2000 points HE V Orcs and Goblins - Very Chariot heavy - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

Welcome to Librarium Online!

Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!

Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!


Register Now!

User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 8 of 8
  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    197
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputation
    63 (x1)

    2000 points HE V Orcs and Goblins - Very Chariot heavy

    Army Composition rules – Standard Composition rules

    Board size 6x4’

    Deployment Zones: Standard

    Deployment Method: Hidden Set-up



    Introduction


    Last time out I took a rather experimental list with 5 chariots at 1000 points and, to be brutally honest, annihilated the Empire, albeit in no small part thanks to the Empire general not taking a Great Cannon or anything else that would spell instant death to chariot should it score a wound.

    This time round I would be facing Orcs and Goblins. My performance against them hasn’t been brilliant in the past with a few iffy draws where the balance was leaning towards the Greenskins, particularly when victory points were taken into consideration, a stonking win the game before last followed by an equally stonking defeat last time round.

    Following last weeks battle I’d told myself I wouldn’t take chariots this time round but once I sat down to write a list for this battle I couldn’t resist seeing what sort of chariot heavy lists I could come up with. In the end I didn’t use the most extreme lists I came up with (at least in terms of numbers of chariots) but I did pick a list that was heavier still on chariots than the last with eight in total (the most extreme lists I came up with had eight).


    Armies


    High Elves


    Prince
    • Armour of Caledor
    • Guardian Phoenix
    • Great Weapon
    • Longbow
    • Tiranoc Chariot

    Noble
    • Battle Standard Bearer
    • Great Weapon
    • Longbow
    • Dragon Armour
    • Tiranoc Chariot

    Noble
    • Great Weapon
    • Longbow
    • Dragon Armour
    • Tiranoc Chariot

    Mage
    • Level 2 upgrade
    • Silver Wand
    • Talisman of Protection
    • Tiranoc Chariot

    10 x Archers
    • Musician

    10 x Archers
    • Musician

    Lion Chariot

    Lion Chariot

    Lion Chariot

    Lion Chariot

    Repeater Bolt Thrower

    Repeater Bolt Thrower

    Great Eagle



    Orcs and Goblins


    Black Orc Warboss
    • Amulet of Protectyness
    • Armour of Gork

    Black Orc Big Boss
    • Battle Standard Bearer
    • Heavy Armour
    • Mork’s Totem
    • Boar

    Night Goblin Big Boss
    • Great Cave Squig
    • Best Basha
    • Itsy Bitsy Trinket


    Orc Shaman
    • Level 2 upgrade

    17 x Orc Big Uns
    • Spears
    • Full Command
    • Banner of Butchery

    18 x Orc Boyz
    • Orc Boss
    • Musician
    • Shields

    18 x Orc Boyz
    • Orc Boss
    • Musician
    • Additional Choppas

    10 x Orc Arrer Boyz

    23 x Night Goblin Archers
    • 2 x Fanatics

    20 x Night Goblin Archers
    • 2 x Fanatics

    Orc Boar Chariot

    Orc Boar Chariot

    Rock Lobber
    • Orc Bully

    Doom Diver

    Spear Chukka

    Spear Chukka

    Giant


    Table Set-up




    For this battle I brought along the two new hills I’ve made to use (albeit they’re not finished off yet, still need to be flocked). Setting up we had two hills in the corners on one side of the board with some woods in the middle, while on the other the large hill in the corner and the smaller one in the middle of the deployment zone. There was an additional wood on the left side of the table roughly half way up the board.

    We rolled off to see who took which side which I won and took the side with the hills in the corner and centre.


    Magic Selection


    High Elves


    With the Silver Wand my Mage could select one more spell than normal and rolled the following:

    Mage:
    • Curse of Arrow Attraction
    • Fury of Khaine
    • Flames of the Phoenix

    Orcs and Goblins


    My opponent initially rolled ‘Eadbutt and Bash ‘Em Ladz but decided to swap ‘Eadbutt for Gaze of Mork.

    Orc Shaman:
    • Gaze of Mork
    • Bash ‘Em Lads


    Deployment




    Resorting to our usual method of deployment, hidden set-up, I drew a map and then my opponent placed down before I did. (We don’t have access to a suitable barrier for the battlefield at the moment).

    Needless to say, the Orcs and Goblins had so many units they were spread right across the table. Artillery was at either end on the hills while on the left flank the Goblin Big Boss on his Squig was accompanied by the giant. Between the hill in the left corner and the woods in the centre was the larger of the two units of Night Goblins. The unit of Orc Boyz armed with additional choppas were partially in the left hand side of the woods, with the unit of Big Uns and the Black Orc Warboss on the right hand side of the woods. The Orc Shaman was in the back of the woods, roughly between the two units. The other unit of Orc Boyz was just to the right of the woods with the smaller unit of Night Goblains. Just to the left of the hill was the first Orc Boar Chariot with the other one to the right of the hill.

