I just read this and I would like to know if it's true....
If it is, I guess they can't allow any SoB, SM or IG armies in their stores anymore since the entire imperium is fascist......
So I was kinda surprised when I read this, and I don't really think its true, is it?

Where on Terra did you read this??? That is absolutly ridiculous!! :huh:

I dont think thats true cos the Imperium are a bunch of Xenophobic facists!

Nope not true no way money grubbers like GW would do that.

What on earth were you smoking when you made this up?

Hes probably talking about "fascist" themed armies, like a Nazi Germany IG army or Panzer armored company,etc...

I think the rumour you heard was probably regarding all the nazi themed IG armies that people have been comming up with.I haven't heard those are banned,but then again I never play in official GW stores so could be...

There is a ban on Nazi themed armies.
Not Nazi themed in composition or tactics, but those incorporating the Swastika or stormtroopers with SS armbands and such.

who owuld want to put those on their guys anyway...they lost!

its like putting confederate flags on stuff, they lost!

its a jinx and it is offensive to some people

I think Jasper raises the most poignant point...they lost :P.

Would using the Wehrmact cross(or the Iron Cross) on your minis count too? Or is it just the swastika?

Originally posted by jasper@Dec 6 2004, 21:47
its like putting confederate flags on stuff, they lost!
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you cant say that because you couldent have lost if the war isnt over!!

THE SOUTH SHALL RISE AGAIN!!!!!


(and for all that find this offensive, this has nothing to do with raceism, just states right vs "bigbrother" and preserving your way of life(NOT SLAVER< THERE WAS OTHER REASONS) aginst a invader)

~Joe

Originally posted by Corvid@Dec 7 2004, 09:52
Would using the Wehrmact cross(or the Iron Cross) on your minis count too?Â* Or is it just the swastika?
267938

No, because you could claim it was World War 1-themed. Even the modern-day German armed forces use the Wehrmacht cross. It was agreed tacitly (along with US, UK and French roundels, Japanese rising sun and (later) Russian red star) as a symbol to put on air-force planes, being easier to recognise from a distance than the national flags. And do GW mind the hammer and sickle? IG are basically the WWII Red Army, but some Russians whose ancestors suffered under Stalin could be offended.
its like putting confederate flags on stuff, they lost!
The Stars and Bars are reserved for the pick-up trukks of backwoodz Orks!

Phew, was getting worried then. My Cadians wear grey armour and flak jackets, but the only insignia they have is the aquila.

Originally posted by Baron_Fredrick_von_Helsing@Dec 7 2004, 11:46
you cant say that because you couldent have lost if the war isnt over!!

THE SOUTH SHALL RISE AGAIN!!!!!
(and for all that find this offensive, this has nothing to do with raceism, just states right vs "bigbrother" and preserving your way of life(NOT SLAVER< THERE WAS OTHER REASONS) aginst a invader)

~Joe
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dude, the war has been over for 140 years...let it go

i do agree with some of what you are saying about big brother and all that jazz

Originally posted by Corianis@Dec 7 2004, 09:01
There is a ban on Nazi themed armies.
Not Nazi themed in composition or tactics, but those incorporating the Swastika or stormtroopers with SS armbands and such.
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Oh damn, I'll have to paint over my terminator's shoulder pad. What about the little moustache on my force commander? :hmm:

PS, for anyone who finds it offensive and for the people who banned it I think they are crazy. For some old people who fought in the war, ok maybe. But for the rest of us it is just history and shouldn't be banned. I mean should the Imperial Eagle be banned because it is based on Ancient Rome who conquered most of the world and actually occupied places such as England, which the Nazis failed to do?

You can think of a thousand crazy dictators and conquerors throughout history who were seen as 'evil' but it doesn't mean they should be banned from all discussions and possible themes.

though it is actually GW's own fault that people did/do these armies because the models looks so damn alike german troops sometimes, and their names.

