Please see this thread to find out how to participate in Votewar: Teams. I want to stress to everyone that the mission means everything. He who stands the best way to score Victory Points should be the winner. Unless it's Night Fight, Rescue, or Patrol, all missions have the Gamma rules set.
Mission Type - Take and Hold (Neither dusk nor dawn will occur)
Dark Angels
Arkaan Adeodatus (Epistolary Profile)
Storm Bolter; Terminator Armor; Teleport Homer; Stubborn; Fear of the Darkness
-The marine team has four fast/infiltrating units to the necron teams three, as well as the marines having another unit that can also deepstrike so in the first few turns the marine team can get a better lead on completing the objective.
-That monolith is gonna be very deadly this time around, being able to perform both a tank and transport roll with very few units (that vindicator ranking very high as one of those units) being able to pose a serious threat.
-While that monolith potentially wreaks havoc, a few turns of conentrated fire form the vindicator and landspeeders (and deathwing members with assault cannons) the necron warriors will go down fairly fast and leave the remaining necrons with few units before phasing out.
The vindicator's gun is the most reliable means of killing a monolith in the game. str 10 rolling 2d6 & picking the best (and that does work against the monolith!) That and scatters still are likely to hit because the shere size of the mololith model.
Other than that the marines can focus fire to take squads out one at a time & focusing on one player at a time going for early an early phase out. Marines have the ability to out assault the necrons & with a good tool for killing the monolith, there is a decent chance that there will be no rescue for them.
I actually think it will be pretty close. . . but I do currently give the marines an edge.
If the darkangles/marines focused all there firepower on a single of the necrons it would 2000 points fighting 1000 points for the perposes of phase out.
This seems a massive advantage. You can cut 1/3 of your enemy army out of the fight simply be destorying 2/3 of it.
This point asside, marines can start with the objective, they are better in CC, and have good big guns.
The necrons dont seem like they will really be able to hold it the objective. Marines win.
With few high strength guns (5) able to kill the monolith (and then on 6's) it is relativly safe this game. It doesn't even need to deepstrike as the marines will be coming towards the necrons, it then sits on the objective teleporting warriors/immortals in if necessary.
With the ability of the wraiths to get a 2nd turn charge on just about anything (turbo-boost behind some LOS blocking terrain, next turn pop out and assault) they would be able to tie up/kill any squad camping in the enemy deployment (plasma cannon squads and even able to take out any of the assault squads (including the terminators) if they work together with the destroyer lord who will be right behind them)
The warriors march up the field close together, immortals taking out the real serious threat first (vindicator) and after that they can concentrate on the marines coming towards them. The monolith uses it's transport rules if any squads are unlucky enough to get into close combat and rapid firing that squad.
The infiltrating command squad can just cut a swathe through the necron warriors, with the multitude of power weapons just eating necrons alive.
Res orbs or no, there will be many unreclaimable corpses in the wake of that and the Termies.
That Dreadnaught looks deadly, drop pod just out of flux arc range, Multi-melta and Missile it. Meltagun in command sqaud and Powerfists in same and Scouts.
Not to mention Dread Powerfist with the venerable & Extra armour, gives it a nice chance to keep at it.
The general confusion will force the Immortals to focus on the near enemies, letting the Vindicator get a little closer (with proper use of cover), and then blast things to smithereens.
Wraiths are the biggest threat here. They'll swift their way across the enemy and rip asunder.
The monolith can bring them back if need be because of so many enemies starting right next to it.
All in all though, I say the Marines will win this one.
Monolith deep strikes into the middle of the board and safely sits there. From then it teleports every single necron squad (cept wraiths) into the center. I would be amazed if by the end the marines can even fit a model in 12" of the mid let alone win.
The necrons big weakness in this will be phase out but since some warriors can sit safely in reserve its going to be impossible to shoot them out before the vindicator dies and the wraiths are mauling things in cc.