    For my deployment I had the chariots going down in pairs of one Tiranoc and one Lion, so on the left I had the Tiranoc with the straight Noble, then a Lion Chariot, then the Prince’s chariot then a Lion Chariot. On the hill in the middle of my deployment zone I placed one unit of Archers and a Repeater Bolt Thrower with the Great Eagle just behind the hill. My Battle Standard Bearer was to the right of the hill, then a Lion Chariot, my Mage and the final Lion Chariot. The large hill in the bottom right corner had the remaining Repeater Bolt Thrower and Archers.


    High Elves – Turn 1




    Movement

    There was a general advance by all the chariots which all moved 8” forwards. The Great Eagle flew out from behind the hill towards the largest unit of Night Goblins but didn’t get close enough to release the fanatics I suspected would be hiding in the unit.

    Magic

    The Mage attempted to cast Fury of Khaine on the unit of Orc Boyz harbouring but failed. He then attempted to cast Curse of Arrow Attraction on the same unit but this was dispelled.

    Shooting

    With four Tiranocs and all my characters barring the Mage equipment with longbows there was a fair bit of shooting to come. It kicked off with the plain Noble on the Tiranoc Chariot and his crewman shooting at the Doom Diver. The Noble scored a hit but (I think I’m remembering this correctly after forgetting to note it at the time) the crewman’s regular bow was still just out of range. Unfortunately the Noble’s arrow hit the catapult and bounced off.

    Next up was my Prince at the Doom Diver. This time one member of the crew was killed. Now it was time for Archers 1 who took aim at the large block of Night Goblins and scored a massive 2 hits out of 10. fortunately both of these wounded which saved the Archers’ blushes somewhat.

    Repeater Bolt Thrower 1 next fired a single bolt at the unit of Orc Boyz opposite them and hit but the bolt failed to kill a single Orc. The Battle Standard Bearer and his chariot crewman also shot at the same unit. Both managed to hit the hulking unit of greenskins and one arrow wounded but was a mere glancing blow.

    The crewman on the Mage’s chariot shot at the smaller unit of Night Goblin archers but failed to hit.

    Repeater Bolt Thrower 2 fired a volley at the first Orc Boar Chariot scoring an excellent 5 hits and 2 wounds but these ultimately bounced off the sides of the chariot.

    Finally the second unit of Archers shot at the Rock Lobber. This unit of Archers had obviously been practising their shooting recently, unlike their colleagues on the other hill, and scored 7 hits, 3 of which fell on the goblin crew, killing 2.


    Orcs and Goblins – Turn 1




    Movement

    Both units of Night Goblins dashed forwards a massive 1” each during the animosity phase before both moved forwards to release their fanatics. The first fanatic from the large unit of Night Goblins went forward 9” from the left corner of the unit through the Great Eagle scoring 5 hits and 3 wounds to kill it outright. The second fanatic whirled 9” out towards the Noble riding the Tiranoc Chariot.

    On the right hand side of the battlefield the first fanatic out of the unit went out 8” into Lion Chariot 4, coming out 1” the other side. The other fanatic came out 12” diagonally through the same Lion Chariot coming out behind its left rear corner. Between them they inflicted 8 hits and 3 wounds on the chariot.

    Elsewhere the Night Goblin Big Boss turned his Squig towards the the woods and bounded 6” forwards. The Giant also went forward 6” and pivoted a bit to face the Prince’s chariot. Orc Boar Chariot 2 moved forward 7” while Orc Boar Chariot 1 pivoted about 45 degrees towards the table edge and also went forward 7”.

    Finally his Orc Shaman moved to within 2” of the edge of the woods.

    Magic

    The Shaman attempted to cast Gaze of Mork at the Lion Chariot running up the side of my BSB but this was dispelled.

    Shooting

    The Doom Diver launched into the air and came down slap bang on my Prince’s chariot, rolling 4 hits. 1 put a wound on the Prince while the other caused 3 wounds to the chariot. [1][a] The unit of Arrer Boyz let fly with their arrows at the Prince’s chariot as well scoring 3 hits, 1 on the Prince which was saved, but 2 managed to punch holes in the chariot, destroying it. Spear Chukka 1 also shot at the General but missed.

    The Rocker Lobber flung its stone high into the air and with near perfect aim it landed on the Mage’s Tiranoc Chariot destroying it immediately. The Spear Chukka next to it took aim at Lion Chariot 4 but failed to hit.

    Finally, the large unit of Night Goblins decided to shoot at the Prince scoring one hit and unsaved wound on the chariot, destroying it [1][b].


    High Elves – Turn 2




    Movement

    With Lion Chariot 4 pretty much crippled and unlikely to make it into combat since the greenskins would have another shooting phase yet before it could charge, I decided to send it out in a blaze of tarnished glory by charging the small unit of Night Goblins. They chose to flee but evidently weren’t afraid enough of the Elves as they went a mere 4” and the chariot rode them down, although this now meant its flank was exposed to the BSB’s unit of Orc Boyz.

