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Yesterday I had my first battle and first victory using Daemon list against my friend who most always beats me using High Elfs.
My army: Keeper of Secrets (lvl 4, torment blade), Masque, 3x 10 Daemonettes, 3x 5 Flesh hounds, 1x 5 Seekers with Mtd Herald (siren song, torment blade), 3x 5 furies. (5 power dice - after he took 1 of mine by an item, 4 dispel dice)
His army: Teclis (lvl 4), Sun dragon with mage (lvl 2), 2x 10 archers, white lions with mage (lvl 2), swordmasters, 5X Dragon princes, great eagle. He also had bound item with magic missle and item that steams 1 PD from me (He had crazy power dice since another of his items gave him 2xd6 power dice every magic phase!)
RND 1: I mostly deployed behind cover of the furies putting the keeper in a forest to protect her for a couple of rounds. Basically I tried to deploy near as middle to the board as possible with terrain because he usually hides his command unit in a corner last and makes me cross the whole table under heavy fire. He fried the turd out of my mtd daemonettes with a fire spell that lasted 2 turns - Herald dead rnd 1 Next time I will be more careful with fury screen.
RND 2: The magic onslaught continues mostly damaging daemonettes and furies
RND 3: Keeper comes out of woods and shreds a unit of Dragon princes with Slicing Shards of Slaanesh. His great eagle march blocking the whole way and his dragon harrassing from behind my line. Finally got Masque behind his units walking along the line reducing his leadership. He finishes wiping out one unit of flesh hounds down to one with arrow fire, Keeper takes 1 wound.
RND 4: 2 of his wizards miscast and one looses a level, 1 remaining flesh hound from decimated unit kills mage in white lions unit, Keeper casts slicing shards of slaanesh against Teclis WITH IRRESISTIBLE FORCE and I roll 6 wounds! Teclis dead. High elfs manages to reduce a unit of daemonettes to 1 or 2. Meantime, daemonettes and other hounds bogged down by eagle trudging across the battlefield still. I should have charged that stupid eagle.
RND 5 : His block of white lions AND swordmasters charge Keeper. Keeper strikes them first because of initiative and kills 6 swordmasters. Keeper wins combat and both swordmasters and white lions must take leadership test - swordmasters pass and white lions run to within 1/2 inch of table edge.
MY FRIEND CONCEEDED DEFEAT AT RND 5 SINCE HE HAD TO GO
HERE BE MY THOUGHTS
I was really amazed to have defeated my friend - probably not by a very wide margin either. He is very good and has an ability I lack to think ahead a couple of moves. I have learned by playing him and mostly he schools me every time. I was teaching another friend of mine how to play WFB and mostly he rolled the dice early on in the game - whew! I thought I rolled bad! Probably another case of my pink Slaaneshi dice not feeling the mojo from him. By round one I was feeling some serious pain from his magic when he vaporized my mounted daemonettes and herald with siren song!
The keeper was the real MVP of the battle causing between 800and 850 pts to the enemy. Somehow, this KOS always seemed to roll unnaturally high (especially for me). I feel this may be since I scratchbuilt the KOS and really took my time with the model - perhaps Slaanesh rewarded me with high rolls for the time I lavished upon the model of his minion. Despite my being super cautious with the keeper, i feel I probably should have just charged her out toward the enemy because with ASF and her initiative she would generally strike first if charged. During the battle only 1 of 3 units of flesh hounds was destoyed - with the exception of 1 flesh hound with only 1 wound remaining. The runner up MVP must definitely go to this flesh hound since it clawed its way to the HE battle line and ripped a mage to shreds where he stood.
Magic. I usually only take about 3 magic levels when I play -- invariably when I play my HE friend he plays about 4 or so magic levels. This game I took 4 wiz levels for the Keeper - the most magic I have ever used in a game. Of course my friend really out did himself this time with the eight levels of magic! He took Teclis and 2x 2nd level mages. Like usual, I felt (despite having the 4th lev KOS) that I brought a knife to a gunfight. Due to my relatively low number of dispel dice, i just let many of his spells through. Many fizzled and proved harmless as the game progressed.