Necrons will quite easily have every squad they own sitting on the objective. I can't say the same for the marines and the immortals should be able to at least blow off the vindis gun before it does TO much, at least before the monolith comes into play.
If marines try to pile into the objective gauss arc is going to be nasty. If not then particle whipping terminators.
The dreadnought won't do much. It will deep-strike up close then get rapid-fired off the board.
The necrons big weakness in this will be phase out but since some warriors can sit safely in reserve its going to be impossible to shoot them out before the vindicator dies and the wraiths are mauling things in cc.
No Necrons may start in reserves. Only Necron Warriors beyond the min FO requirements may do that, and neither list opted to take more than two units each.
ah yes my mistake, because of teams I briefly thought that only 2 troops choices needed to start (from either army) for some reason. Still gotta get my head around this votewar.
regardless my vote still remains with the toasters as they can still teleport.
With the infiltrating command squad they are getting too close to the wraiths & destroyer lord (who will wipe them off the table). With the infiltration, the wraiths are guarenteed a first turn charge and with 36 high strength/high initiative attacks (causes 15 wounds, so 5 dead marines. Not counting the destroyer lord going up against the captain which is wounding him on 6's) the command squad can't take the punishment.
After the command squad is taken out 2nd (if not 1st turn) then the wraiths & destroyer lord can concentrate on the other major threat: the terminators. As with the command squad the terminators won't be able to take the punishment of the all these attacks (not to forget the no-save-at-all-for-you destroyer lord, which combined takes out ~3.8 terminators.
With the monolith sitting ontop of the objective, the marines are severly hard-pressed to be able to take it back. Not being able to (well, not realistically) kill the monolith with shooting will hurt the marines as they try to get closer to it.
With the dreadnought deepstriking it will be lucky for it to last one turn after it lands.
The immortals should aim for the vindicator first, then the speeders, and then any juicy targets that get too close. With their range, the immortals should be able to take care of these with some casualties.
Over and over again I have seen a lucky krak missile shot take one of these down. Statistically is should take all of NORAD to knock a AV 14 vehicle down, but Murphy's Law trumps that over and over. The Necrons would have to concentrate on the vindicator to ensure it's survival. I garuntee you that it will be hiding and sneaking its way forward to put a big hole in the side of that living metal. I'd dedicate the wraiths and Destroyer Lord to taking it out ASAP.
Fallacy #2: Wraiths will slice and dice infantry squads.
Ok, again statistically 36 Str 6, I6 attacks is nasty. But against Marines that boils down to 18 hits, 15 wounds and 5 dead marines. Cool. Now lets toss in the Destroyer Lord. 3 WS4, Str 5, I4 attackes. Again, nasty. We'll round up and say he kills 2. 7 dead marines. Pretty good right? Well, only if all 9 Wraiths were one squad with the Destroyer Lord attached. The CC rules state that you must have one model in base to base contact for anybody in the squad to fight. Properly setup, I'd love to see this happen with 12 40mm round bases and a large flying base.
There are three kinds of lies: Lies, damned lies and statistics. Believe them at your own peril.
Now that I got that out of my system, I cast my vote for the Necrons since the large number of warriors plus res orbs, plus emergency teleporting means that shifting them off of the center of the board will be difficult. Blow up the Monolith if you want, that's a mighty big piece of wreckage to hide behind. I think the Wraiths and the Destroyer Lord will buy it eventually, but they will tie up alot of firepower doing it while the main Phalanx of Warriors and Immortals pours some withering fire into the small SM squads. One thing that Necrons can do is take a beating and dish it right back.
Misspoke there. You would need to have 1 Wraith from each unit in base to base contact plus the Lord. Still a challenge when you think about keeping formations tight and you throw in terrain and such. Just trying to keep it real.
I garuntee you that it will be hiding and sneaking its way forward to put a big hole in the side of that living metal. I'd dedicate the wraiths and Destroyer Lord to taking it out ASAP.