    My BSB and the accompanying Lion Chariot 3 both moved up 6”. My mage ran for what little cover he could find behind Lion Chariot 3.

    Magic

    The Mage had another dismal magic phase, failing to cast both Fury of Khaine and Flames of the Phoenix.

    Shooting

    The Prince lofted his longbow to shoot down the Fanatic blocking the way of Lion Chariot 2 but although he scored a hit it was only on the whirling ball of death. Archers 1 also shot at the Fanatic in front of Lion Chariot 2, managing to score 2 wounds that sent the whirling greenskin off to meet Mork and Gork.

    The other Fanatic whirling wound on the left of the battlefield was felled by the Noble on that side of the battlefield.

    Repeater Bolt Thrower 1 fired a volley at the unit of Big Uns, hitting 4 and fatally wounding 2. The second bolt thrower also had a better second round of shooting, killing 4 Orcs in the unit to the right of the woods. Inspired by this success the second Archers unit shot at the same target and felled another Orc. Unfortunately for Lion Chariot 4 the Orcs passed their panic test.


    Orcs and Goblins – Turn 2




    Movement

    With tempting targets out on the battlefield both the Arrer Boyz and the Orc Boyz containing the BSB decided to squabble. Fortunately for the Orc Boyz a clip round the ear of one of the trouble makers from the BSB was enough to restore order and they charged into the flank of Lion Chariot 4.

    The Night Goblin Big Boss hopped 10” into the woods on his Great Cave Squig.

    Back on the other side of the battlefield one of the remaining Fanatics span down the side of the hill while the other went towards Lion Chariot 3 and the Mage.

    The Orc Big Uns reformed into ranks of 5 from their starting ranks of 6.

    Magic

    The Orc Shaman concentrated and managed to cast Gaze of Mork through the defences of the High Elf Mage, inflicting 4 wounds on Lion Chariot 3, only 2 of which were saved.

    Shooting

    The elastic on the Doom Diver catapult twanged again as the crew aimed the willing volunteer at Lion Chariot 1. Their aim was a bit off but the Goblin managed to steer onto Lion Chariot 2 scoring 2 wounds.

    The Rock Lobber flung another lump of stone into the air and it smashed down on top of Lion Chariot 3, destroying it.

    The large unit of Night Goblins shot at Lion Chariot 2 scoring 3 hits and a single wound that was saved. Spear Chukka 1 also shot at Lion Chariot 2 and scored a hit that turned into 2 wounds, destroying the chariot.

    Spear Chukka 2 shot at the Tiranoc Chariot carrying the BSB but failed to hit.

    Combat

    The crew of White Lion Chariot 4, seeing the horde of Orcs charging them hefted their axes and slew 2 of the brutes before being overwhelmed by the green tide. The Boyz overran 12” towards the right edge of the board.


    High Elves – Turn 3




    Movement

    The BSB and remaining Noble on a working chariot charged the large unit of Night Goblins who chose to stand and shoot – wildly over the top of the incoming chariot as it happened.

    Lion Chariot 1 moved forward slightly and pivoted to face the Giant while the Prince moved close to the rear of the chariot. The Mage moved over to the left a bit.

    Magic

    In another dismal turn of casting for the Mage his Fury of Khaine he was casting at the unit of Boyz armed with two choppas was dispelled while the Curse of Arrow Attraction he attempted to cast on the same unit failed to cast.

    Shooting

    The Prince hefted his longbow once more and shot at Spear Chukka 1 but even with his esteemed bow skill he failed to hit.

    Archers 1 and Repeater Bolt Thrower 1 shot at the unit of Orc Boyz with additional choppas. After an outstanding 8 hits the Archers only caused 2 wounds although neither of these were saved. The Bolt Thrower got 5 hits than converted into 4 wounds and 4 dead Orcs. If it hadn’t been for the proximity of the army general the unit would have fled.

    In the right hand corner Archers 2 and Repeater Bolt Thrower 2 also shot at the same target, the plain unit of Orc Boyz. The Bolt Thrower scored 5 hits and fatal wounds and the Archers managed to replicate the feat of their colleagues in the middle by felling 2 Boyz. Unfortunately for the Elves this unit of Boyz also held.

    Combat

    The charging chariots cut a bloody swathe through the cowering Night Goblins. Both chariots rolled 6 for impact hits although the chariot in the front could only convert 5 of these into wounds. In the flank of the unit the BSB, crewman and Elven Steed killed 1 Goblin apiece. In the front the Noble killed 2 while the Elven Steed killed another, the crewman letting the side down by failing even to hit – although perhaps understandable considering how few Goblins there were left to attack.

    Needless to say, needing Insane Courage to stick around, the Goblins were running away, in this instance towards the thin edge of the table [2].

    Both chariots pursued and overran the Gobbos.


    Orcs and Goblins – Turn 3




    Movement

    The unit of Orc Big Uns decided at this moment to squabble causing the general to bang some heads together, killing 3 of the squabbling Orcs.

