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Alright, this is something I’ve been wondering about for a while and was reminded of while replying to another thread. Don’t worry, I do get the whole ’Chaos Marines are Marine corrupted by Chaos!!11!!eleven!!’ thing, that’s not what I’m asking about. When reading novels or especially short stories about Space Marines, the plot is often centred on the Chaotic corruption or attempted corruption of loyalist Marines; what the stories almost never mention is what happens afterwards (except for the few cases when a loyalist turned traitor actually manages to turn loyalist again before dying heroically and thus redeeming himself in the eyes of the Emperor, his fellow Marines and/or any beautiful Battle Sisters hanging around to lament his passing.)
Say we’ve got the average Brother Joe of any generic Chapter you might think of. He’s been so unfortunate as to be corrupted by one of the four Chaos powers and is now about to start his new life as a Chaos Marine. For this to happen, though, he’ll first need a fashion make-over; the Imperial Aquila is so last millennium in the Eye of Terror even Typhus wouldn’t be caught dead wearing it. So what does poor Brother Joe do? Does he adopt the insignia of whatever Legion happens to be responsible for his corruption? Will be impress his new allies with his creative design skills and make himself a brand new colour scheme with plenty of Chaotic symbols? Or will he simply keep his former Chapter’s colours and paint over the Chapter marks to denote his status as traitor?
Also, Brother Joe will need to join some form of battle force in order to fight against the weakling Imperium of Man. Do you think he will be accepted by those who corrupted him and become just another battle brother of this or that Legion, will he join other loyalists-turned-traitors in a special battle group, or will he be forced to serve at the bottom of the hierarchy of Chaos Marines, disrespected by everyone until he can prove his worth and fight his way up to a higher position? Will he seek out others traitors of his former Chapter, or shun them?
So, what do you think? After the whole corruption issue has been dealt with, how does one actually become a Chaos Marine? Surely some changes or transformations must take place. Might there be an initiation? A test? Perhaps a multiple choice quiz? Any ideas are welcome. ^_^
"Girls are nice and cuddly on the outside, and freaky on the inside." ~ Lost Nemesis.
Well i read dead sky black sun and in the book the iron warrior army captured gene seed, HTF does that happen, anyway they had priosoners (Women) being fed and supplied with all sorts of stuff and thery grew the marines inside of them like a baby but they were born with out skin so they had special factories where they skined the males and streched out the skin. (the women were called demacublas or something like that) Anyone who has read the same book please feel free to correct or add detail. So they then put the skin on them and that is how it happens.
I dont think they would need a test as they must have done some bad stuff or be an exceptional warrior to get the attention of a chaos space marine lord
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I'm not sure..
I'd imagine (with no proof or evidence) that the actual traitor legions are quite insular. They create their own marines, have long and distinguished histories, have each watched a thousand worlds burn, etc, etc, they're not going to want to hang out with growly the evil space wolf (especially not the thousand sons!)
I think a lot of 'newly corrupted' chaos marines will continue to work within their chapters for a while, attempting to lure others to their cause, slowly and insideously eating away at the chapter from within. Others might break off right there, and go solo.. The fallen, for example, tend to work alone, as far as I'm aware. A CSM doesn't need an army, it just helps.
Others, we know, join the red corsairs. Because the original red corsairs were so massively depleted with the destruction of their homeworld, they seem to like recruiting new chums. I'm not sure what happens to their armour in this case.. we've all seen the RCs in the book, with the red Xs, but then again, the 'chapter' has its own colour scheme as well. I guess it might be up to the individual, or maybe only the 'original' astral claws are allowed to wear their new colours.
It mentions in the 'rogue sons' article that most 'new corruptions' tend to recruit hordes of nasty snivelling humans to help them out. Forming cults and piratical warbands..
All in all, it sounds like jolly good fun.
Iâ€™ve read â€™Dead Sky, Black Sunâ€™ too. For an explanation of how Chaos Marines capture loyalist gene-seed you should read the prequel, â€™Storm of Ironâ€™, also by Graham McNeill. Very interesting and fluffy books, both of them. However, this wasnâ€™t really what I was asking about; I am wondering about loyalist turned traitors, not traitors who were born and bred traitors. Any interesting ideas about them?Originally Posted by Deek
"Girls are nice and cuddly on the outside, and freaky on the inside." ~ Lost Nemesis.
I'm not sure about the true heretic form of the chaos marines, but I know alittle about the traitor. These fallen have been sent through the warp like the other chapters, but they act differently. They still wear thier armour with the same scheems, believing that they are the only ones that can finish the revolution of man. They are independant to start, group up in little pirate clans, and maby even try to reform the chapter. They don't recruit, unless they can steal some gene-seeds from a marine supply depo. For those other guys (with thier spikes and blood and such), you should ask someone else.
