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The Storm of Chaos forum is finally here so I'll start off:
What does everyone think of the new SoC armies in general, do they fit in with the background of the campaign or not? Please give your opinions.
Also, if anyone has started a new SoC army then please reply too!
Right my thoughts on the lists.
This list has a potentional to be truely devestating, the army can have a large amount of chosen, warriors etc. The loss of beasts and daemons is no biggy, the more troops make up for that. I like how the list encourages large units by giving them free command over a certain size, it'll make it seem a lot more like a horde with units of 20+.
The two new units are great, the flayerkin add another hardcore choice to the disposal of the chaos player, and the hellcannon well.... This thing is mean but can be bit of a two sided sword, on one side it's a beast and should be able to desimate almost anything it hits and the surrounding units and with the two ways of attacking it means it's just as good from afar as it is up close. And on the other side it's a little unreliable, the rampage rule makes it so that it's a bit hard to make it stay in one place and this could cause a problem with your own ranks if you lose the crew.
The new scenario to be used with this is I like, it fits perfectly. It's what you would image the battle between any army trying to stand in his way would be like, outnumbered etc. All in all I like the list, it seems to fit with how you would expect the champion of chaos' army to be like.
Now this was the list I was looking forward too and personally I love it, it has everything a budding slayer want-to-be needs. And finally something to make out slayer characters worthy to bare that name, the skills. These are great as now you can have an all powerful and mighty rune axe with these wonderful additions to show off your slayers skills. And Killing Blow!! something that I think has been sorely missed from the dwarven list, also you get an extra hero slot than normal. Which is nice. The new rune for the BSB is also a god send for all slayers, a ward save!! Now our unarmed killing machines at least stand a chance of living longer that one or two turns, and the wards of grimnir is also a pretty good item. It'll give us even more protection against magic and combined with the rule for DD in a slayer army means they still are pretty much anti-magic.
The new units are great too, especially the Doomseekers. These guys are a punch that makes this list great, they're like Goblin fanatics but better. They aren't random and has the potentional to do lots more damage, with two wounds and T4 these nutters are going to cause havoc and will be quite hard to get rid of. The brotherhood of grimnir is an intresting unit, they are basically elite slayers. These have the same abilites of a slayer unit but have magic resistance, better stats and...a magic banner ^_^ This makes them a good choice, even if one of the most expenisve in the list. The goblin hewer, now this had some worried. And now we see the rules they should still be, this thing will eat through large units with ease. With d3 hits per rank it'll have to be a very tough or very lucky unit that decided to face this down and expect to live.
Now all in all this is my favourite list, being a dwarven player you'd expect it really. But one thing I like is they seem to have make people think twice about avoiding slayers, we may even see them being used more in a normal dwarven list. But the one thing for me that made this my favourite is that it has the best name for a rule ever. "Look Snorri, Trolls!!" this captured the very essance of the dwarven slayer and made me laugh when reading it, so I love this list.
Army Of Sylvania
This army is great, it fits perfectly with all fluff to do with the Von Carsteins line. They used their normal armies with the dead and living fighting alongside one another, so it only makes sense for them to have a list like that. The new powers also compliment the bloodline, the wolf one I really like. The raising of new units from actual graveyards is wonderful, a great concept and the new banner works well too.
Fitting with the fluff they have access to everything a normal VC army wouldn't want or can't have and one big addition being shooting and heavily armoured knights on foot to represent the Drakenhof Greatswords or Guard. Love it. The only problem I have is the lack of spell casters, the only way your really going to get large army via raising is with a 2k+ game and the chance for a Vamp count or lord. Other than that I love this list.
High Elf Sea Patrol
This is by all means the worse out of all of them, all the rumours that we heard the only true one was the free shooting and the merwyrm. First they don't really gain much the characters have a name change and the mages a couple of new spells, and these aren't even that good either. Then there is one of the few good things about the list, the new honour. Allowing a free round of missile fire with only three types of unit means you have a chance to end it before it all begins, and not as much fun as other armies.
Then the units, the main force of the army is as the name suggests Sea Guard, yet they haven't really changed. All they get is a magic banner and the champ with a magic item and the banner is only for one unit, so we have heard nothing of the rumoured free reform or the pts drop or even a free shield. Then the sea rangers, these shadow warriors are a 2+ choice, thus you must have two of them. And to make things worse they are special choice and have no other bonuses. The other unit is ships company, basically these are your avaerage spearmen or archers. They have no other rules or anything and can't even have a standard bearer, the only good thing about them is they can be used as a cheap combat unit.
Out of the whole list the only thing I do like is the Merwyrm, a monster that adds some much needed combat support to such a crappy list.