    The Giant declared a charge on the Tiranoc Chariot carrying the plain Noble which chose to flee. Unwisely as it turned out as it only went 8” and was just within the Giant’s charge range still and so was destroyed.

    Both Fanatics were finally overcome by the effort of whirling their balls around and squished themselves.

    The Night Goblin Big Boss’ Squig bounced him into the remaining Lion Chariot.

    Both Boar Chariots moved up to the hill in the bottom right corner of the board. The unit of plain Orc Boyz reformed to face the same hill while the Big Uns and unit of Boyz with two choppas both moved 2” forwards so they were completely out of the woods.

    On the hill in the top left of the board the Arrer Boyz wheeled a bit to face my BSB.

    Magic

    The Shaman attempted to inflict the Gaze of Mork at my mage but this was dispelled.

    Shooting

    The Doom Diver again flung another martyr at the Prince but in their enthusiasm overshot. Likewise the Rock Lobber, aiming at the Bolt Thrower in the central hill, also overshot.

    Spear Chukka 2 shot at the Mage but didn’t hit. Their colleagues on the other hill shot at my BSB’s chariot and put 2 wounds on it. The Arrer Boyz also shot at the BSB and scored a hit but the wound was saved.

    Combat

    In the combat between the Night Goblin Boss and Lion Chariot 1 the crew of the chariot put 1 wound on the boss. Between them the Goblin and his Squig scored 3 hits and wounds, only 1 of which was saved. The War Lions scored a measly 1 hit and didn’t wound. Shockingly the chariot had lost the combat but with the Prince within 12” passed their leadership test easily.


    High Elves – Turn 4




    Movement

    Movement this turn was pretty limited with the BSB charging the Arrer Boyz and the Mage moved further towards the left edge of the board.

    Magic

    In a repeat of the previous turn the Mage had Fury of Khaine, cast at the Big Uns, dispelled and Curse of Arrorw Attraction, cast on the Orc Boyz with extra choppas, failed.

    Shooting

    With the Giant starting to move across the battlefield the crew of Bolt Thrower 1 took aim and hit him but failed to wound

    Archers 2 shot at the rapidly closing Orc Boar Chariot 1 scoring an amazing 9 hits but only 2 wounds, neither of which stuck. Bolt Thrower 2 shot at Boar Chariot 2 with a volley and managed to put 3 wounds on it.

    Archers 1 shot at the Boyz with extra choppas, killing 3. Finally, the Prince also shot at these Boyz and hit but didn’t wound.

    Combat

    In the existing combat between the White Lions and the Night Goblin Big Boss, the Goblin was quickly dispatched by the White Lion crew. My opponent rolled “Uh?” for the monster reaction and so the Squig would be subject to stupidity for however long it lasted. The War Lions put a wound on it but it managed 1 itself in return. Losing combat it fled and after a brief interlude while I got down to model level to figure out if the chariot was in danger of pursuing into woods and destroying itself, I pursed and ran it down.

    My Battle Standard Bearer crashed into the Arrer Boyz scoring 5 impact hits which all wounded and the BSB himself put another wound on the unit. Neither the chariot crewman or the Elven Steed managed to wound but needing Insane Courage to stick around they fled only to be run down.


    Orcs and Goblins – Turn 4




    Movement

    The unit of plain Orc Boyz decided to squabble causing the Orc BSB to rip off another 2 heads to restore order.

    On the left hand side of the battlefield the Giant declared a charge on my Prince who decided to stand and shoot, hitting but not wounding.

    Orc Boar Chariot 2 charged Repeater Bolt Thrower 2 whose crew fled while Boar Chariot 1 charged Archers 2 who stood and shot, putting a wound on the chariot.

    Elsewhere the Big Uns marched forward and wheeled slightly to start heading towards the hill in the centre of my deployment zone. The Boyz with two choppas also marched straight forward towards the hill.

    The Black Orc BSB left his unit and headed off towards the unit of Big Uns while the survivors of the unit marched towards the hill in the right hand corner.

    Finally the Orc Shaman moved 3” out of the wood.

    Magic

    The Shaman attempted to cast Gaze of Mork at Archers 1 but was out of range.

    Shooting

    The Doom Diver was flung into the air by his colleagues aiming at my mage but they overestimated and almost hit the Big Uns. The Rock Lobber tried to take out Bolt Thrower 1 again but the rock scattered away.

    Spear Chukka 1 shot at Lion Chariot 1 but failed to hit as did Spear Chukka 2 which shot at my Mage.

    Combat

    Boar Chariot 1 managed to score 4 wounds on Archers 2 from impact hits and the boars chipped in 2 themselves, although the crew failed to score any wounds. The Archers fled and were run down.

    My Prince scored 3 hits on the Giant and 2 wounds. The Giant rolled “Jump up and down” and scored 7 hits of which 6 wounded. The Prince made 2 armour saves but failed to make any ward saves and was slain, with the Giant overrunning 5”.


    High Elves – Turn 5




    Movement

    The crew of Bolt Thrower 2 rallied.