Death Crops of Kreig
Steel Legion

GW's fault! >.<

we can bring up something that always pops up in this kind of discussions.
How about the Sovietunion? With Valhallans you can theme it towards that.

And Stalin killled more people then Hitler you know.
But Nooo, he help the Good Guys in WWII so its nothing wrong with that! :rolleyes:

I myself have made a SM chapter that has the colour of the German Imperial Flagg from WWI.
Is it something wrong with that? they are just germans. :)

/Cheers

Originally posted by sithjack@Dec 6 2004, 22:28
Nope not true no way money grubbers like GW would do that.
267188


Well, at that time, nothing.
The rest of the time; NEDERWIET :D

Would using the Wehrmact cross(or the Iron Cross) on your minis count too? Or is it just the swastika?
267825


I don't think so, they use the Iron Cross on Black Templars as well......

Its silly, he is gone forever. Hitler was an ***** but hes dead and once *****s are dead they stop throwing crap out(pun intended). GW literaelly based the Imperuim on Rome,they had evil emperors(Ultras are kinda based on them and their popular!)Soviet Union, Stalin,typical dictator,Nazi Germany they had the worst so if GW did that they are sill coz the 40k universe is based on dictators!

And another question: If I where to paint night goblins white with thingies covering their faces, a red painted champion, and a crossholding standard bearer.. Would it be banned?

hahahaha
good idea
maybe a stone thrower that throws burning black Empire troops into the enemies ranks to expand that army?

Ok Skutch I would watch what your typing, people could get insulted!
Im suprised no-ones cares about the Soviet Union, they killed people they were Public enemy no.1 for a while.

IG are DEFINITELY WWII red army. The Penal Legion comes from then. The Russian penal battalions were marched across a minefield to clear the mines. They were then pardoned (mostly posthumously). And the Commissars who hang around at the back with a pistol to kill anyone who runs is also a Soviet invention.

Originally posted by NurgleWarlord@Dec 8 2004, 13:14
Ok Skutch I would watch what your typing, people could get insulted!
Im suprised no-ones cares about the Soviet Union, they killed people they were Public enemy no.1 for a while.
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The stone thrower idea- I agree, it's wrong. The rest: calling the Ku Klux Klan fanatical Goblins insults THEM.

Ok, Idea for unit. And NO, NO STONETHROWER THROWING BURNING BLACK PEOPLE! Try to be subtle, damnit, not all out 'We hate 'em niggers!'.

Krazy Koboldz Klan
White robes with red robed champion
Wooden cross for standard
The standard flag saying 'WE HATE BLACK orcs

I might do that as a second night goblin unit when i expand to 3000 points. Need your opinions first if it's offensive first though.

I see no reason why someone should stick swastikas all over their models other than to be an insensitive ****!

I mean anyone who does is probably some stupid little ***** who thinks he is being so clever by going against political correctness.

In reality the swastika remains a symbol of racial hatred that is still used today by many hate groups.

Speaking as one of those groups that the Swastika stands against I am offended when someone waves it around in my face.

Go Deadly Nightshade! Its not funny the Black Orc joke u could offend someone.

Originally posted by WiCkEdRock@Dec 8 2004, 21:41
Ok, Idea for unit. And NO, NO STONETHROWER THROWING BURNING BLACK PEOPLE! Try to be subtle, damnit, not all out 'We hate 'em niggers!'.
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Man, I was kidding, I thought the 'hahaha' would make that clear.
As for white & red robes, burning crosses, and so on.....
YEAH, REAL SUBTLE..... :glare:

So they are only going to have good guy armies that , right after you get done setting up across from each other, sign a peace treaty and you have to pack it up and go home 'cause good guys don't fight good guys???!!!???!!!

Sheesh!!

I highly doubt they would ban any armies. OK, if someone has an army based on a Nuremberg rally then it's very bad taste, but banning an army would open up a whole can of worms. I mean, what's next? The Catachans? They are clearly based on American troops in Vietnam, and go ask the Vietnamese how many millions were killed by them during the war (not to mention Laos and Cambodia).