This list again is a good one in my eyes, an army of black orcs and big uns Nothing too much has changed except no gobbos, black orcs are no longer on a 0-1 restriction and neither is the big uns. This means an army of rock hard units, one big thing is that the list relies on more brute force than magic (big surprise there eh? ) so shamans are limited to as many bosses etc you have. Another change is the effigy of gork, this unmovable object has a big effect on orcs close by.
Again I like this list, the orc army has been made rock hard but still doesn't loose any of it comedic value and can still include giants and trolls. Oh and now black orcs have access to great weapons for Grimgors bodyguard, a nice improvment.
Small changes to the normal bret list, mainly the knights errant muct be taken and not KOTR. Also they are more impetuous and have more chance to go charging forward (to show off to the damsel or to out do the other knights), also they all get the errantry banner and can be led by the saintly grail knights for the exra punch.
An ok list, nothing major but quite fluffy.
Again IMO a pretty good list, making it so an all daemon list becomes viable. The increase in LD and normal wards are a big boost, this alone will allow your all powerful daemons to stay in this realm for a bit longer than they normally would. The characters are a bit lacking though, with only being available in a game below 2k is a herald and Exalted daemon (of which takes two hero choices). So this does kind of limit you a bit, but not much. The herald is basically a lower version of a Exalted daemon but with one big addition, he can be a BSB. Now this adds a whole new thing to daemons, like normal units use it for break tests daemons get to use it for instability tests (so are twice as likely to stay). Also it can have any of the banners available and this makes him twice as useful.
Now the new units, daemonic chariots and mounted daemons. The chariots add something new to the list, the ability to cause quite a bit of havoc. And with it still being daemonic it's still vunerable but can also be quite resiliant (as it has the ward save) and each with unique rules for each god's chariots. The mounted units look quite fun too, you like the steeds of slannesh? Well now you can have a unit of six, again they have the potentional to cause some damage and with many of them I doubt all armies will look the same.
The potentional for a good, fun list. I like it, and wouldn't mind have a crack against one army of daemons.
Cult Of Slaanesh
Now this list almost everyone was looking forward too, a dark elf list with slaanesh elements. But it appears to be the other way around, it looks like you can get more of a chaos list with elevn elements instead. Why DE would ally themnselves with bruatal marauders is beyond me but I don't think that seems right. You could miss out on almost all elven units and take choas ones instead, again doesn't seem right. Right the devoted, wow you think? Or do you think witchelves without poison? They are basically that, witchelves without frenzy or poison. The fact that they have soporific musk doesn't make much different, being as WS5 allows you to mainly hit of 3s anyways. Then the other units are basically the normal units from a DE list and Chaos list combined, the only thing I do agree with is the addition of Slaanesh daemons. The daeomns fit perfectly with the fluff we all know of the CoP in Druchii society, other than that the only changes to the DE units is the abaility to take the Mark Of Slaanesh.
Now one other thing I do actually like is the anointed, this character adds a bit of power to the otherwise fragile elven kind. With the options normally available to that of a DE lord he can still be reconised as a DE, but with the new powers he can have as well as Slaanesh daemonic gifts this guy will be tearing up units in no time. One of the few things I like in the list. The magic users haven't really changed except they may have the mark of Slaanesh, this adds a new dimention to your magic with the list. You can now combine the devastating power of the Dark magic with the deablitating powers of the Slaansh lore, best of both worlds? One thing I'm not too sure of is allowing the list to have an almighty and powerful greater daemon, to me it seem a bit much. These things are really only there to praise the skills of the most powerful Slaanesh champions/followers, so why is there chance for anyone to have one in such a small army? I could have been a good idea if allowed only if Morathi is present. Then the normal heros; the noble for the BSB and combat roles and the aspiring champion for pure combat roles.
Now the new items are allowed in ALL DE armies and not just the CoP list, this is a boost to DE players. Many have complained that they don't have enough magic weapons or at least useful ones (god they'll complain at anything won't they.. ) and now they have two to add a bit of punch, although I think many will stick with the Gauntlet of Power (double S and no save is better than +2s and KB any day). It appears that some are trying to cover up a weakness or two, the ward save of 4+ is now available and a much missed bound item. The cloak could be useful for allowing one of your characters to join the shades and go mage hunting and the banner would be a nice addition to units that don't want to recieve that charge from the big nasty unit.
All in all I'm not too keen on this list, it had potentional but it now seems it's been spoilt by the attempt to cover up the inate elevn weaknesses.
