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This has been on my mind for a while.
In normal day life we have our psychotic/maniac/serial killers.
I assume there is at least something different in their brain than ours at the LO (I hope).
A common assumption is that this comes by brain damage. Well, Space Marines get stuff in their brain. Doesn't that mean...
I know that the librarians search the minds of the neophytes to make sure they are pure of mind, but there is a lot of transplanting at the brain going on. Is there a possibility that due some poking in the brain (lack of better term) there are marines with psychotic differences from the rest. Or are they just taken out of the training and turned into a servitor.
The question came to mind, because I want to write a little fluff about the strangest blood claw I have. He has a history of Battles in which he did the following => Stupidly druelling in a corner of the battlefield. Non-articulating trough a terminator homer so all termies end up being halfway in the woods killed.
What? Everyone should have his alter-ego positioned in his army. :w00t:
Aren't all marines homicidal killing machines?
No wait thats just the bloodclaws. Our favorite berserking loons. I say go for it, It's an imaginary world anyway, so you can tamper with it quite a bit and still stay within the "acceptable" boundaries. However, I think your alter-ego marine isn't so much insane as brain damaged. Maybe he got run over by a rhino an somehow survived, he's alright except for a slight problem with drooling and thinking faster than an stoned sheep. Lets just hope he doesn't become a skald. I'd hate to see the stories he'd tell.
P.S. Yeah, changed my list again... Grumble grumble grumble.
Gargrimz Green Deff
W:10 D:4 L:5
Well marines go through various brain-tampering procedures, that root out a lot of things, (like sexual appetites etc.) not to mention, as you said, they are screened before being inducted. Not just by the librarians, but also by various screenings of their mental health. Of course this varies between chapters. The flesh tearers for example, would consider a certain bloodthirstiness not necessarily a bad thing. The Ultramarines on the other hand, would find this character trait quite distasteful, and would either attempt to get rid of this through conditioning, training, or operating on the marines brain, or simply rejecting the applicant.
Rejects are more often than not turned into servants of the chapter. They maintain equipment, clean the bathrooms, wash the floor, clean the marine’s codpiece... etc. If they fail that, then they are turned to servitors...
You've just opened a huge can of worms, this is a big debate in abnormal psychology.Originally Posted by Wulfbanes
But you need to be more specific. Do you mean schitzophrenic marines, who would be quickly noticed and put down. Psychopathic marines.. who would probably do the job better for being psychopathic and suffer no visable ill effects.
Ultimately, all marines are the kinds of people who can blow a man's head off and not think twice about it. The difference between them and 'serial killers' is somewhat academic.
Most real world serial killers wouldn't fit the term 'maniac' at all.
Last edited by The_Giant_Mantis; June 2nd, 2006 at 21:13.
Apparently the psycho surgery the World Eaters used on their new recruits turned them into madmen.
Marines who are â€œjustâ€? crazy probably end up getting put down however a Marine who suffered mentally in the line of duty may well be tolerated.
Tychoâ€˜s extra fanatical hatred of Orks is probably caused by some psychological disorder but it doesnâ€™t get in the way on the battlefield.
thanks for all the replies so far!
I ment marines that just have something functioning out of order, like:
-passive (lol, marine saying: make peace, not war!)
My main questions are:
- Are marines capable of DEVELOPING some sort of psychological disorder.
- Can you give me examples of it (read: make up something weird and post).
- What do you think of me writing a short story about some marines in re-habilition class :lol:
Actually, Wulfbanes, brain damage does not usually make people psychotic, although it can change their personality. The psychiatric conditions you mention, psychosis and mania, are in most cases inborn or else caused by heavy use of drugs or a massive psychological trauma. As Mantis says, I doubt a person with so severe disorders would ever be chosen as an Astartes initiate, let alone be able to function as a soldier; in fact, without treatment, I doubt they could even function as normal human beings! Itâ€™s true that psychotic persons have been known to kill other people, but in fact they always kill in self defence in response to frightening hallucinations and delusions. A psychotic soldier or Space Marine would be as likely to kill his fellow Marines as the enemy.
Psychopathic Marines, though, as Mantis says, are a far more likely possibility. In fact, I would go so far as to say the majority of Marines are actually psychopaths; their lack of empathy for ordinary human beings is notorious, and they are marked by a significant emotional deficiency and consider themselves superior to others because of this, which are typical symptoms of psychopathy. On many occasions Marines come across as utterly psychopathic in the fluff. However, psychopaths are not insane or mentally disabled in any way, unlike actual psychiatric patients. Theyâ€™re extremely rational thinkers and usually rather intelligent, traits that would work well for them on a battlefield.