They'd have to take out just about every imperial model......
except for the SoB I guess......although, those confessors, what about the crusades
and you could go on, and on, and on
the game's called WARhammer
in war, people get killed and hurt, and most likely offended
if you don't want to offend anyone, don't play a wargame

I personally will be offended at whatever I *****ing want to be!

If someone were to use Nazi Space Marines against me who was fully aware of my family orgins then I would break the *****'s teeth with a metal pole.

Why you ask?
my answer: you can not have war without people getting hurt

I can't see WHY people would want to put swastikas and such all over their models. 40K is set 21 milleniums after Hitler's reign of terror came to an end. Besides that, as far as the Impys go they wouldn't even DARE to have anything other than the aquila stamped on their armour- after all, the Imperium is fascist and autocratic. You're fighting for the emperor- not adolf hitler or whoever.

Originally posted by Deadly Nightshade@Dec 9 2004, 00:36
If someone were to use Nazi Space Marines against me who was fully aware of my family orgins then I would break the *****'s teeth with a metal pole.
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GREAT IDEA!
That way you won't make you point clear at all, and offend other people in turn.

I don't hate anyone from a background that's not 'white' because of that, but what if I said all agressive blacks/spics/asians/whateveryouare should drop dead? Would that offend you?
Nazi's were taking things like ethnical origins waaaaay to serious, guess what you're doing now?

For the love of..somebody please lock this? Everytime this "Facist Army" issue is raised it degenerates into a flame war,and this one has already started heating up.

GW says you can't do it,so you can't do it in thier stores.If you want Nazi IG,play them at home where nobody cares.

hehe, did you know that the swastica was a tibet religious icon and had nothing to do with germans or war, i guess there are tibettan temples with swastica's all over em.

wow, check this out, gotta love dictionary.com

A symbol or ornament in the form of a Greek cross with the ends of the arms at right angles all in the same direction, and each prolonged to the height of the parallel arm of the cross. A great many modified forms exist, ogee and volute as well as rectilinear, while various decorative designs, as Greek fret or meander, are derived from or closely associated with it. The swastika is found in remains from the Bronze Age in various parts of Europe, esp. at Hissarlik (Troy), and was in frequent use as late as the 10th century. It is found in ancient Persia, in India, where both Jains and Buddhists used (or still use) it as religious symbol, in China and Japan, and among Indian tribes of North, Central, and South America. It is usually thought to be a charm, talisman, or religious token, esp. a sign of good luck or benediction. Max M["u]Ller distinguished from the swastika, with arms prolonged to the right, the suavastika, with arms prolonged to the left, but this distinction is not commonly recognized. Other names for the swastika are fylfot and gammadion.


hehe, what an evil symbol huh?

Originally posted by Corianis@Dec 6 2004, 17:31
There is a ban on Nazi themed armies.
Not Nazi themed in composition or tactics, but those incorporating the Swastika or stormtroopers with SS armbands and such.
267398


Darn, Now I'm not gunna play them. I hate the imperium and there are only 2 ways I would ever play with IG:
1. Nazi themed, not nessecarily with the swastika, but with red armbands and looking quite nazi like, but instead of a swastika some sort of imperial Symbol.
2. Chaos converted, using IG rules but models and fluff that is chaos/renagade.

So that probubly eliminates the most favored of the two, infact at one time I was thinking of doing both, but with a half blak half white skull. So wait, if you were to not incorperate the swastika on the models, could you still do the whole red armbands and red flags and whatnot?

I personally beleive that these sorta armies are okay... up to a point. Its all good and great to have Wermacht/Red Army etc. style fluffed lists... as long as you aren't annoying about it. I'd glady play a nazi style list, but i would tear his head off if he started badmouthin' jews.