Now this is probably my second favourite list out the lot, to me it seems exactly what you would expect from a Eshin army. The special rules are great, the extra VP for assassinating characters is perfect ^_^ the abailty to transport units in BTB contact with skitterleap is a great idea too, it makes those assassins all the more important and makes sure your opponent will do everything they can to stop it from going off. The last one is my favourite "Under Cover Of Darkness", brilliant it is. The only real way a true assassin would choose to fight, even more so that they are skaven.
Now no real changes to the main list except that Night Runners are mainstay and not clanrats, which was basically to be expected. Now the new characters, first the Sorcerer. This rat is basically a weak version of the assassin but still has all their tool available to them (two poisoned HWs and throwing stars) but also gets to cast spells, the spell in this case isn't warplightning. Oh no, for that doesn't employ stealth. But the sorcerer now get to use Skitterleap, which is a great idea to allow them to teleport them into a room where they kill and then can be teleported out again (the way it should be ). Then the Master Assassin, this rat is like an assassin on steroids. Faster, stronger and better equipped than your average one, given an magic weapon he becomes even more deadly. A great addition and very fluffy too. Now my favourite unit of the list, the Triad. This is basically three assassins formed into one group, no magic items or anything but still very deadly non the less. If your aiming to get the extra VPs from character deaths then this is the unit you want, between them they have 12 poisoned attacks. Not much will stand a chance against that, especially that lone mage out in the open.
So IMO a great list, adds something to an otherwise normal swarm skaven army. Second best one out of the lot (behind the slayer one of course), and should be very fun to see on the tabletop.
I won't say anything about the Cult Of Ulric being as they have already been released and are a nice change to the normal gunline Empire armies.
So these are my thoughts on the lists, so feel free to disagree and what have you. But for me in all most lists are ok, with a few bad eggs and very few diamonds. But whichever list you choose to use, good luck and may whatever god you worship watch over you
I like pretty much all the lists with the exception of the seaguard (Very badly done if i do say so myself.)
Ask not the ruleboys a question for they shall give you three answers each true and terrifying to behold
My personal favourite list is the Eshin one. Hordes of low ranking rats sent on suicidal charges while the elite sneak around and complete objectives? Sounds distinctively like a WW2 Russian army.
I also agree that the HE navy list is very bad. How can they expect to hold a decent battleline?
My problem with the High Elf Navy list is that it seems to be rather hit or miss. For example there free turn of unmodified shooting will harm certain armies. (Elf empire and Skaven) while prove somewhat inefective against others either because of armour (Chaos and Bretonians) or they can just revive any troops you manage to kill (Both undead) and since the army dosent have any fast flanking units and very few hard hitting close combat units it really does have to rely on its shooting.
Ask not the ruleboys a question for they shall give you three answers each true and terrifying to behold
There must be someone brave (or foolish) enough to try to use a HE naval army effectively! :lol:
They could use the Merwryms as breakthrough units (in conjunction with something else).
I'm plannning on starting a Cult of Slaanesh army. Any thoughts on that?
Plenty will try the list, I mean an army firing a ton of shots before it evem starts. Imagine 4 RBT,and lots of SG units etc.. It has the potentional to wipe out a good few units before it begins, but I just don't like the list. It's too weak, it's a pure shooty army. The only combat they have is from the merwerm, other than that most units don't stand much of a chance.
Well you know my thoughts of the CoP list, and I'm not keen on it. It seems much too much chaos-ifyed, I think it would have been better if only slannesh daemons, chaos warriors and knights were allowed. I don't like the devoted, witch elves without the benefits of posion. And before you all say "but the 1/2 WS" yes, but if anything actually hits it's basically bye-bye devoted. No save, weak T they won't be lasting long. And they don't hit all that hard, S3. Now they get the bonuses of WEs just without the frenzy part, and they loose the chance to wound anything automatically (ie posion). I'd much prefer to have the chance to kill things than not get hit.
Like I said, they're not Witch Elves and nor should they be. Personally, I am limiting myself to only one or two units of Mortals. I'm staying well away from Marauders.
By the way King, what army do you play? (fantasy wise)
I know they're not witch elves, well they basically are just with different skills I just don't like them, but they do fit the Slannesh theme though.
And for my armies I play Dwarves (9000pts) and High Elves (about 2500pts).
Uh oh, I'm gettin the urge to collect a small Sea Patrol force. STOP ME!
I had a weird idea of having an extremely expensive Dark Rider unit as follows:
6 Dark Riders with rep crossbows, Mark of Slaanesh, musician and Soul Shadows Standard.
Now that's a perfect tempting unit. All you have to do to destroy it is to shoot a couple of arrows at it though...