The Deff Rolla Petition

[KingCracker]

Im basically here to spread the word about the Deff Rolla petition.
Everyone knows how bad the debates get over weather or not it is used on infantry only, or vehicles as well.
So naturally Ive taken it upon myself to make an online petition. All you have to do is click the link, provide the information (click on the skip for the sites donators) and your signature will be on the list. Im wanting to hit 500 signatures and then send it away to Games Workshop. It might not do anything, then again it might just give us what we want.

Thanks everyone!
LETS GET GAMESWORKSHOP TO MAKE A RULING ALREADY!!!
The Deff Rolla Petition (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/the-deff-rolla-petition)

[camarodragon]

Why not start a petition that they FAQ everything else that theyve left open ended and gets debated as often as cows fart.

GW needs to pull thier head out of the sand and get to work on dozens of questions and issues, not just this one. Sorry dont mean to rain on your parade..:thunder:

[The Prince of Excess]

Why do you need a petition? I comfortably say it doesn't work on vehicles because if it did it would be absurdly over-powered and the only way to play Orks would be 3 Battlewagons with Deff Rollas.

I've seen arguments over Deff Rollas but never that it can be used in ramming except online, seems like wishful thinking by Ork players.

Good luck getting GW to do something about anything though, that'd be godly.

[KingCracker]

Firstly, I agree that GW has TONS of rules that they need to FAQ, thats a no brainer. But asking them to fix ALL of them now is like asking god to prove he exists, it just wont happen. BUT asking them to fix one seems more feesable.

Secondly, I play Orks, infact I would say I totally LOVE playing Orks. However much I agree with you that you cannot use a deff rolla on a vehicle, LOTS of people beleive you can, mainly because the online community has a LOT of people that say you can. This just further overpowers the Orks, and further gives them a bad rep. I dont like that because as stated previously, I love the Orks.

Im not asking alot from this, it literally takes about 15secs to fill the petition out, and your done. Im hoping that this will show GW that maybe they should take another look at what WE want as a community, not just more sales for them, seeing as we pay their salaries and such, from buying what should be a completed (mostly) game.

Thanks guys

[KingCracker]

Just giving an update.


The first 2 days of the petition were pretty good. I got 45 in the first 24 hours. The second day started slowing, and now its at a snails crawl. It seems that only a few 40k forums out there are actually allowing me to post my petition link.
So now Ive been helped out by a friendly mod at heresy online (wont name names incase they get in trouble) So I have to now check for PMs and send them the link. Thank god this is one of the forums that is allowing me to at least try to get GW to fix some rules openly.
Cmon guys/gals, we all know that GW needs to fix some rules, and sitting around doing nothing isnt going to get the ball moving. Tell your friends, your family, especially your gaming buddies. These rules effect everyone that plays the game.
So keep on signing everyone! We need to get a ruling,FAQ, INAT faq, something.
Thanks everyone!

[KingCracker]

Well the signatures are slowing down alot. Alot of forums seem to be completely biased and have stopped my attempts on this petition on all fronts. I cant even receive PMs about the petition. Which is fine because I was banned on one site just for bringing it up.
So cmon guys if you really want something done about rules you need to help out! I cant be the only person that plays 40K that wants some clear rules written.Tell your friends, and pass it along at other sites if you want. You dont need my permission to do so lol

[The Prince of Excess]

I'd make peace with it man. There are frankly bigger rules in dispute that come up more often and are harder to solve. Anyone trying to use Deff Rollas on Rams are blatantly power-gaming, it's a non-issue in my mind.

GW is not going to listen to a petition, there is no history of them doing that to my knowledge, they don't go back and update FAQs to my knowledge and a few of the bigger Indy's have rules on this which is good enough for me.

It's cool you want to help the game but look at GWs customer service track record, it's not going to happen. That may sound defeatist but I know the company pretty well and it's not how they do business from what I've seen over more than a few years, sadly. Don't get yourself banned from anymore forums or deal with the grief.