Originally posted by Skutch - Space Wolf@Dec 8 2004, 23:45
GREAT IDEA!
That way you won't make you point clear at all, and offend other people in turn.

I don't hate anyone from a background that's not 'white' because of that, but what if I said all agressive blacks/spics/asians/whateveryouare should drop dead? Would that offend you?
Nazi's were taking things like ethnical origins waaaaay to serious, guess what you're doing now?
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I said anyone who "knew of my background" hence anyone who still did it would be provoking me, any player who makes an army to antagonize other players should drop down dead.

If it were a tournament army where the player hand never met me before I would not care.

For the record I am Chechen

this means

I have been called-
a Terrorist
a Commie
a Black Widow
Osama's girlfriend


I have been Told to-
go back to Russia (ironically it would probably be worse if i went there)
blow myself up
stop stealing English Jobs
stop claiming English benefits


I have had a swastika spray painted on my car and my apartment door before now

oh and I have really bad PMS during the Christmas season!

so do you really have any right to tell not to get angry?

thought not

So come on, someone makes a themed army and you get all psyched up. I'm sure they aren't trying to antagonize you, but you would think that judging from your reaction here. I didn't cover my army in swastikas nor do I wave them in peoples faces, I made a couple on shoulder pads to see how they looked.

I can't see WHY people would want to put swastikas and such all over their models. 40K is set 21 milleniums after Hitler's reign of terror came to an end.

And by the same logic why do they still have the Imperial Eagle of Rome which was 2000 years before Hitler even?

I'm not going to say more than this, the thread has degenerated and will clearly be locked so best not offend others. You know my view, get over it, Hitler is dead, I am not a racist and I'm sorry if you cop racist remarks, but even if I knew you I would not give you any because that is wrong, basing an army on something historical, even recently, doesn't seem bad to me.

Abaddon is a far worse dictator than Hitler too, he destroyed entire planets. The 40k world is worse than the history people theme their armies on...

chechen? is that the check republic? my pop's went to the check republic about a month ago, brought back photo's and man, the girls there were hot! all exotic and sensual lookin. also some of the coolest archatecture i ever seen, i got a framed picture of some church backlit by the moon partially covered with clouds with more cityscape in back, very dark and gothic, the type of picture that if you look hard enough you'd expect to find the outline of a lycanthrope howling.

people are stupid, we need as many russian women in america as possible. there great. and russian accent so sexy. ivona vonavich mmmm, just say it out loud, you'll see. but the russians looked alot different than the check's so now i'm confused. where are you from?

The Nazis were evil. Pure and simple. The symbols that they used are still used to this day by political extremists to evoke the terror of those times that are still in the living memory of many people still alive.

Its deliberate stupidity as displayed by some of the correspondents on this thread that makes me fear that fascism could come back into national politics, because people refuse to learn lessons from recent history.

Look at what is currently happening politically in the Netherlands and the United States, and compare it to the environment that allowed National Socialism (Nazism) to expand in Germany in the 1920s and 1930s. The parallels are far too similar for comfort.

No, all Nazi themed armies that are painted as a glorification of Nazi supremacy should not be allowed in official Games Workshop venues, and personally I'd like to give any cretins who do not understand the implications a Brown Shirt style re-education.

I got an army themed around the Soviet Red Army from WW2, Stalingrad in particular. I loved reading the history about the battle and the way the Russians refused to retreat no matter how many casualties they suffered. I respected their bravery and loyalty and saw a perfect chance for a guard army: lots of lightly armoured, poorly equiped troops backed up by very heavy tanks fighting in a destroyed city, using lots of conscripts and commissars... I do not condone what Stalin did, but I do respect the Russians from WW2, since it was they who took Berlin!

I despise Nazi's too, as I lost step-relatives in Aushwitz... If soemone wants to build an army of them, it would just give me more of an insentive to want to beat them...

"Its deliberate stupidity as displayed by some of the correspondents on this thread that makes me fear that fascism could come back into national politics, because people refuse to learn lessons from recent history."-Hard Aun

What lesson would that be?