    My BSB turned his chariot round to face the Doom Diver while the Lion Chariot had to move all the way past the woods before it could pivot without taking any wounds in the manoeuvre.

    My Mage moved another 5” towards the hill in the centre of my deployment zone.

    Magic

    The Mage finally managed to cast, getting Fury of Khaine off on the Orcs with additional choppas, killing 2.

    He also attempted to cast Curse of Arrow Attraction on the Giant but failed.

    Shooting

    Bolt Thrower 1 shot a volley at the Giant hitting with all 6 shots but wounding with just 2. Archers 1 also shot at the Giant and scored 8 hits but no wounds.

    My BSB and the crewman on his chariot shot at the Doom Diver catapult but only managed to hit the machine.


    Orcs and Goblins – Turn 5




    Movement

    The Giant charged Bolt Thrower 1 whose crew elected to hold as did the crew of Bolt Thrower 2 who were charged by Boar Chariot 2 which had finished destroying their machine.

    The Boyz with double choppas and Big Uns carried on marching up the centre of the table.

    Magic

    The Shaman elected not to cast this time.

    Shooting

    The Doom Diver tried to take out the Lion Chariot that was threatening to charge next turn but scattered off the board while the Rock Lobber didn’t shoot.

    Spear Chukka 1 shot at Lion Chariot 1 but failed to hit, as did Spear Chukka 2 which shot at my mage.


    Combat

    The crew of Bolt Thrower 1 managed to overcome the terror of being charged by the giant to score a hit but they couldn’t wound. He rolled “Swing with club” scoring 2 hits and 1 wound causing the remaining crewman to flee only to be pursued and squished. The Archers nearby stood firm despite their brethren being killed about them.

    Boar Chariot 2 scored 2 impact hits on the crew of Bolt Thrower 2, wiping them out.


    High Elves – Turn 6




    Movement
    Both chariots declared charges – the BSB’s at the Spear Chukka and the Lion Chariot at the Doom Diver.

    The Mage fell back another 4”.

    Magic

    The Mage cast Fury of Khaine at the Orc Big Uns but this failed. He did succeed in casting Curse of Arrow Attraction on the nearby unit of Orc Boyz.

    Shooting

    With the Mage having finally cast Curse… on a unit, Archers 1 shot at the unit of Orc Boyz, rolling 9 hits (annoyingly even with the re-roll I couldn’t get the tenth). Despite this plethora of arrows hitting the unit only 2 wounded but these.

    Despite the closeness of the general the unit of Boyz panicked and fled 10”.

    Combat

    The Battle Standard Bearer’s chariot scored a single hit and wound on the Spear Chukka and crew but the BSB reached over and finished off the remaining Goblin crew.

    The Lion Chariot had no such problem scoring 4 hits and wounds from the impact hits.

    Neither chariot overran.


    Orcs and Goblins – Turn 6




    Movement

    The sole charge was that of the Black Orc Battle Standard Bearer on my Mage. Given that the BSB was mounted on a boar and so would more than likely outpace the Mage if he fled I decided to hold.

    The unit of Orc Boyz rallied while the Giant moved into position to catch the mage if he fled from combat with the BSB.

    Magic

    None

    Shooting

    Spear Chukka 2 shot at Archers 1, killing 2 of the archers.

    Combat

    The Mage struck first but the brutal Black Orc BSB easily parried aside his sword thrusts. In return the Orc scored 2 hits and 1 wound but this was thwarted by the Mage’s Talsisman of Protection.

    With the boar failing to hit the Mage I was jubilant at having survied the combat until my opponent reminded me that the Mage was outnumbered and the Orc was carrying the battle standard meaning a leadership test for me at -2. The Mage failed this and fled over the hill ending up just short of the Giant. The Orc BSB chose not to bother pursuing.


    Notes


    [1][a] & [b] - Looking at my notes I think I might have erred here. From the Doom Diver 3 hits did go on the chariot but according to my written notes only one wound got through. Either I wrote my note wrong (possible, as I try and do it quickly to avoid holding up play) or I crossed off the wrong number of wounds on my marker (i.e. I crossed off 3 because there were 3 hits rather than the correct number of wounds). My notes say that Night Goblin Archers 1 scored the fatal wound on the Tiranoc Chariot but I’ve only written 2 wounds out of 4 being inflicted on it in that turn. This is going to bug me now.

    [2] – During the game we had one of those moments of “er, what do we do here?” with regards to which direction the Goblins should run. Needless to say it’s not something covered explicitly in the BRB (or if it is, as usual, it’s not where you’d expect to find it). If it hadn’t been two identical chariots on the winning side we’d have just done it that the Goblins ran away from the largest unit. In the end we decided to roll a D6; on a 1-2 they would run away from the Noble towards the long edge of the board; 3-4 they’d run away diagonally from the both chariots; and 5-6 they’d run away from my BSB’s chariot, which is what happened.


