Why did Horus ACTUALY fall?

[ze_poodle]

Originally Posted by Xerxes

They left out the warrior lodges!!!??? What kind of a blathering fool is Abnett?????

Horus turns to Chaos partly through pride, partly through frustration at the Emperor's distance from the Crusade, and partly because he was inducted, while recovering from illness on (Davin IV???), into a Chaos-worshipping warrior cult. As to whether or not the illness was Chaos-borne in the first place is up for debate. But it was the lodges that introduced Chaos practices into the Sons of Horus.

Well, yeah. The lodges are pretty much an integral part of the plot of the entire trilogy. Abnett works them in perfectly.

Go read the books before dissing Dan.

And, yeah, Lorgar had a lot to do with it. Trust a fanatical madman to turn the whole universe to daemon-worship.

It was more that Horus became steadily more and more irrational and illogical as time went on. He could still plan and plot his takeover, but he was succumbing to the failing of all men with peerless power; he lost the ability to critically analyse his thoughts and opinions from another perspective. He had subconscious doubt, but he refused to acknowledge it, believing that his reasoning was faultless.

One passage from the first Heresy book involves Horus (I think) contemplating whether or not the Emperor, being without equal in his power, is even capable of doubt. Since no-one is on the E's level, no-one can really criticise him. With an equal, the E has no-one to confide in for guidance. Horus was put in a similar position, but he did have doubt, and he was given someone to seek guidance from; the Chaos Gods, whose advice was to seize power himself, and therefore make the galaxy a better place.

[whitewolf1984]

Cool thanks all, so horus fell gradualy. :yes:

Ok so mostly Horus fell because he had doubts (In himself, the emperor, etc..) and he also fell little by little by the influence of the lodges. And these lodges grew like cancers on all the legions? or only on those that fell?

Hey just one more question where can I get all this original Fluff?

[Cheredanine]

the main original source of fluff on the Horus Heresey was the orriginal rulebook for Epic (called space marine at the time, it was set around the heresey), this was rapidly suplimented by the rule book for Adeptus Titanicus (again first ed) which was effectively a suppliment to the game, and a follow up book, whose name escapes me but whose cover was hardback and predominantly yellow with a red titan looking out over its left shoulder

[hotspike18]

You haven't yet read the Horus Heresy set? Uh, yeah, I'd read that...

[ze_poodle]

Originally Posted by whitewolf1984

Cool thanks all, so horus fell gradualy. :yes:

Ok so mostly Horus fell because he had doubts (In himself, the emperor, etc..) and he also fell little by little by the influence of the lodges. And these lodges grew like cancers on all the legions? or only on those that fell?

Hey just one more question where can I get all this original Fluff?

I'd really recommend you read both the Space Marine and Chaos codices - both of which give slightly alternate views of the Heresy - and the Warhammer rulebook, possibly even the earlier editions (the 3rd edition one I remember being very interesting and readable.) Then you should move on to the Horus Heresy books (at least the ones written by Abnett and Counter) and then you can form your own opinion.

Also consider the Index Astartes article for the Luna Wolves, available on PDF for download somewhere illicit and illegal if you can't find the WD issue it's in. I don't know, personally.

But yes, the way you describe it was the overall process.

[whitewolf1984]

Ok thanks all, I'll try to read all the original fluff, I already read all of the Horus Heresy. Now the WD might be kinda had seing as I live in a third world country (which sucks). But I'll manage.

I was asking because I felt that in the books his fall was kinda fast. Its like book one I love the luna wolves and their filosofy,the mournival, and specialy horus (and cptn Locken). Then out of the blue he starts being a real bastard <--- can I say that if not plz edit and sorry. Not to mention the istvan incident. And the dream secuence was cool and all but come on he came back as royal ass. And the whole lodge part was played from behind the sceens as locken is the main char. But I understand why he fell. I just hope they explain more on how the others fell. And in my opinion magnus got the shaft!

[Deek]

Originally Posted by whitewolf1984

And in my opinion magnus got the shaft!

Why does everyone say that. He used magic that the emperor warned him against. Bam heritic.

But the night lords. The empror used the night lords (who defeated their enemies through fear) to tame the sectors of space that the space marine legions couldn't conventionally.
And after seeing the monster that HE created he decided to have the night lord primarch (i just forgot his name argh) assassinated. SEVERAL TIMES. Finally the night lords primarch just gave up and let the assassin kill him, having foresight helps when you are fighting assassins. sorry its off topic

[NiteRabbit]

I think that Horus also came to resent the fact that he was being controlled by anyone very much through the course of that vision. The Chaos Gods showed him a vision of the future but conveniently forgot to tell him that this was only one version of the future, much less one in which he had actually betrayed the Emperor, thus moving the 40K timeline onto the the path that we all know and love. It's why, ultimately, Horus resisted becoming the pawn of any one Chaos God when he decided to turn and why, at the end of the vision the decision he makes is ultimately his own. Or, at the very least, he thinks it is.