Originally posted by Rengaw@Dec 8 2004, 19:28
chechen? is that the check republic? my pop's went to the check republic about a month ago, brought back photo's and man, the girls there were hot! all exotic and sensual lookin. 269607



:wub: Agreed.I had the great fortune of dating a foriegn exchange student from the Czech Republic (Monika was her name..*fond sigh*) for 6 monthes back in 9th grade,back when I lived in Athens GA.I'd definitely recommend dating woman from the former Soviet Union,she was very pretty,and very acrobatic,and the relationship was very very fun up untill the point she got addicted to drugs (can't quite remember which one..heroine maybe) and broke up with me.

:( <---sad Edi

Back on topic now though...i still think it was a good idae to ban Nazi armies.I mean seriously it's maybe a clever and unique idea if you see one Nazi seemed army,but at this point it seems people are doing it just to be arseholes and see how offencive they can be without getting in trouble.

"Back on topic now though...i still think it was a good idae to ban Nazi armies.I mean seriously it's maybe a clever and unique idea if you see one Nazi seemed army,but at this point it seems people are doing it just to be arseholes and see how offencive they can be without getting in trouble."-Edicius

As opposed to all of the people doing soviet themed armies out of their sense of appreciation for history.

Er..no actualy but seeing as how we're focused on the Issues of IG Nazis and the use of thier symbols I fugured talking abouy Nazi armies would be more relevant to the conversation.But since we're going to be specific now any army that represents something that is offensive to a large number of people has no place in a GW store,where many different types of people from many different cultures gather.If you can justify emulating a certain group of people in your amry great,fine,feel free to do it all you want.Just don't expect others to accept or recieve your work the way you want them to. It's better for everyone if you keep the army at home.

Originally posted by YourHeadASplode@Dec 9 2004, 06:49
"Back on topic now though...i still think it was a good idae to ban Nazi armies.I mean seriously it's maybe a clever and unique idea if you see one Nazi seemed army,but at this point it seems people are doing it just to be arseholes and see how offencive they can be without getting in trouble."-Edicius

As opposed to all of the people doing soviet themed armies out of their sense of appreciation for history.
269947

I grant you that Stalin had progroms and purges of various ethnic and social groups during the 1930s, which are are less well known than Hitlers mass extermination programmes. But the Nazis took it to greater extremes, and the deliberate murder of many millions of Jews and other 'undesirables' is what is 'celebrated' by the modern Fascist movements in our own countries, such as the National Front in the United Kingdom.

The worry about Fascism is that, with clever propaganda, it can become a popular democratic movement. Hitler's Nazi party was voted in by a popular democratic election. Stalins was not, it was basically imposed by military force on the populous of Russia. Therefore of the two totalitarian systems, all democratic countries already have the mechanism of allowing a Nazi style government to become elected. A Soviet style takeover would require a hiatus following a popular armed uprising and a civil war.

And this is the lesson that should be learnt by the people of Westernised countries, that fear-based propaganda on an 'us and them' theme can be used to elect more and more extremist governments, that can get closer and closer to the model of Nazi style Fascism.

(incidentally, YourHeadASplode, click the Quote button in, and then press Reply, it makes a better post)

Chechnya, not the Check republic. It's an Islamic country under Russian control that is trying to get its independance back.

Okay the Nazis had evil race policies. They were better to their own people than the Russian Communists were, they won the vote for a reason. I am in no way a Nazi but none of you are thinking. The Nazis lost the war because they were massively outnumbered. Reasons to have a Nazi army:
1. They had one of the coolest looking uniforms ever that fits in very well with 40k.
2. They were excellent soldiers, 1 German was worth like 2 Americans or 6 Russians.
3. The Waffen SS did not exterminate minorities, they were like the German SAS, they didn't choose why they fought, they did what they were told and were good at it.
4. German tactics worked, look at how they conquered France so quickly.
5. The Imperium is very Facist. TThey are Zenophobic and militaristic, just like the Nazis. Neither are good guys.
5. Your some dum Nazi fanboy who cant't get a job so blames minorities [if this is your reason you should be banned]

Vampire counts arent banned, they are based on Vlad the Impaler who was even more evil than Hitler.