As for what would happen to Marine suffering some damage that would make him psychotic, Iâ€™m guessing he would be killed or turned into a servitor provided the mental disorder wonâ€™t affect his ability to function as one such. No sane commander would allow an uncontrollable soldier on the battlefield, especially not a Marine commander. Itâ€™s simply too big a risk.I think most Marines feel something akin to bloodlust, even non-Blood Angels. In tie with their psychopathic behaviour theyâ€™re unusually aggressive and furthermore indoctrinated to believe fanatically in their right to kill others if they wonâ€™t submit to the Imperium.Originally Posted by Wulfbanes
However, I donâ€™t think youâ€™d ever see a Marine suffering from any of the other symptoms you mention. Staring into space and drooling is either a sign of someone being pathologically introverted or else unable to control their facial musculature due to nerve or brain damage, and neither would be good on a battlefield. As for Marines being schizophrenic, I very much doubt it for the same reasons as stated above; schizophrenia is a disorder defined by repeated psychotic episodes and is very difficult to treat. And why would anyone want passive Marines? :blink:Marines are probably capable of developing a psychological disorder either through brain trauma or massive psychological trauma, say, if a powerful daemon started seriously messing with their minds.Originally Posted by Wulfbanes
Space Wolves do seem to suffer from a form of multiple personality disorder in that they believe they gain a separate â€˜wolfâ€™ spirit during their initiation which can give them extra strength and endurance, but also drive them to the brink of bloodlusting madness (and sometimes over the brink, in which case we get the Wulfen â€“ however, not even the Space Wolves allow these insane monstrosities to remain alive, not since the 13th Company.) Blood Angels and their Successors also suffer from a kind of psychosis, since they experience hallucinations of their Primarchâ€™s final battle against Horus â€“ however, as said above, theyâ€™re as likely to kill their brethren as they are to kill the enemy, which is why theyâ€™re either allowed a worthy death in battle as members of the Death Company, or else locked up in the Tower of Angels.
As for rehabilitating Marines, I just donâ€™t see it happening. While itâ€™s true that some Blood Angels/Successors have actually made it through the madness of the Black Rage, they did so on their own, with little or no help from their Chapter. And the Black Rage is not a true psychological condition at all but a mythical, possibly psychic, curse-like affliction that can be starved off with prayers and meditation. Marines suffering true psychological disorders would probably be useless to their Chapter and disposed off. :hmm:
Of course, the Chaos Marines are all more or less insane. I think they would make for an interesting study in psychiatry!
"Girls are nice and cuddly on the outside, and freaky on the inside." ~ Lost Nemesis.
She knows her medical onions that Grephaun....
I think that Imperial Marines have pretty much been covered, but a theortical study of Chaos marines would be exciting. Feel free to correct me on any mis-used medical terms that follow...
Take the Emperor's Children for example, somehow the synaptic pathways of their senseory receptors have become connected to the various emotion areas in their brains. They react incredibly strongly to extreme external stimuli, typically in the form of acute pain or noises of high volume and frequency. Some people have summed it up as them having sensations of such intense pleasure that it directly feeds Slaanesh.
Now you have to wonder the kind of damage that a neural "chop-shop" like this in a marine's brain must do. Let alone the 10,000 years of pathological hatred for the Imperium fed from the maddening of the warp.
I'm going to get in over my head if I go on, this could be a very heavy topic, but very interesting .
One of a Space Marine's standard implants is a membrane placed on the brain that allows the Marine to enter suspended animation. If this malfunctioned or 'wired up' incorrectly then some sort of seizures could result--which, by this point in the induction process, the Apothecary would try very hard to cure or control rather than waste a promising, late-stage recruit.
Or is there something that triggers it? And have the Chapter's enemies figured out what?
"My tanks have names, my men have numbers." -Col. Edmund Grahvess, 23rd Kronecker Prison Guard
I personally see most noise marines as being much less lucid than other marines, even world eaters are at least normal outside of battle. I can't see noise marines doing much beyond gibbering and howling.Originally Posted by Will J
Incidentally, the synaesthesia effect and the amplified hearing were caused by Fabius Bile. He performed brain surgery on his legion to produce this effect.