I definitely like that slicing shards of Slaanesh spell a lot. Especially when the Masque is dancing around his units working her magic on their leadership! Most of my other units did not come to bear by rnd 5 - I really need some practice/ help / advice getting my fast army to the enemy without being destroyed by magic or archery first.
A fun game.
Last edited by Sybaris Slaay; July 1st, 2008 at 01:33.
The Keeper doesn't strike first as a result of "initiative", as two ASFs cancel each other out, so he should have attacked first against the Keeper as he charged in, unless there were some other special rules overriding (that's the way I have seen this played and the way that the Rules as Intended works, even if RAW isn't explicit - the FAQ for HE clears it up a little, in that if two sides have ASF, the ASF cancel each other out...).
ASF is a rule which overrides the "initiative hierarchy", which special rules for charging and for particular weapons form part of. If both sides have ASF, then you revert to the "initiative hierarchy" - think object oriented programming. ASF is a subclass "who strikes first" method override, and if both sides have the same override, go to the superclass....
as a high elf player I need to tell you that he was cheating you cant generate 2d6 power dice you can generate d6 if his nobel had the banner of sorcery I cant believe you won if he had that sort of magical power with teclis
Teclis generates and extra D3 on his own, yeah? And then the banner of sorcery is another extra D3, not D6. Perhaps there was confusion on his opponent rolling 2D3 and he thought it was 2D6.
Anyway, who needs screening from magic with the flesh hounds? They are MR-3, which makes it hard for anyone to cast anything at them without you being able to dispel it just with their MR. And with 2 wounds, ward save, decent toughness, they should survive most shooting as long as a cannon isn't hitting them in the flank or anything. Those things are a tremendous buy for their points.
Heh, thanks for the comments. I'm pretty sure now that you mention it that they were d3 - he rolled D6 2x every magic phase.
About the ASF vs ASF I will check into that - understandably I havent read the HE FAQ since I couldn't give half a turd for those pansy ass poofs. Anyone know the link for the HE FAQ ? - I can't find it after a dilligent search on the new lame ass GW site.
No worries - of course he has to roll 2 D6 so that he can simulate the odds of a D3 for the extra winds of magic - but Kudos - you managed to beat a HE army with a non-cheesy list, so well done to you :-)
Last edited by kithre; July 3rd, 2008 at 09:54.
Why was Teclis standing by himself to get hit by Shards?
First off thanks for the battle report, it was nice and brief with some good info.
This is the link to the shrine of knowledge for fantasy, the high elves faq is around the middle. Of course the link faq isn't opening for me, but what can you do.
Like I said, I cant open the faq so i don't know exactly what it says, but I do know that the rulebook specifically states that if two models both have the ASF rule you must use the models' Initiative to determine who strikes first, (page 94 of the BFSP rule book). It doesn't say anything about reverting to normal methods, (like who charged or who has great weapons), just look at the Initiative values. With this in mind the KOS would go before charging elves.
The High elf faq says that when two models with ASF are fighting, they cancel each other out. If swordmasters are fighting other models with asf the swordmasters fight last due to being armed with great weapons. However if the swordmasters charge, they will strike first even against an ASF foe as ASF cancel each other out and the normal rules for charges are applied. This seems to be the most commonly used interpretation so the keeper would be striking last first round, then first the next round due to his higher initiative.
STEALTHA6: I was able to target Teclis with shards since the HE player had disengaged teclis from the unit of archers he was with in order to have him blast Masaue which was behind the line of archers and had recently reduced the unit's leadership to 7.
KITHRE: since HE player charged Keeper with Swordmasters AND white lions, only 2 swordmasters would have struck first since they were the only ones in base contact .