Don't ban WW2 themed German armies. Ban blatantly racist people.

I have a Waffen SS themed army but they swastikas are replaced with inquisition =I=s. My fluff is no different to other =I= armies.

The KKK goblins are a great idea, I'd do them if I had the money and if people wouldn't get offended.

Originally posted by Deadly Nightshade+Dec 9 2004, 01:56--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Deadly Nightshade @ Dec 9 2004, 01:56)</div><div class='quotemain'>For the record I am Chechen

this means

I have been called-
a Terrorist
a Commie
a Black Widow
Osama's girlfriend
I have been Told to-
go back to Russia (ironically it would probably be worse if i went there)
blow myself up
stop stealing English Jobs
stop claiming English benefits
I have had a swastika spray painted on my car and my apartment door before now

oh and I have really bad PMS during the Christmas season!

so do you really have any right to tell not to get angry?

thought not
269570
[/b]

I don't want to yellow water you off or discriminate, I just think you take this way to serious and yes, I think I have the right to say you shouldn't get angry.
Getting angry doesn't solve anything, only makes it worse, and people who discriminate you aren't worth getting angry over.

I bet now you think, yeah I've heard that a thousand times before he just doesn't know what it's like to be discriminated you get pissed off if you want it or not.

I used to think like that, I get discriminated alot as well, but I changed my attitude towards it.
People used to think I was a nazi because of my skinhead appearence, although I had many foreign friends.
Nowadays, I get discriminated because of my haircut (mohawk) and drug 'abuse'
People think I'm a junky, a thief, still think I'm racist sometimes (and call me these things too), and so on, even though they do not know me......
You get to be just called names, try getting beaten up sometime for having a shaved head and army boots, while going out with your friends (some black)
At some point, you just think, it's all crap I don't give a ***** about what people think.....solves a lot of problems

Here in the Netherlands, everyone discriminates everyone, everyone hates eachother, and if you say something wrong you get killed, biggest chance is it's done by a muslim, sucks, but as long as you don't take that sort of thing too serious, you won't get involved. (hasn't always been like this though, just the last 6 years or something)



<!--QuoteBegin-Rengaw@ today
hehe, did you know that the swastica was a tibet religious icon and had nothing to do with germans or war, i guess there are tibettan temples with swastica's all over em.

wow, check this out, gotta love dictionary.com

A symbol or ornament
...........................
and gammadion.


hehe, what an evil symbol huh?[/quote]

These days, every symbol is 'evil' according to somebody....
In my country it's illegal to carry around our nation's flag, even on your coat (I almost got beat up for this once :wacko: ) or schoolbag or whatever (except for on special occasions) <_<
This is because it might offend immigrants (N)
The immigrants, however, CAN carry their homelands flag... (N) :realmad:
So I can certainly imagine the swastika is labelled 'evil'

see, thats bullshit.

do you know what kind of holy war you'd ignite here in my country if you'd try and take away our usa flags? it'd be a massacre.

they shoulden't be able to do that, patriotism is vital to any country.

anyone ever notice how a cause will align people? like for instance. most of the time i bic my head bald, not lately it's too cold. but with my german ancestry and the old german flectar camo surplus fatigues i allways wear that just happen to have a small german flag on the shoulders alot of rednecks take me for a white pride type of guy. while this is completly untrue i find it amazing how friendly racest white guy's are. i've seen examples of it over and over, like there hate for other races has to be balanced by there hospitality to fellow white guy's. it's like if they believe you share in there cause than you are automaticly a trusted homeboy. whereas two regular people of a similar race would have to initiate some kind of bond, or common link. i think that if we could redirect racial animosity twards something much vaster align ALL with one cause, one cause drivin by the great motivator of hate, hate for an alien species or something equally threatning i think we could reach true world peace as old hatreds are forgotton, replaced with a burning hate that isn't destructive to the human race. cause lets face it, untill humankind fears something more than itself the only thing humans will hate will be us....humans.