That's my biggest gripe about the first of the two Necrons lists. If the Destroyer Lord goes tearing off with the Wraiths, then nothing is left to protect the Warriors from losing their WBB rolls. If the Destroyer Lord stays with the Warriors to provide Ress Orb action, then the Wraiths are without backup and the Lord isn't making good use of his Destroyer Body.
Lucky for them, most of the Marine's firepower is centered around Plasma and Rending, which don't negate WBB.
Wait, so if the monolith isn't a big player and the marines are sitting on the objective on turn 1 why wouldn't the monolith just deepstrike on top of it and flux them? Plus if they are on the objective then that means the wraiths can get stuck in on turn 1 also. (18 inch charge range, terrain doesn't do anything to them). With a majority of LOS blocked, the warriors and immortals can then march up/teleport and take out anything threatening.
But after teleporting out necrons get the 1st rapid fire. The casualties the marines take from that means their return fire will be much less.
Take and Hold is played along the long table edges right? so odds are the board is 24-36" long. Infiltrating right on top of the center is highly unlikely as the wraiths can just deploy at the very front of their deployment zone.
As a general rule on infiltration. 2 opposing units deploying at the front of their respective deployment zones usually start about 24" from each other. Infiltration puts you at 19". It's bonus is NOT THAT BIG. Scouts is quite often better.
The termintors and the command squad + assault squad are superior to the wraiths in CC.
Take and Hold is played along the long table edges right? so odds are the board is 24-36" long. Infiltrating right on top of the center is highly unlikely as the wraiths can just deploy at the very front of their deployment zone.
There are no Deep Striking Necron units, with the sole exception of the Monolith, which doesn't care about plasma.
Secondly, even if Plasma Cannons did get kills on them, they don't negate the WBB, so they don't need to be near a Ress Orb, at least in those regards.
ok forged, somehow only 304 marines die but thats still a fair bit of points. Look at how few necrons die.
The demo cannon has a 1/3 chance of landing a solid hit on the monolith, not good. Even then it needs to KILL IT, if it doesnt do that rapid-firing toasters will get it. The monolith won't arrive until turn 2 or 3. More than enough time for the demo cannon to die.
The chances of a monolith getting hit are slim. 1/3 chance of getting a dead on hit. if it doesn't the monolith would be out of the centre and takes a wooping great str 5 hit, big deal. assuming that the monolith gets hit, the only thing thats going to really screw it over is destroyed. (it deep strikes to where it wants to be, stays there, so immobilised is effective, just gives a wooping great LOS blocker. Wpn destroyed is inneffective, doesn't work on the power matrix. stunned and shaken doesn't stop it from using the power matrix.) So, from that we can safely assume that a glancing hit will not do much to it. that gives a str 10 shot a 1/3 chance of a penetrating hit, not good. assuming that it does get a penetrating hit, itll need to get a 4+ to destroy it. add that all up, theres about a 1/18 chance of the cannon shot destroying the monolith.
Going by the assumption that the monolith will not be destroyed with ease, it is safe to assume that it can teleport all the warriors to it. couple that with the fact that they're all at the objective, and thats a lot of victory points.
There are still 9 immortals to shoot at the vindi before the monolith arrives.
(I think I said 304 marines die, I meant 3-4 )
I think 36-54 shots from the immortals is enough to at least blow off a vindis demo cannon.
Also why can't a monolith deep-strike forwards of the objective (opponents end of the 12") and teleport warriors there to rapid-fire the vindi if it has to. It can then use normal movement to get back to the objective.
The Demolisher Cannon can wreck either the Monolith or a big chunk of Necrons with strength 10. Your choice.
Infiltrators and Deep Strikers are really a key point in the Marines. They'll be on top of the Necrons and in CC before they know it. And they'll have the objective quickly.
So much AP2, its not funny...
Guhhh, Wraiths....they're nasty, but there aren't that many...
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