    Conclusion


    I went into this battle a bit concerned that this many chariots might be stupidly overpowered against an army without much access to high strength attacks, with my main concern being about running into a Black Orc Warboss with a Great Weapon, closely followed by worries about losing wounds off the chariots once they got under half range of the Spear Chukkas.

    Unfortunately when quickly running over the Orc and Goblin army book in the day before the battle I forgot or missed the fact that Stone Throwers double the strength of the hit for models under the hole. Thus with S8 hits under the centre the greenskins do indeed have chariot killer strength hits, as demonstrated in this battle.

    Before I get on to my failings in this battle I should say well played to my opponent in this battle and ask him where he got his new dice from! In the first couple of Orc and Goblin turns I swear I’ve never seen so many sixes rolled in so short a time of a game before. Seriously though I don’t really think he put a foot wrong part from forgetting to move his Giant early on, and that didn’t really mess up his battle (might have made mine a bit better though if it had been out on the field sooner where I might have been able to attack it with something). Add in above average numbers of hits from his shooting, plus avoiding my Archers late on with the Giant and Boar Chariot that had taken a few wounds and job well done.

    Anyway, where do I think I went wrong here? A more pertinent question would probably be where I went right but anyway…

    I don’t have many complaints particularly about my list as it was still rather experimental, although perhaps I could have dropped the Tiranoc from the Mage to be able to afford another Great Eagle. I should probably have given the Mage the Jewel of the Dusk rather than Silver Wand so I could have used 3 power dice for casting Fury of Khaine (assuming I still rolled that) and still had 2 left over for Curse of Arrow Attraction.

    I think my main problem in this game was in deployment, particularly the Great Eagle which I deployed behind the hill to try and avoid it getting shot to bits if the greenskins got the first turn. Unfortunately it was a bit too far back so when I moved it first turn it wasn’t close enough to trigger the fanatics when it finished moving.

    As a result of that I couldn’t shoot down the fanatics on the left flank with the bows on the Tiranoc Chariots in my first movement So when the fanatics ended up being released in the Orc and Goblin turn 1 they scuppered any plans I had for moving the chariots on that flank in my second turn, unless I wanted to risk not killing them and getting them go right through one or more chariots in O&G turn 2.

    However, without anything to draw out the fanatics on the right flank I was always going to be a bit stuck there unless I could get those chariots across the centre of the battlefield before the goblins got close enough to release.

    What I probably should have done was overloaded my right flank with chariots, deploying a couple on the hill and one on the other side of it, and tearing down that side to take out his chariots and the Rock Lobber. Unfortunately I probably limited my thinking on deployment by going into the game with the plan of pairing up the chariots for frontal charges on units, thinking that if impact hits didn’t remove enough casualties then 6 WS5 S5 attacks from the Lion Chariot and the 3 S5 attacks from the Nobles and Prince on the Tiranoc Chariots should be enough to prevent any attacks back, barring atrocious dice rolls. Had I gone for another Great Eagle and so had a Lion Chariot without a character on a Tiranoc to pair it to, I would probably have been a bit more free in my thinking on how to deploy.

    During the game I think my biggest mistake was fleeing with the Noble on Tiranoc when the Giant charged him. My thinking was that the chariot should easily flee out of the way, rally on my next turn and be closer to the action in the centre of the table to be able to get in and do some damage while either Lion Chariot 1 or my BSB got a charge on the Giant. Obviously in hindsight I should probably have stuck around as the Noble might have put a wound on the Giant even if the chariot was still beaten in combat, which would have meant my opponent might have been a bit more circumspect about charging into my general later in the game.

    Overall I was rather disappointed by the performance of my Mage this game. Admittedly my opponent having Mork’s Spirit Totem meant that getting spells off was going to be difficult but I could have lived with that if I hadn’t repeatedly failed to meet the casting value Fury of Khaine even when I did throw 3 dice at it.

    Shooting was a disappointment early on in the game, not helped by my target selection. Perhaps it was because I’d forgotten about the strength of the Rock Lobber’s hits under the centre spot but I should really have concentrated on knocking out the Doom Diver and Rock Lobber early on. If I’d concentrated fire on those machines in my first turn with the Archers and Repeater Bolt Throwers I could probably have taken the crews out and would probably have had a couple more chariots making it into combat. I’m not sure why I didn’t do that here since I normally remember to do that against the Empire (although maybe that’s because the Empire’s shooting tends to be far more reliable)

    There’s not much to discuss about combat. The two Tiranoc’s that charged the large unit of Goblins performed pretty much as expected (if not slightly better vis a vis impact hits) and my Prince I’d have hoped would have scored at least 1 more wound against the Giant. I’m more disappointed that I didn’t manage to get the charge off of a Lion Chariot and Tiranoc against any of the Orc Boyz units as that was the big test I was looking for in this game – whether the chariots can do the damage against the tougher models.

