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I have a problem in that son is a big ork fan.
That said he's become very upset because everybody says orks are stupid and instrinsically hate humans to the point of bloody eviscerating violence.
Last night he said that dosnt like w40k anymore(panic). He has been playing ork fantasy and just started collecting 40k(omg)
What do I do ?????:w00t:
I managed to find the Blood Axe clan for him realizing that these orks were smarter and actually had been known to trade with humans, so I thought I had the problem solved.
Unfortunately someone has told him you cant play side by side (ally) with humans.
Is there any precendent that I cant use to allow this.
Myself being Blood Angels, I'm happy to ally with him at home but I need a solid argument at the club.
HELP ??!! My hobby depends on his (Dad and son thing):cry:
orks are out of date thats what you tell the little jerks who laugh at him. i play orks and only orks and its been that way for years the green skins are more chalenging to play as they have no shooting but can steal vehicles they have low initative but have lots of attacks
show me a list of what you own and your list and i will help in any way i can their arent enough ork players in the world and thats a shame its always fun to watch your boys blow up on the field i often find my self laughing at my self so get a sense of humor for now... the new codex is supposed to be here by november 07
But if you're playing a multi-player game, for instance a 2 versus 2 game, then there are no rules preventing Orks and Space Marines to fight next to each other. In fact, there are no rules for games of more than two players, at all.
So when someone says you can't do it, kindly ask them to show you a rule that says you can't play a multiplayer game allied with your son. I'll promise you they won't be able to produce such a rule. And quite frankly, if they're so petty as to keep you two from playing the armies you want, then they aren't worth the effort of gracing them with your company.
fluff wise orks dont ally with anyone amater of fact they fight each other i think thats what the guy was saying but thats just fluff and can be ignored
While you cannot actually combine races into one army (save for inquisition with other imperials but thats it) However there is nothing saying that you can't use "count as" models. I've heard about blood axe players using imperial guardsmen to represent grots, complete with a commisar as slaver and rotweiler as squighound. Do they have the same stats as guardsmen, of course not, but do they look the part? Sure do. (mind you these guardsmen looked pretty worn down and ratty but thats the creators choice)
As for an allied game with 2 vs 2, well as Caluin said, there are no rules gainst it. Actually I've had some rather perculiar alliances in my time. Space marines and tyranid vs orks and tau is just an example of how things can go.
Fluff-wise, blood axes will indeed work with renegade humans, though it is severely unlikely that any friendly interaction will occur with space marines. however fluff can be suspended for gaming, it's only really around for background enjoyment. And while I love fluff and discussing it's intricacies with my friends, I won't let it get in the way of a good gaming session.
Best of luck with your sons greenskins.
Gargrimz Green Deff
W:10 D:4 L:5
Orks get the rough deal on the 'image' front.
I think they're a fascinating race personally.
I love the way that, even though their engineering might not be up to degree standards, if they believe something will work, then it will work! Like painting their vehicles red which actually makes them go faster. How cool is that?
Also, don't forget the brain boys, who were some of the smartest minds in the galaxy. If you're still getting grief, then don't forget Ghazgul Thrakka or others either. They're amazing warbosses, they might not be intelligent in the Eldar hanky waving way, but anyone who belittles Ghazgul's intelligence or cunning does so at their own risk.
I dislike orcs and goblins - they're boring and cliched, BUT the 40K ork variety are a breath of fresh air to me. Often it's older more mature players with a sense of humour that plays orks.
So tell your son, that he's made a very cool choice. :yes:
and good luck.
So what everyone else is saying is true and there are no rules against Orks playing side by side with another army there is some fluff to say that they will. I don't remember the name of the chapter but there was a chapter of Space marines that was sent (by the inquisition) to fight an Ork wagh so large the whole chapter had to be sent. Durring the fight incredibly accurate sniper fire rained down on all of the space marine apothecaries killing them all. Without the apothicaries there was no one to retreive the geneseed from the fallen marines and the chapter is now eliminated. The message here is that Orks can do the inquisitions bidding. Also if you play Dawn of War, I believe the first three missions, the Orks are allied with Chaos; both sides plan to betray each other which shows the cunning side of orks. Either way there is some fluff related to Orks working with other races, One where the is clear knowledge of the alliance, and the other where it seems like an army just showed up to help the Orks win, but either way they are on the same team for the skirmish.
Thanks for the support guys.
nichodemus & morkai,
Is there any way you can point me to
the "fluff" that mentions this interaction between the races?
Is there anything stopping my boy from creating a chapter of hybrids or
let's say the orks took the geneseeds and somehow integrated them. I'll make race of whiteskins - far more civil and less aggressive merchant army.
Or, an infected (by the orks mad doc) geneseed "recovered by the marine apothecaries, and implanted into some marines spawning pointed ears and fangs, green melanomas ...
I jokingly said to my boy "Why dont you remodel some marines and orks - mix n match body parts " .
Its a big ask but 40k rules should allow more racial interaction.
Now I'm not joking so much ...
btw, if the nightbringer became a real threat would the 40k races unite or anarch ?
Officially, fluff wise, I think this is highly unlikely. And fluff snobs will turn their nose up at you.
HOWEVER, it's a hobby and it's meant to be fun. As long as you're using a legal army list, or as Caluin and Morkai said, 2 legal army lists working together, no one should give you hassles.
The Orks don't hate 'da humies'. Rather than that, they just love a good fight. To them it's all one big game of paint ball, it's only really the top warboss of the waagh that goes on some orky crusade. Remember, if there's no one else about, they'll more than happily fight each other.
If you're happy to play a Chaos army (which everyone should do at least once in their lives ) then I think even fluff snobs will have to acknowledge that orks and chaos might get together and cause a bit of mischief and mayhem.
You could probably use your marine models for this, but obviously, you wouldn't be able to use plasma cannons or landspeeders etc.
If it's a tournament, then it probably won't work. But if it's a friendly, i don't see a problem.
In fact, if they're friendly matches, I don't know why people are giving you such grief in the first place. I mean, I want to model my broodlord like Michael Jackson from the video of 'smooth criminal'. I'm playing using normal rules, so i don't see why anyone should be bothered.
Well for the blood axe fluff when dealing with humans I point you towards the following sources: The ork codex and the clans section on the GW website. I'm sure I've seen some more stuff elsewhere but I can't remember my sources. The blood axes definantly have human connections though, and anyone who says orks can't interact with 'Umies is a zogging git. Mind you, blood axes are pretty much the old clan that does this and they are generally looked down upon by other orks, but hey they do exist. (check the clan rules for them on the GW site too, they have a few nifty rules.)
Gargrimz Green Deff
W:10 D:4 L:5