I imagine that, considering Brother Joe's robust and durable Marine nature would allow him to at least survive and, with luck, escape the vengeance of his erstwhile brethren. As for better serving the ranks of Chaos, then it can be detailed as such:
1. If he was tempted by Chaos, then there must have been a tempter: he does not simply stand up and say "Gee, Khorne is looking pretty snazzy today" and become a berzerker. Most likely he'd been fighting Chaos one day, had an earth-shattering crisis of faith as a result of a build-up of anti-Imperial sentiment that had miraculously gone unnoticed by the Chaplain resident, and in a dramatic twist had deserted his brothers and gone chasing after the Chaos force responsible for his "enlightenment." He would then, presumably, attempt to join them and, after suitably proving himself - the test would vary depending on the legion's patron - he would be accepted as Ex-Brother Joe, Chaos Marine (in training).
2. He buggers off and makes his own little warband of miserable cultists. It's hard for the average civilian to tell the difference between a Chaos Marine and a loyalist, especially if the loyalist was only recently turned; he could easily masquerade as an Imperial, gathering a cult of witless fools who may believe they are doing the Emperor's work by raiding "corrupted" planets. It wouldn't be hard to corrupt them in turn, and if there was sufficient numbers, and if he achieved anything with them, then it wouldn't be long before the Chaos Gods (or at least a daemon prince) took notice and saw fit to give him a promotion, so to speak.
3. He takes the life of a sole traitor, wandering a long, lonely and very dark and miserable path through space to the Eye of Terror, there to discover the deeper meaning of Life and why exactly he's not comfortable wearing an Imperial aquila any more. He'd probably become something like a Byronic hero, all dark and malignant and horribly clichĂ©d.
As for armour, he could probably employ the use of his chainsword to remove Imperial heraldry, or a plasma drill if he can find one. A new paint scheme would be appropriate, something in black. At this early stage, he's most likely not bold enough to decorate himself with those flashy Chaos gimmicks, because that may look pretentious and bad replicas may invite the wrath of passing Word Bearers; advisably, he should aim for the sullen, exiled loner look, not good enough for the Space Marines and not corrupt enough for the Emperor's Children, but open to suggestions.
I've realised another reason I'm not sure about this.. Well, I did mention the thousand sons/space wolves, but as an expansion.Originally Posted by ze_poodle
The chaos legions have been fighting against their loyalist brethren for thousands of years. I don't think they're going to start hanging around with their former enemies.. well, I guess the Word Bearers and the Black legion might find it amusing. But such a being gaining status and recognition within the ranks of an organisation which has fighting against his original chapter for millenia on end? I'm not sure..
Also, I think you'd have to be pretty insane to want to join the Emperor's Children (that is, until you went through the brain surgery and painted your armour pink.. or were already a slannesh cultist and understood how cool it was.) They're just too far gone from what is 'normal.' To the outside world, they must look like screaming freaks. I doubt many of them are even very lucid, or can hold a conversation for more than a few seconds.
Several legions could actually come under that second category.
I'm personally not sure the original chaos legions take new recruits who have 'history' (though I fully accept I could be wrong.)
Last edited by The_Giant_Mantis; December 4th, 2005 at 22:12.
That would be the HUMAN emotion, to not ally with former enemies and suchlike, but as we are so often reminded, SM are not the least bit human and their thought process must be different, so allying with a former enemy may seem normal to them!
I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream. That's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight... razor... and surviving.
Technically, that's correct, but I'm not sure I get it. It's like saying 'humans, generally, do not run around naked, but since space marines aren't human, they must run around naked!'Originally Posted by attwoodc
You need to provide an example of why SM behaviour would allow them to ally with former enemies. It runs against everything they were taught as loyalist, and against the enormous hatred they feel for their loyalist comrades now they have turned to chaos.
Chaos marines don't see themselves as betrayers at all, they see themselves as having been betrayed by the Imperium in one way or another. If you ask me, that hatred isn't going to go away because a loyalist marine turns up and says 'look at me, I'm eeeevil!'
There is also the possibility that they were captured and corrupted, apparently the traitors have machines and rituals that can break down even the incredible faith of a marine.
I shall destroy all who stand in my way. The Emperor shall be reborn in me, the Primarchs shall be remade in me. I shall cast down the Dark Gods, the Star Gods shall be consumed just as they consumed their brothers. Those who fell shall be redeemed, those who remained pure shall be rewarded. The Imperium shall regain its power and the Dark Age of Technology will seem like nothing. For I am the Numen and I am coming