my opinion.

wow, another one of these topics, and i just noticed it
not even bothering to read pages 1,2, or 3 i can say thank god im nuetral when it comes to race and religion.
(hnac)
to much 'good' groups out their, not enough evil... 8)

If GW has done then it wont change for awhile. Its stupid really, I can understand them kicking out people who use 40k as a excuse to hail the Nazis but the Imperium is based on Dictators and the like so its stupid!

A theme is a theme, no more, if the guy comes to play dressed up as a nazi, well thats another story.

Now if you start banning nazi armies, then it will be nazi similar looking, than commies, then the french legion, than the american capitalists or what ever......

All the armies of the world have done bad things, its just that they do on various degrees, and media attention too.

It all depends on the point of view. :huh:

I agree Wolf_Pack. I bet It'll be Communists next.

Originally posted by rengaw
see, thats bullshit.

do you know what kind of holy war you'd ignite here in my country if you'd try and take away our usa flags? it'd be a massacre.

they shoulden't be able to do that, patriotism is vital to any country.

anyone ever notice how a cause will align people?

Yeah, I totally agree with this (and most of the rest that followed)

Unfortunately, the government here has not kept control over society (most important issue being immigration and it's consequences, immigration is HUGE here) since 20/30 years ago, and now because of this they have become almost unable to, it's getting worse and worse, and they desperatly come up with ignorant rules like I mentioned before.
So I believe in some aspects America does better than other countries.

i did a nazi army i decided that it was to evil to be ever used and melted it down and put it in a box and burnt the box to ashs then buried the remians
but the truth of the matter is that if we had lost WW2 the world would be speaking english(maybe) german japanese and italian and we would be thinking that america and austalia and britain was facist or some thing like that
BUT WE BEAT THE DAMN JERRYS so there the evil ones
its in white and black if u get conqered the ruling nation is not evil
and the conqered is evil
nazis lost so there evil
if nazis won they wouldnt be evil
its erelivent we won so damn nazi's can shove it

(sorry if i spelled wrong)

If the Nazis did win then we wouldnt have this discussion and people would be encouraged to collect Nazis(sounds nasty I know).

Symbol of my Armoured Company (when I collect it)http://www.2001exhibit.org/arts/img/aeroflot_patch.gif
Yossarian Fighting 256th Armour (That's 2 to the Fighting Eighth power!)

So offensive OMG crai!

but the truth of the matter is that if we had lost WW2 the world would be speaking english(maybe) german japanese and italian and we would be thinking that america and austalia and britain was facist or some thing like that

Good point. History is written by the victors, It would be completely the other way around if we lost.

do you know what kind of holy war you'd ignite here in my country if you'd try and take away our usa flags? it'd be a massacre.


Why? Because you believe in it and like displaying your flag? Good, but you know there are lots of people who find America offensive too. Why should you be able to openly display what you believe in and claim democracy while in the same sentence say that all people with the fascist belief should be smothered and not allowed to voice their opinion? Fascism is a valid system of government which some people believe would work, just like communism, everyone is different so why should some views be not allowed while others aren't?

So, if you based an army on American soldiers or whatever how is it different from basing it on Nazis? You are making an army with a real life theme which could offend some people, but most sensible people should be able to compliment you on good paint work and conversions then get on with it.

