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I'm currently elaborating the fluff for my Death Guard army and there are some things that I need cleared up for me. As this site seems to have the best fluffmasters, I'll give you all a crack at it.
#1. What was the organization scheme for the pre-Heresy Adeptus Astartes Legions? If the answer is they are all different, then how were the Death Guard organized before the Heresy.
#2. Are Imperial armies transported aboard war ships such as battleships and cruisers, or transported on transport ships and then escorted by warships? I believe I know the answer to this one but I'm just making sure. Can transport ships land on planets and lift off, or do they have to use smaller landing ships?
#3. How are Titans transported around the galaxy? How are they deployed on planet and how are they lifted off planet? Can Titans be rapidly deployed?
#4. Are void-shields on ships what protect them from daemonic invasion in the warp? If their void shields are destroyed will they be invaded by daemons in the warp? How do void shileds work anyway? Do they hold atmosphere like in that Fire Warrior game?
#5 How, if at all, do raiding parties on Boarding Torpedos escape from enemy ships. How many troops does a Boarding Torpedo hold?
#6. Do Dreadclaw assault boats also function as drop pods?
#7. How exactly do boarding actions take place?
I have more questions than these, but I figured being a nurgle devotee 7 is the magic number. Answers to any or all of these questions would be appreciated.
#1: The Death Guard was almost exclusively composed of foot soldiers. During the Heresy, it never had more than seven companies, but they were far larger than those of other chapters, with a prominence of simple tactical squads and Terminators. They had no Assault squads or even Tactical squads, for that matter; they all had True Grit. They rarely used tanks or transports, preferring instead to footslog it. Troops were emulations of their sergeants, who were extensions of their captains, who were extensions of the Legion Commanders themselves, in a very similar way to the Emperor's Children.
#2: Space Marine Chapters make use of Battle Barges, which in the days of the Heresy were manned by a thousand Marines each. At present, even the First Founding Chapters will have no more than three or four. There are also smaller Strike Cruisers, transporting presumably a company-sized number of troops. As far as my knowledge, these craft cannot make a safe landfall: this is done using the famous Thunderhawk Dropship, which is much smaller.
#3: Titans get an entire ship to their own. They can be deployed rapidly, through the use of specially crafted Titan Drop Pods. The only known large-scale use of these pods was during the Heresy itself. But, given their size, transportation would naturally be cumbersome.
#4: Don't know much about Void Shields. Some sort of high-tech shield that can only be used on large targets due to powering reasons - it needs a big battery.
#5: A Boarding Torpedo is essentially a drop pod designed to attack enemy ships. They are shot out at high speeds to attack the hull, often fitted with drills or explosives to punch a suitable hole. They are dangerous to use, like a normal drop pod. Treat them as such. As for escape: there is none. Boarding torpedos are single-use-only. You take over the ship or die in the attempt.
#6: Yes. They are called assault craft for a reason. Unlike boarding torpedos, these can retreat. I think.
#7: Exactly as they would take place in normal ship-to-ship combat. There would be an opening salvo to weaken the defences, the attacking ship would move closer, ensure there is no resistence in the way of gun turrets, and begin an assault via boarding torpedos and other such boarding craft. Like pirates swinging between ships on, only slightly more high-tech.
#1. Even before the Heresy the DG were tough mf's. They were mostly infantry. Think of them as heavy foot soldiers. As ze_poodle I believe there was about 7 companies. But each one consisted of many thousands of marines.
#2. The DG, like most SM legions, had their own fleet of warships. Consisting of a few huge battle barges, capital ships, strike ships, escorts, heavy troop carriers, titan carriers, and the like. They could deploy via shuttle, drop pods, thunder hawks, teleportation, giant transport ships landing on the planet, etc.
#3. The titans had their own ships. Very heavily armored and protected of course. They can be deployed reasonably quick considering the monumental task of landing these god-engines. Think of the biggest hanger you've ever seen, quadruple the size and quadruple the thickness, add armorments, add wings, and landing equipment. That would give you a general idea of those ships. The huge ships themselves would land and deploy the titans, and shuttle them off after the battle.
#4. Void shields are used on ships, titans, vast cities, etc. They are powered by plasma generators/engines. Think of them as shields that cut through the very air/atmosphere itself (hence the name) and can with stand heavy punishment. On ships the shields are incredibly thick, some ships have more than one. They protect the ship from enemy fire and keep daemons out. If the shields went down the daemons could then try to rip the hull open to get at the tasty morsels inside. This is assuming the ship didn't drop out of the warp immediately, which is what any sane commander would do. Void shields are used in smaller versions on titans, powered by the plasma engine within the titan. They have multiple layers of the shield. The emperor class titans have the most. They can withstand enemy punishment but can be dropped by continuous heavy fire or enemy titan weapons. Hence the multiple layers. Void shields can be recharged and brought back up however, it just takes caring amounts of time.
#5. A Boarding Torpedo is like a drop pod but with a huge plasma cutters/melta charges on the front. It travels at high speed towards the target. Some pods are shot down by the enemy ship's defense lasers but are generally small enough to not get shot at by anything else. The space marine variants are equipped to carry a squad each. The pods hit, blow a hole in the ship, and release the cargo. They are one-use-only however, and the marines better complete the mission or take out enough defense lasers to be picked up by thunder hawks.
#6. Yes. They are used like boarding torpedoes and like regular drop pods. Hence are more versatile. Once on the ground the drop pod's iris hatch opens and the troops/dread comes out. The four claws then extend, driving the body upwards, enabling the cargo to go charging off into battle. The Dreadclaw (unlike its imperial counterparts) can lift off again. So it can be used to extract troops as well as drop them or it can return to space, be re-fuelled and sent down with more troops.
#7. This can be done a variety of ways. The most common is when basically the attacking ship would be closing with the enemy ship while exchanging fire with it. Then the attacker gets along side the enemy ship and launches more fire to cripple any defense batteries it can. Then the boarding torpedoes/assault boats are launched along with several decoy (empty) ones and sometimes some real torpedoes in order to mask the approach of the troops carriers and help them to not get shot down. Another way would be just like before only thunder hawks are launched. This can be done from further away as thunder hawks have longer range than pods. Or it could happen other ways. Some chaotic ships have specially designed prows that ram an enemy ship (or grab it in it's jaws) and disgorge troops that way.
*Gasps* That is a healthy chunk of fluff knowledge you just received! I need a drink... Hope youâ€™re grateful. lol :cool:
Lol.. yes Beastxxx, I am grateful to the fluff masters for pouring out their wisdom upon me. Most of my questions have been answered completely, but on some of them I require further depth.
On question #1 the 7 company organization helped out a lot. Does anybody know how many DG there were at the time of the Heresy specifically? Also, I'd like to know their particular organization scheme, you know, how they subdivided their Legions into smaller units. I heard that Legions were subdivided into regiments, and then companies were below that, and that every 3 companies had a commander, and each regiment had a commander. I take it that you mean that the DG had 7 regiments of 7 companies each? If anybody knows this it would help out so much!
On question #2 I know that modern Space Marines have their own ships and these are used for rapid deployment. But its my understanding that the old Legions simply used the ships of the line for their battle barges and strike craft. Do these ships, such as Desolator Class Battleships and such have the same capabilities? Also, other than marines, what about Imperial Guard? Are they transported on board cruisers and battleships or in transport craft?
Thanks a lot!
There was never any info on DG that went that specific. All we know is that there were 7 companies of varying thousands of troops each. They were subdivided further as you mentioned but I cannot think of a publication that narrowed it down to the depth you want. Maybe way back in the day, but if not then, there never was anything that specific im afraid. The WB had over 100,000 marines, WE had the most marines (right behind ultras) I believe. Especially since most of this fluff is shrouded in mystery there is no way to tell you specifically how many DG there were.
As to ships, the old legions commandeered the biggest and baddest ships of the day for their own use. There are few ships around now-a-days in the Imperium that are as big and fast as they were back then. These ships were just as, if not more than, capable of rapid-strike and deployment as ships today. I believe you may have read "Storm of Iron"? They didn't do too much on the detail of the ships but it did remark on the super-fast deployment of the invasion forces. It specifically said that this deployment would put any imperial commander to shame. Back then the imperial guard forces were deployed via their own transport ships. They also had their own defense ships as well. Very rarely would they share the same ships as the marines themselves. However this was all under the command of the supreme space marine commander in the area. Back then the highest ranked marine commander had over-all command of all imperial forces in the area.
Didn't you mention you had some more questions? *cracks knuckles* bring em' on! :cool:
P.S. Hey poodle, I just hade a crazy idea. Want to make a fluff masters clan? Kinda like those Aussies in "The Anzac Clan". It could be us and a select few individuals who really know about fluff (and who pass a grueling fluff test to get in) lol. :cool:
I agree with you on the general ability of the pre-heresy warships/transports compared to more current models, but I believe that has more to do with the age of the current crop of warships (averaging several thousand years old), and the relatively low level of training. Similarly, the fleets that the chapters still control (battle barges and strike cruisers) still operate at a peak level of efficiency compared to standard battlefleets. As far as the organization of the enemy landing goes in Storm of Iron, my impression was that was more due to the planning skill of the Iron Warriors than necessarily the speed of the transports in question. Which to me would make sense considering that the Iron Warriors are still the foremost siege engineers in the galaxy.
It was a mix of both. You have to have the right equipment if your going to be that damn good. And do you think the IW would be using some junky ships? I don't think so, they'd have the top of the line ships to compliment their strategic genius in siege warfare. :cool:Originally Posted by Lord_Wallace
I can't remember what Black Library book it's in (but it's in the Eye of Terror novella we got in WD), but it makes mention of something like Giger shields to keep dĂ¦mons out. I don't think that was what they were called, but they're named after their inventor/discoverer, and his name began with a G, I think.
The old IG had their own transports, yes, but since the Heresy have had to rely on the Navy to get them from place to place. From what I gather they travel onboard BFG-style ships (Gaunts Ghosts use the frigate Navarre, for example, which I think is Sword class), and then deploy from drop ships, which I'd imagine are similar to assault boats.
Boarding craft I think are designed to clamp onto a ship and burrow through the hull, and have retros to enable them to return to their home ship. But I'm not certain on that one.
Long time no see Xerxes. Yes that's one style of boarding craft. There are a few. Dreadclaws, boarding torpedos, thunderhawks, other kinds of craft, and all manner of wierd chaos inventions. Also, your right, there is a another shield specifically designed to keep daemons out. Along with all manner of wards and anti-daemon stuff. The void shields I mentioned are just protection from whatever tries to breach the hull, be they daemons or torpedoes.
We could so do that. Let's tell Grephaun.Originally Posted by numberofthebeastxxx