[KingCracker]

To you it may very well be a non issue. And personally Ive never heard of anyone doing a petition for anything on rules. Ive come across alot of things, and not once have I ever heard of "well so and so tried a petition once"
I think it is an issue that needs to be corrected. I play Orks, and Im sure ALOT of people either play them, or play against them. Any self respecting Ork player will take the rolla, its dirt cheap and can do alot of damage. Saying this isnt an issue is funny to me. It comes up alot, anytime someone plays against an Ork player that has one, it will come up.
The 80 some people that have signed it so far seem to agree with me. Infact there would be ALOT more signatures if the mods and admins on the problems sites, would just let me give it my best shot. Its all I can do, is try my best. Its been so bad on some of these sites, I really think they have some kind of fear of being mentioned to GW for just participating.

So again, if you think this is a waste of your time, then thats fine, you dont have to sign the petition. Just roll your eyes, make a wise crack, whatever gets you past it fine. But if it sounds like something you want, or even if you dont play Orks, you just think GW SHOULD post some updated FAQs then please sign away. Send it to a buddy, tell you gaming group about it. GW not doing timely FAQs is total crap to us as hobbyists.

[The Prince of Excess]

Just chill on the holier than thou routine for a sec. I made no cracks, I did no eye rolls. The fact is you'd need a tidal wave of people to do anything and there are bigger rules issues than the Deff Rolla one, that's a bottom line fact as well.

Just chill, stop acting like this is a national security incident and you have no problem from me. Good luck, I hope stuff like this works sometimes.

[Frank Fugger]

I've seen arguments over Deff Rollas but never that it can be used in ramming except online, seems like wishful thinking by Ork players.


What he said. The people who run the UK GT agree as well.


Instead of a "let's make this cheesy poo legal" petition, start a "let's have a new Codex please with options for killing vehicles so we don't have to resort to rules-lawyering our Deffrollas" petition.

[shango]

Just chill on the holier than thou routine for a sec. I made no cracks, I did no eye rolls. The fact is you'd need a tidal wave of people to do anything and there are bigger rules issues than the Deff Rolla one, that's a bottom line fact as well.

Just chill, stop acting like this is a national security incident and you have no problem from me. Good luck, I hope stuff like this works sometimes.
It is you PoE, whom seems to be pulling the "holier than thou". The last word isn't as good as the last laugh.

@ KingCracker-why don't you start a thread on this over at Rogue Market? I don't believe anyone there will ban you for it-could net you a few more sigs..

Good Luck.

[KingCracker]

Shango - Hey thanks, I never thought about that one. Thanks. Ill set up an account there and all that fun jive tomorrow (just drove a total of 5 hours to take the kids to the detroit zoo lol)

PoE - I never once started acting holier then anyone. If you want to look back at the beginning of this thread, it was you that has been trying to get me to stop my petition from the get go. Like Ive said, if you dont like my idea of a petition thats fine man. If you want to start your OWN petition, I can give you some good website links and such and even sign whatever you make up. But if your not going to sign it, then please stop coming into my thread, and bashing it and saying its a wasted effort.

Frank Fugger - Thats cool man. But lets be realistic, trying to get GW to fix one rule is possible. But asking them to REMAKE an ENTIRE codex, that in most peoples opinions is pretty much an A-ok dex, is just crazy. They wouldnt write a codex if we had the whole population of Michigan and Texas sign a petition. Really Im just tackling the major rule mess up in this dex. Other then that, non really come to mind.

[Wicky]

Um, what is the argument that it does support Ramming because I can’t see that it does in any way, shape or form?

Cheers.

P.S. Signed your petition anyway.

[Frank Fugger]

Wicky - Because Ramming is a "special type of tank shock", so people leap on that with the old "when is an apple not an apple?" argument and suddenly Deffrollas work on vehicles. They don't.


Frank Fugger - Thats cool man. But lets be realistic, trying to get GW to fix one rule is possible. But asking them to REMAKE an ENTIRE codex, that in most peoples opinions is pretty much an A-ok dex, is just crazy. They wouldnt write a codex if we had the whole population of Michigan and Texas sign a petition. Really Im just tackling the major rule mess up in this dex. Other then that, non really come to mind.