    I don’t think I’d play this exact same list again but I’d be willing to try making the tweaks I mentioned earlier and taking that against Orcs and Goblins. As I don’t play against any other armies at the moment (although I do have access to most of the other books) I’d be tempted to try this list against most although I’ve no idea how it’d do as I’m not sure quite how effective the other shooting and magic I’d be likely to come across would be.

    I think it would be suicidal against Empire unless my opponent took a list like mine did in my 1000 point game where I took a load of chariots. At 2000 points though I’d expect an Empire player to be taking at least 1 cannon. Same with Dwarves really.

    Last edited by sorberec; July 17th, 2009 at 21:05.

  2. Remove Advertisements
    Librarium-Online.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    Senior Member Allonairre's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Age
    36
    Posts
    2,244
    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    399 (x8)

    Another excellent report.

    I agree with your conclusions for the most part but really think that deployment was your biggest mistake. With one flank overloaded as you mentioned you would have had a better chance of taking that flank apart then sweeping across. It would have meant that the fanatics would be a problem and the scattering rock lobber would have a good chance of hitting so I can understand why you decided against it.

    Another eagle would have been really benficial as well, again you already mentioned this.

    Just to answer your question about about which direction to flee in, in this case it wouldn't be a problem as the noble in a chariot has unit strength 5 and the regular chariot unit Strength 4. I think you would have to roll off if they were both normal chariots though.

    Finally some changes you could make to the list if you wanted to play it again would be to drop a lion chariot and use the points to get the BSB the banner of sorcery, an extra eagle. I would also give the Prince Vambraces of Defence instead of Armour + Gaurdian Phoenix it is about 11 extra points (dragon armour and shield included) and will give you much better protection overall. Change the Great weapons to Lances or Halberds and get one of the nobles (or the Prince) the Reaver Bow for some awesome shooting.
    Cheers Allonairre

    WIP Thread

  4. #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    197
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputation
    63 (x1)

    Quote Originally Posted by Allonairre View Post
    Just to answer your question about about which direction to flee in, in this case it wouldn't be a problem as the noble in a chariot has unit strength 5 and the regular chariot unit Strength 4. I think you would have to roll off if they were both normal chariots though.
    Actually they were both US5 as they were both Nobles in chariots - all the Tiranocs used in this battle were character mounts (although my Mage and Prince ended up spending most of the battle on foot...).

    Quote Originally Posted by Allonairre View Post
    Finally some changes you could make to the list if you wanted to play it again would be to drop a lion chariot and use the points to get the BSB the banner of sorcery, an extra eagle. I would also give the Prince Vambraces of Defence instead of Armour + Gaurdian Phoenix it is about 11 extra points (dragon armour and shield included) and will give you much better protection overall. Change the Great weapons to Lances or Halberds and get one of the nobles (or the Prince) the Reaver Bow for some awesome shooting.
    Trouble with dropping a Lion Chariot is that in this list they're the real hard hitters with 6 S5 attacks (if fighting to the front). The Nobles/Prince have S5 attacks (and S6 if they end up on foot due to their chariot being destroyed, hence my equiping them with Great Weapons) but I'm probably not going to do many wounds against Orcs from the chariot crewman and Elven Steeds. That's part of the reason why my plan was dual charges into units from a character on a Tiranoc and a Lion Chariot - there should be enough S5 hits going round to prevent attacks back if someone fluffs their attacks

    If I'd been playing against Empire lances might have been an interesting weapon option as my Prince or Nobles would still be S4 against mostly T3 if the combats went into a second round, but against the T4 Orcs I'd rather have the S5 attacks from the characters each turn rather than hope I do enough S6 wounds to cause units to break.

    Dropping the Mage's Tiranoc gives me points for another Great Eagle plus some spare for some other bits and pieces. I'm not sure whether I'd drop the Talisman of Protection from him as well and run him naked or not in one of the Archer units.

    I've run the Reaver Bow (and Bow of the Seafarer) in the past. My only reservations about using them is that if the battle goes more according to plan (i.e. my chariots aren't sat around waiting for Fanatics to be cleared) whoever I give it to may only get one turn of shooting with it assuming I can spring a charge on my second turn. Which means the points spent on them aren't working as hard as they could. I think they're more useful on a character like a Noble on a Great Eagle who can hang out of the action a bit and take pot shots at units or war machines who are causing problems while allowing him to jump into the fray relatively easily.

    I've run Vambraces in the past but haven't used them in the past few battles either because I needed the points elsewhere or through wanting to vary the selection a bit.

  5. #4
    LO Zealot LoreSeeker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Italy
    Age
    26
    Posts
    1,108
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputation
    94 (x3)

    Good report as always, shame for the result.

    But could somebody tell me why our chariots are only T4? What is it, aren't they made of wood and steel as the orcs' ones or as Chaos' ones? I'm pretty disappointed by the fact that a Chariot has the same T as the normalest Orc of the Old World...looks like a nonsense to me

  6. #5
    Lord Admiral kithre's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Iver Heath
    Age
    39
    Posts
    2,608
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    220 (x8)

    Good report - though Armour of Caledor was somewhat wasted on the Prince if his chariot had survived - which it didn't in teh end...(!)

