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So I am aware from the Empire FAQ that the Casket is able to steal an incantation and it is cast at power lv based on who it was taking from.
"Q. Can Aldred's Casket of Sorcery steal Incantations from the Tomb Kings army? If yes, at what power level are the Incantations released?
A. Yes. The Incantations are released at power level 2D6 for one stolen from a Priest, 3d6 for one stolen from a High Priest, or D6 for one stolen from a Tomb Prince/King"
-Empire FAQ pg3. Left Column bottom.
So this raises a few concerns...
"Horekhah's Incantation of Righteous Smiting
Target one of your own Undead units within 12"...."
"Djedra's Incantation of Summoning
Target one of your own Undead units within 12"...."
"Mankara's Incantation of Urgency
Target one of your own Undead units within 12"..."
-Tomb kings Army book, pg 37.
So it is clear from the FAQ that he may steal the spell then use it, but in the case of these incantations, part of the spell is the targeting aspect of one of your own Undead units, meaning does the casket basically remove / change parts of the spell in order to be able to cast it, which would be really f*@$ing dumb.
Also if the casket "steals" Urgency from a priest, and it is removed later, will not only my priest whom it was taken from forget it, or will everyone forget it, namely the other priest or a king / prince.
Okay about the first part, it's a bit of a difficult question. but i think you just can't cast those spells. These spells are really focussed on dead skeletons and the such, but your men are all still alive. so i think it would be bad luck for you. Though it would still be a huge advantage if you can steal his spells from him, weakening him in the core of its army.
About the forgetting part:
Only the bearer of the spell will lose it. just read the description of the magic item -sloowly- and you'll see
'Its better to have a swordmaster and not need her help, then to need her help and not have her'
Byjugo's WIP Thread
If you steal a spell that targets only your undead units, and you have no undead units, the spell will just fizzle out when it is released from the casket. It doesn't suddenly change to benifit your troops, the spell is cast as it is written.
I think that's as wrong as >>insensitive analogy self-censored<<! I play both Empire and TK, and in no way do I think that the casket should work on incantations. If TK are supposed to have an ancient separate magic system (no epic fail possible, frinstance), then the casket shouldn't work. If the way in which the TKs harness the winds of magic is similar enough for the casket to successfully steal and release a spell, then it really shouldn't be a separate system, just a separate spell list, a la VC. Of course, that would mean stripping the kings and princes of their casting ability and really just completely redoing the whole army from scratch, since the incantation system really is the soul of the army book...let's hope that some sanity returns in the next empire FAQ, the next BRB, or the next TK army book that makes clear that incantations aren't spells, and that therefore anything targeting a spell doesn't work.
What I'd really like to see is a relationship where TK can't have scrolls, scrolls don't work on TK magic (but all sources of DD are still good to go, including MR), and the TK army book (or the BRB ) contains a magic item that every opponent can take. It would be included in every army book by reference in the TK/BRB. It would be fairly powerful against TK, but useless against all others, and the cost would have to be balanced between its potential power and the likelihood of actually facing a TK list. Since TK is mostly support magic, protecting the bearer against being targeted by TK magic wouldn't be useful. It would have to create a bubble inside which TK magic simply doesn't work or maybe needs an irresistible force roll (still wouldn't count as irresistible force, would simply be the roll needed to get the incantation off) to work. Pretty powerful, but situational. Say, 40points if it has a 12" bubble, 55 points if it's an 18" bubble? I think the 50 point range would be about right, and the 5-10 point offset would limit the more powerful version to lords (I'm not suggesting that both be available, just that you set the range and cost depending on whether you want heroes to be able to take the item). Of course, if the item is a banner...
Anyway, I think it's fundamentally wrong for TK and "other" magics to be as compatible as GW is making them. Same thing for priestly prayers. At least in terms of the prayers, mages would be passingly familiar with their mechanics, but having a dispel scroll block a TK incantation is like asking a nuclear reactor engineer rebuild an internal combustion engine. Basic principles of physics (winds of magic) are the same, but the design principles involved are completely foreign. If a dispel scroll's purpose is to insert graphite rods between fuel rods (standard magic=nuclear power plant) ...How is that useful in shutting down a boiler in a coal-fired power plant (TK magic)? Yes, both systems harness the winds of magic, but how they do so is allegedly completely different. Even Nagash took many months to understand DE magic well enough to defeat some run-of-the-mill elves... The reason that I think DD shouldn't be affected by this incompatibility is that DD are used in a contest of wills. I don't necessarily need to know how your spell works to know that it won't be good for me. If I overpower your mind with my own and slap you in a mental straightjacket, you aren't casting anything. At that point, any difference in the mechanics of my magic and yours are irrelevant. There is no contest of wills in the use of a scroll (or a brooch, that should only work against other TK), it simply interferes in the mechanics of the spell it's disabling. It's as if using DD were two trucks set against each other front bumper to front bumper, trying to push one another, and using a dispel scroll is reaching underneath and cutting the fuel line.
Last edited by Marnepup; January 19th, 2010 at 17:11.
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