Fair enough. As long as you're willing to accept that when clarification does come it's likely to rule that Deffrollas DON'T work on vehicles, because they don't, then all is good.

[KingCracker]

Well I try not to give my opinion on the rulings simply, to no mucky up the petition. Im an Ork player, yet I too believe it does NOT work against vehicles. You wouldnt believe how many flame wars Ive seen after you say
ramming is for vehicles
tank shock is for troops
But people that are all gung hoe for it hulk smashing vehicles just go bananas. If you ask a person that believes it hits vehicles as well, they will open a whole can of worms and rules lawyering on how it DOES. Again tho, this is why I think its a pretty important rule to get fixed, as stated above IM AN ORK PLAYER. Obviously Im not going to be so dedicated if some space marine rule is busted, unless it affects me personally.
I would, if this works better then I hope, try on another issue after this one is resolved. Who Knows I might just do one weather this works or not. All Im doing is TRYING to help out this hobby. Im not a crusade against GW or anything of that nature. I just think we deserve some rule clarifications.

Also thanks everyone once again that have been signing the petition!

[pilot00]

I had sent once a petition for a small clarification to the DA codex(something not mentioned in the faq)Lets see....5 months and no answer.I wouldnt hope anything in your place,but the positive thinking you make and your energy are a good thing.If only more ppl acted like that and showed them that we are not $$ only it would be nice.

[Xpyre35]

This one seems really cut and dry. However, if you are encountering people who believe this tactic is valid. You're better off not even engaging them in a game. Even if your answer is "Everybody here wants to play it that way" I would highly suggest you play with some friends who play correctly, or play at another gaming center.

If its in a tournament, and you just have to play, then know how its going to be ruled, and apply tactics accordingly. I have yet to see a legitimate tournament rule that Deff rollas' work during a ram.

[Krovin-Rezh]

Make a petition like this that covers a list of all the worst rules problems in 40K, and I bet you will get a lot more signatures. And the end result would have a better chance of making an impact upon GW (though your chances are good regardless).

BTW, I don't see a problem with letting deff rollas attack vehicles. The Battlewagon has to get to the vehicle first to make any use of it.

[shango]

For the last two days I've been mucking around with 2 GW deth rolla sprues, trying to get one of them to fit on a kitbash killa kan I am making.

I have to tell you; the GW kit is zoggin' 'uge! I don't know the ruling officially, but it is hard to imagine that something that big and spiky, (I cut my thumb putting the thing together by jiminy!), isn't meant to damage vehicles-yet the powerklaw can..

Nothing is true scale-I know.

anyway, something to think about.

[KingCracker]

Well like I mentioned, asking GW to change a list of things will just get scoffed at. They wont take the time to update a big ol list. Again, if you guys want to take up your free time in doing a petition the way your talking, go for it. Ill give ya websites and even sign them for ya.
The deff rolla is what I wanted to do to contribute :soldier:

[xilton]

I think the ruling is quite obvious. Infantry only or whatever unit can do a suicidal blow to the tank. Just mentionning this rules out tanks and tank shock by specifying "unit" in this ruling as being infantry only or what ever can do a suicidal blow..

[KingCracker]

Ok well like Ive said many times already, its doesnt matter how clear you think the ruling is, there is still a large debate over it from both sides. And GW seems to want nothing to do with providing clear answers.
So if you want to have a chance at getting GW to make some updated and clear rules then please, sign the petition


As for an update, we are at 117 votes, so a tad more then a 5th of what Im shooting for by late December. So remember to tell your friends and gaming buddies about this petition!

[Krovin-Rezh]

Well like I mentioned, asking GW to change a list of things will just get scoffed at. They wont take the time to update a big ol list. Again, if you guys want to take up your free time in doing a petition the way your talking, go for it. Ill give ya websites and even sign them for ya.
The deff rolla is what I wanted to do to contribute :soldier:

A petition with only a few signatures will get scoffed at too. Having more issues that more people want fixed will get more of them to sign.