    Against Orcs, as they tend not to have massive armour, Sword of Heroes is certainly useful, as it allows you to wield a shield and take apart the T5 or greater enemies on relatively even terms (e.g. Giants, Trolls, Wyverns)

    I would also have taken a few cavalry units - the lack of march moves vs the Orcs told and the number of viable units in the mid-phase of the game was very low. Having the Prince on an Elven steed would be better, and i would have actually opted for a Reaver Bow on one of the Nobles - hitting on 2s and wounding om 3s vs the orcs or on 4s vs teh chariots would have been good supplemental shooting.

    The danger of O&G war machines was aptly displayed as well. Though they are not 100% reliable, they can certainly mess up a good Elven unit quickly enough. Ellyrian Reavers or Shadow Warriros and a couple more Eagles would certainly have helped.

    I would have chosen a different lore to Hig Magic on a level 2 wizard - most of the spells in the Amber magic selection are cheap to cast, and hence in easy reach of a level 2 mage. The default spell would be useful, and Beast Cowers would hurt chariots as well as others, whilst teh Hunting spear can hurt deep blocks of infantry.


    Finally, teh ultimate "crutch" the terror bomb of a Dragon (or Griffon if you want to handicap yourself) would work wonders against the O&G line, especially where they don;t have teh general's leadership to use. O&G have low LD, and Night Goblins especially were going to cause issues.

  7. #6
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    197
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputation
    63 (x1)

    Quote Originally Posted by LoreSeeker View Post
    Good report as always, shame for the result.

    But could somebody tell me why our chariots are only T4? What is it, aren't they made of wood and steel as the orcs' ones or as Chaos' ones? I'm pretty disappointed by the fact that a Chariot has the same T as the normalest Orc of the Old World...looks like a nonsense to me
    Hell, I want them made of dragon armour so they're immune to flaming attacks

  8. #7
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    197
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputation
    63 (x1)

    Quote Originally Posted by kithre View Post
    Good report - though Armour of Caledor was somewhat wasted on the Prince if his chariot had survived - which it didn't in teh end...(!)
    Well I was half expecting him to go after the Prince with his shooting and so gave him that armour in case the Goblins actually managed to hit - which they did this time.

    Quote Originally Posted by kithre View Post
    Against Orcs, as they tend not to have massive armour, Sword of Heroes is certainly useful, as it allows you to wield a shield and take apart the T5 or greater enemies on relatively even terms (e.g. Giants, Trolls, Wyverns)
    Do you mean Sword of Hoeth?

    Quote Originally Posted by kithre View Post
    I would also have taken a few cavalry units - the lack of march moves vs the Orcs told and the number of viable units in the mid-phase of the game was very low. Having the Prince on an Elven steed would be better, and i would have actually opted for a Reaver Bow on one of the Nobles - hitting on 2s and wounding om 3s vs the orcs or on 4s vs teh chariots would have been good supplemental shooting.
    Well as I said at the start of the report, I'd started with the intention of going with no or few chariots but ended up seeing how many chariots I could cram in. Some of the slightly saner lists I came up with did have a unit of Silver Helms in.

    Quote Originally Posted by kithre View Post
    The danger of O&G war machines was aptly displayed as well. Though they are not 100% reliable, they can certainly mess up a good Elven unit quickly enough. Ellyrian Reavers or Shadow Warriros and a couple more Eagles would certainly have helped.
    Well given that I was expecting the Orcs and Goblins to be spread across the board I decided against Shadow Warriors as I didn't think there'd be anywhere I could deploy in his half of the battlefield. Reavers I'm not sure about. I keep meaning to give them another go but I haven't been too impressed with them in the past.

    Quote Originally Posted by kithre View Post
    I would have chosen a different lore to Hig Magic on a level 2 wizard - most of the spells in the Amber magic selection are cheap to cast, and hence in easy reach of a level 2 mage. The default spell would be useful, and Beast Cowers would hurt chariots as well as others, whilst teh Hunting spear can hurt deep blocks of infantry.
    Well this choice was down to doing something different to normal - usually I take Lore of Metal as I find Rule of Burning Iron handy for taking wounds off characters but I figured that with the lower armour saves of O&G it wasn't worth taking that and decided to take High for a change. As I say, I should probably have given him Jewel of the Dusk rather than the Silver wand so he had the extra power dice

    Quote Originally Posted by kithre View Post
    Finally, teh ultimate "crutch" the terror bomb of a Dragon (or Griffon if you want to handicap yourself) would work wonders against the O&G line, especially where they don;t have teh general's leadership to use. O&G have low LD, and Night Goblins especially were going to cause issues.
    Well I've used dragons against Orcs and Goblins before with mixed results (although I've only ever taken Sun Dragons, not Moon or Star). Some games it's performed well, others it's been a disaster.

  9. #8
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    197
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputation
    63 (x1)

    My next battle report can now be found here.

+ Reply to Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts