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about the untouchables (the ones with no/negative presence in the warp)....
are they just a "natural" mutation...were they "planned" by the old ones? that would be strange for a psyker race (humanity) to develop the ultimate anti-psyker, wouldnt it?... or are/were they somehow connected/made by the C'tan, since they use them for their Pariahs..
There isn't really a right or wrong answer to this question, seeing as the information that GW has provided on this subject is always based on the point of view of the source.
The best source on the untouchables (by which of course you mean the Pariah Gene) is in the Necron Codex, regarding some speculation by an Eldar Farseer about the Culexus Assassin. He muses how the following the loss of the old ones and fighting with the Necrons, the 'lesser creations of the Old Ones' (in this context humanity) had developed in underforseen ways. He speculates that Humanity with it's fears and racial beliefs is basically a crop sewn by the Necrons before they went asleep. The Farseers belief was that there was a purpose to the Pariah gene here (probably to combat the psykers that caused them to go into stasis in the first place) and that now that they had awoken, a harvest was being prepared.
Yeah, the Pariah Gene is actually fairly confusing. Was it a plant or was it a natural occurance?
The human race is the most genetically diverse in the galaxy, apparently. Humans have all kinds of strange adaptations to deal with the universe. The psyker gene, the pariah gene, and the navigator gene are all curious mutations of the human genome. There are only three four that these mutations could have found their way into humanity.
The first is genetic manipulation from the Old Ones, making Humanity one of the many races in the galaxy to be seeded by the Old Ones in order to be used in the war against the Necrontyr and the C'tan. The Old ones are definately behind the Eldar, and most likely behind the Orks, and probably some other creatures like the Hrud and Jokaero. These races show definate genetic tampering in their genomes. The eldar all have a psyker gene and its all the same, and it looks very tacked on. The Orks have a section of algal DNA tacked onto their DNA. The Hrud are born with an inherent knowlede of how to build weapons that use Warp Energy. The Jokaero build weapons and starship and yet have no recognizable intelligence, they seemingly do so because knowlege of how to build things is instinct programed into their DNA. But if the Old Ones put these genes into humans, it had to have been LONG before humans existed. The last Necron purge of the galaxy coincides with the last mass extinction on Terra, the one that took the dinosaurs. That gene modification would have had to be placed into a small rodent that they knew was going to evolve into us. Not likely at all, especially since all the other genetic manipulation they did was on the fully evolved, although primitive, creature.
The other theory is the Necrontyr modified our genes to harvest some several million years in the future. Also not very likely as this has the same difficulties as the Old Ones theory, and there is no evidence that the C'tan or Necrontyr had the technology to implant genes. If they did, then instead of being so frustrated with their short lives, theyd just give themselves eternal life genes stolen from dead Old Ones. Also, why would the C'tan give humans psyker genes?
The third idea is a little of both. But like I said, either race would have to have planted the genes into humans before there were ever humans.
The last theory, and the one I believe, is that it is the result of just random mutation. Due to warp and radiation exposure, the human genome has too many mutations to list here. The Navigator Gene, the Psyker Gene, and the Pariah Gene could have all just been the result of random human mutation instead of some kind of genetic tampering. Most of our mutations are worthless, but a handfull of them have turned out to be quite useful, both to us and to other races.
I sincerely doubt, if the Pariahs aren't a naturally occuring mutation, they were seeded by the old ones. I believe I read somewhere that the old ones were a psychic race themselves, and hence would probably find the Pariahs repulsive. That and the sheer 'unaturalness' (the reason they are considered abominations) of Pariahs seems to indicate they probably don't have a role in some benign plan for humanity.
The only ones I'd entertain are..
A. The mutation arose naturally, as an unexpected consequence of human development, or perhaps the old ones made a mistake.
B. The Pariah gene was introduced to humanity by the C'tan thousands of years ago, as part of paving the way for their eventual dominance of the galaxy. This seems to me the most compelling and interesting. The C'tan hated the old ones, so the idea of the star gods wanting to twist their creations into forms more useful to them seems very ironic and appropriate.
Last edited by The_Giant_Mantis; August 4th, 2005 at 14:16.
There is of course, the "religious" reason: Untouchables have no souls. Since all souls are connected to the Warp, and psychic energy flows from the soul, the soulless Untouchables are immune to all that jazz. This is believed to be penance for some sin in a previous life. There is a bit of fluff about a Culexus who was born from a corpse that had died a day beforehand; he dug himself out of his mother's womb. That kind of birth holds all sorts of nasty superstitious connotations.
The scientific reason is that their brain contains an extra portion that emits the equivalent of a light EMP pulse, mildly disrupting electricity: not like turning off the lights, but like affecting bio-electric currents through the brain. The brain is important for obvious reasons, which is why Untouchables are so ostracised. People feel vaguely uncomfortable around them and often complain of headaches. Psykers absolutely detest them: the stronger your link to the Warp, the more repulsive a soulless being is.
It's a definite mutation. The Pariahs are a new addition to the Necrons. It's more likely that, instead of the Necrons creating Untouchables, the Pariahs were created once an Untouchable was discovered. They are said to be "the next stage in the Necron development" implying that Pariahs are, essentially, what the Necron race wants to be. Soulless.