Why? Because you believe in it and like displaying your flag? Good, but you know there are lots of people who find America offensive too. Why should you be able to openly display what you believe in and claim democracy while in the same sentence say that all people with the fascist belief should be smothered and not allowed to voice their opinion? Fascism is a valid system of government which some people believe would work, just like communism, everyone is different so why should some views be not allowed while others aren't?



because the facist belief isn't allowing the freedom of expression used when i so happily wave my flag too and fro.

know what, i'm offended by the mexicans here in my country waving there flags too and fro happily, to me it looks like an incroachment of the mexican country but you know what i'd fight for there right to wave that flag, cause no matter how it pisses someone off it's still a "god" givin right.

i believe in personall freedom to the point that my ideal government is complete anarchy,

the fascist countries people should be allowed to voice there opinion, EVERYONE should be allowed. voicing the opinion that this here flag is offensive is perfectly ok, BUT it's when they act on there opinion that we see the difference, i would never take a mexicans flag away. thats what makes our country great.

this is what your talking about right? for some reason i had to read what you said like 6 times before i could really get it.

I really dont see why GW wouldnt allow nazi oriented armies. There are plenty of world war 2 miniature games where the nazis are played. Also, what do u think the Steel legion and the Death Korps of Krieg look like? The steel legion sergeants even have the nazi helmet! I think they should loosen that rule up a bit. If the army has anti-semetic remarks or depictions on the banners or whatever then that army should be banned. If the army has the swatstika or the iron cross, it should be allowed.

the fascist countries people should be allowed to voice there opinion, EVERYONE should be allowed. voicing the opinion that this here flag is offensive is perfectly ok, BUT it's when they act on there opinion that we see the difference, i would never take a mexicans flag away. thats what makes our country great.

this is what your talking about right? for some reason i had to read what you said like 6 times before i could really get it.


I'm not really sure now... Anyway, by that second last paragraph it seems like you are saying they can wave the flag around and show swastikas or whatever but as soon as they do anything fascist its bad? I see no problem with that, the armies are themed the people that make them don't believe it. Lots of people can happily play chaos and make conversions of tortured models as long as they don't act chaotic, so people can make Nazi armies as long as they don't act like them?

Originally posted by sigismund@Dec 10 2004, 10:21
I really dont see why GW wouldnt allow nazi oriented armies. There are plenty of world war 2 miniature games where the nazis are played.
270944


That's one of the most intelligent things anyone has said so far.
The only difference I can see is that the WWII games are historical re-enactments, but a NAZI themed 40k army would mean that it was possible the owner had built them because he or she sympathized with NAZI ideology.
Then again that could easily happen with the WWII sims too.
But I mean so what? It is history, and I think it is dangerous to try to edit the NAZIs out of our collective experience, if only because it would make it easier for it to happen again.
BTW my family is German Jewish (they fled in WWII) and I believe that holding a grudge for something that happened before you were born is one of the most evil things anyone can do. If the NAZIs were around now I would fight them, but seeing as they are not I see no reason why we can't discuss them or view their imagery.

Yeah, the catapult idea was sarcasm, but still :P

I'll do the unit, but I won't take it to tourneys, and I might not put the pictures on LO. I'll ask some mod first about them I guess.
Everyone's a racist here in my town anyway, so I don't think anyone I play against will get offended :rolleyes:

Originally posted by streward
Why should you be able to openly display what you believe in and claim democracy while in the same sentence say that all people with the fascist belief should be smothered and not allowed to voice their opinion?

I agreed with him on the right to carry your flag....
And one of the most important rights in our constitution is the right to express your opinion in any way without actually physically hurting anyone.
This is better because it will lead to discussion and that's better than having sneeky racists who go around burning crosses or something hidden in white robes (goes for racists and extreme-muslims and communists and anyone)

I knew about a guy who worked for Games workshop he collected a steel legion army but decided to paint it diffrently he made a colour scheme up anyway to cut a long story short the colour scheme that he made up was the colour scheme for the WW2 German Panzar division i think the fourth brigade once he found that out he stopped bringing them into the store.

Well this thread has brought up painful memories for me and other members so with my new found powers, I smite it.