'll be behind enemy lines, a transport allows him to move a lot to avoid enemy strikes/artillery fire or all out enemy attacks. Also then on the actual battlefield in the game he can move up to support the forward scouts more quickly. Maybe throw in a predator or two with him to give yourself an armored rapid support contingent which can deploy in support scout squads that need it. But enough of that...
But for the idea of tricking him out and making him look old and honored, I think it'd be awsome. If you wanted to get really fancy you could throw on a studded left shoulder pad, mk6 or earlier armor, etc. It'd be pretty cool. I also think BobaHat's idea of putting the techmarine and apothecary in robes with white robes and standard techmarine and apothecary armor is really cool too.