Indeed my personal belief of what GW is hinting at is that humanity itself a creation of the Old Ones, but after their departure the Necrons did some tinkering. The remarks by a C'tan saying something like 'your church to the machine, your worship of the corpse are excellent, you will make excellent subjects' are I think the most telling, man was a crop sewn before the Necrons went asleep, now the harvest is being prepared. The Culexus/Pariah gene was the most important part of that crop, in that is a way of preventing what happened last time (the arrival of new species connected to the warp e.g. Eldar etc) that was a major blow to the Necron's ambitions. So basically the constant appearance of both the psker gene and the Pariah gene are relics of the ancient fight between the two, and hence the inherent distaste both have for the other.
The pariah gene is specifically stated in the necron codex as being planted within humans, although its vauge as to who. My understanding was that it was the C'tan who inplanated the pariah gene while the were completing their great work, but before they went into hibernation. I guess they figured it would be a stopgag to the enslaver plauge when the C'tan would awaken. Actually the Necron codex provides most of the information on this subeject. Such as the reason humans and eldar fear death is because the Nightbringer planted those thoughts inside us milions of years ago. Let me list out the races known to be created by the old ones:
Korks- orks (escaped the nightbringers fear of death actually)
and quite a few others
Listening to everyone, i have some important issues to raise. I may be missing something here but I find it hard to discern how the C'tan will benefit from introducing the Pariah gene into the human genome.
Firstly, if the purpose was to eliminate the human races psychic potential significantly or altogether in order to defeat them, then this creates an extremely serious situation for the C'tan themselves. From all I've read of Pariahs, they are single minded automatons, in the sense that, they are basically programed for a specific task and nothing else matters. This ties directly into the fact that the C'tan feed on human emotions do they not? The Nightbringer seeded fear and misery into the human race becauses he relishes it, it supports his being basically. The Jackal God wrought confusion because it's his nature. A Pariah, soulless being, lacks any emotion, any real feelings. They do not care if they get hurt or die, no pariah I ever heard of feels fear. So how can the C'tan benefit significantly from curbing humanities psychic potential? If they are to be successful, they would have to eliminate the Eldar, Humanity and Chaos. That would only leave the Tau, Tyranids and Orks (who are immune to their influence). I cannot see it.
On another note, why humanity? They are young, babies, in terms of the development of their psychic talents. Why not the Eldar? A race that has supreme mastery of their psychic talents. I have not seen anything saying the Eldar are affected, someone with information otherwise could correct me.
In fact, how do the C'tan reason? If you're combating one race that has supreme psychic mastery and another that will one day be the psychic epitome of all races, why not introduce the Pariah gene wholesale into your own race? I do know that the Necrons possess Pariahs, but they are rare, they count as elites. To curb such races' pyschic ability/potential so significantly is almost impossible. Then theres chaos, shouldn't chaos be the top priority of the C'tan who ARE the warp.
Ok so someone explain it to me. The Deceiver for example relishes in the fact that humanity is it's plaything, it toys with them and breaks their will and then devours their "essence". Making an educated guess, "essence" used in that term means soul. So if the psyker gene is eliminated and the pariah gene (implementing soullessness) becomes wholescale, then aren't they dooming themselves?
Hmm the Nightbringer feeds on misery and fear, so soul, no such feelings exist, right? He feeds on the death cries of his victims, but a pariah doesn't know fear, he doesn't know what that is.
So I'm missing something. Fluff masters do your duty.
if i have understood everything i ve heard/read so far right, the untouchables are very able to have emotions...(eisenhorn novels?!)
i always thought of the c'tan and their "feeding of the essence" is more like they are sucking/feeding of the bioelectrical energies or the bodies own electromagnetic field, changing its "taste" by inducing the preferred emotion into the victim.
its the same with the animals we eat...for us the taste of the meat can be spoiled, if the animal released great amounts of stresshormones bevore death because of fear or some strong emotion.
now, if we'd have the senses for it (would be a c'tan) we would surely taste a difference in the above mentioned essence/field whatever.
i just dont think they eat the soul..its too much chaos to do that...the c'tan are after all the energies of the human body of this reality, the warp part (soul) belongs to others.
am i making sense?
Indeed, basically I think it makes sense only if you embrace the point of view that:
a/ Life energies and Soul are two seperate concepts.
b/ Those with the Pariah gene are not literally 'without a soul', just are called soulless for the effect that they have upon creatures.
One particularly strong arguement that argues against the C'tan eating souls is the fact that the sarcophagus's which sustain them are (according to Nightbringer) sustaining them with tasteless energies. This begs the question how to this machine sustain a creature that feeds upon souls, and for that matter, how does a star? I think the C'tan feed upon the 'life energy' but not the soul (in the warp sense).
So back tracking slightly, it does make sense that they have created the Pariah gene to combat the Psyker gene. C'tan can feed upon humans quite happily without them being psykers, but the ability of psykers to use their connection to the warp being originally a mechanism built in to combat the Necrontyr means they want to destroy this relic of the Old Ones. Therefore use of such mechanisms to cut down the pskers in the species ostenably prevent a return of the problems experienced last time, but don't interfere with the 'rank and file' of the species, leaving an ample food supply.