I heard a rumor that soon there will be a new tyranid codex in 2005. some new rules might be that carnifex's are in broods of 3 making 9 total carnifexs' on the board :realmad: . also i heard that the psychic powers will be better and the old one eye will be made bigger.

thankyou.
we had no idea :glare:

Old new, your telling us.

www.warpshadow.com is good for rumors as well as portent.

Read these threads for more delicious info and try to figure out which rumors are bs and which are pretty substantiated.

I won't link for fear of mod smiting, so I'll just say go to warpshadow, on main page, news/rumors/announcements, then look for:

"Rumor Roundup"

"More rumors from our good friends at Dakka"

"Some more nid rumors"

"new Lictor"

old one eye will be gone, not bigger.

The Red Terror will be gone also, but i hear that their rules are going to be available as options to HTs and stuff.
I wudnt be surprised if they made carnifex 0-1, 9 carnifexes is just manic!!
I also heard we may be getting plastic gargoyles, yay!! (Y)

Why the hell would they get rid of old one eye he's so awesome he can just punch his way through a squad of terminators i mean why the hell :o

I like the current Tyranid characters too, especially old one eye. He has cool background and an awesome model, they shouldnt get rid of them.

well you know i was freaked out about it all at first but games workshop is only gonna change something for the better or to make something more fair, i mean its possible they mess up but i seriously doubt it.


and plastic gargoyles will rock to get.

Plastic gargoyles will be great, but some of the rumors I have heard about the rules seem to make the tyranids very overpwering which I dislike...

The red terror is in the brand spankin' new rulebook, so he will most likely not dissapear.

Originally posted by Vorare@Dec 10 2004, 13:12
The Red Terror will be gone also, but i hear that their rules are going to be available as options to HTs and stuff.
I wudnt be surprised if they made carnifex 0-1, 9 carnifexes is just manic!!
I also heard we may be getting plastic gargoyles, yay!! (Y)
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Actually, of the Fex rumors blowing around, there is a possiblity of being allowed to take 12 in an army list. 1-3 strong broods for HS (making 9) and 3 elites (the other rumor is Fexes under a certain point cost could be taken as elites). Sadly, we won't know until spring/summer of 05 at the earliest what is true.

Though, I could see the 0-1 rule if the broods could be 3 strong (like our other HS choices)

Originally posted by Gojiratoho@Dec 14 2004, 13:25
Actually, of the Fex rumors blowing around, there is a possiblity of being allowed to take 12 in an army list. 1-3 strong broods for HS (making 9) and 3 elites (the other rumor is Fexes under a certain point cost could be taken as elites). Sadly, we won't know until spring/summer of 05 at the earliest what is true.

Though, I could see the 0-1 rule if the broods could be 3 strong (like our other HS choices)
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That is a problem i have had since i first picked up the nids codex, 3 biovoires, 3 zoanthropes, but just 1 fex. Of all the rumours i have heard so far this is the one I would really like to see come true....

No way GW is going to let you get more than 3 Fexs on the table in a standard battle. a 0-1 squad of 3 is possible though.

Two words:

Brood
Lord

Add them together, don't know what it looks like or kinda choice it is, but sounds like HQ, possibly sub-Hive Tyrant status but better than an individual Warrior. Going by the other new dexes, possibly a Combat Master (Chaplain?), Psychic Master (Librarian?) or just equivalent of vet. sergeant for large collections of Gaunts, Stealers etc. You know, the one that starts the cult on the planet they visit...

(No other surprises in the new boxes - Plastique Carnifex with six different heads etc...)

B_ricefoo, you have said absolutely nothing we have not known for several months, and also messed up on some of your facts.

Originally posted by B_riceFoo@Dec 10 2004, 07:04
I heard a rumor that soon there will be a new tyranid codex in 2005. some new rules might be that carnifex's are in broods of 3 making 9 total carnifexs' on the board :realmad: . also i heard that the psychic powers will be better and the old one eye will be made bigger.
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Have any of you seen the rules for a seeding swarm in chapter approved? They make them harder than ever to win against, so I highly doubt that they would have a total of nine carnifixes because under those rules they would be unbeatable.

if anyone doesnt know already... the reason that old one eye MAY be leaving is because the claws he has might be made into a weapon in the tyranid armoury as an option for carnies aqnd HT's

do we have an ETA on when the new bug codex will be here? (Y)

may - june whenever gamesdaay is it will be availabe there

Found this on portent.

Probaly the picture of the rumoured broodlord.

Brood Lord (http://forums.portent.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=34944)

do we have an ETA on when the new bug codex will be here?

A PDF release schedule was found which has the tyranid armydeal listed on the 7th of May, codex might be already available on the 1st of May at Warhammer world during an event beeing hel there.

Since that link doesn't work... Here are those same pictures from an alternative source:

Tyranid Broodlord (http://koti.mbnet.fi/~uzi/broodlord2.jpg)

As we can see, very 'Stealerlike... And the German text makes a further reference to 'Stealers (Symbionten). Hate to say it, but I'm not impressed... Though it would look as if it was easily convertable (limbs, that is), and at least it doesn't have hooves. ;)


As an added bonus, here're pictures of the new 'Stealers, including the ones I mentioned in the Tyranid forum:

New Genestealers (http://koti.mbnet.fi/~uzi/stealers1.jpg)

Pretty decent, but the Scything Talons look stumped... Gaunt talons are much better. The two leftmost 'Stealers are the ones showed in WD 303UK.


The picture quality is atrocious, but don't complain to me... I just dug 'em up from the net. :P

Watching the pictures i think we are gonna get extended carapace for stealers, just maybe.

Originally posted by mente enjambre@Feb 20 2005, 04:03
Watching the pictures i think we are gonna get extended carapace for stealers, just maybe.
--- Huh? more like it would be kept as an option... Lets just hope it's worth it this time! :lol:

so brood lord = Genestealer Primarch then?

The Tyranids will be here in the summer. The carnifex will rufly be the size of a rhino and will come with 5 head options and will be able to be equipted with a spore mine launcher aswell as many differant close combat weapons. Gaunts and units like them will be able to respawn like the necrons. Also new enhancements will be avalible like toxic sacs.

AHHH I hate old one eye, Ive never killed him!!! I hope they get rid of him

Originally posted by Dru@Feb 21 2005, 13:55
so brood lord = Genestealer Primarch then?
--- Patriarch... It would seem so. Whether it will be a singular HQ like the Tyrant, or be supplied with a "retinue" unit is anybodys guess ATM. Some older rumours stated that it could be taken as a character for units/broods, but I remain sceptical and sincerely hope this is not the case!


Couchman, the article in WD 303UK didn't say that Gaunts would "respawn" like the Necrons... Definitely no WBB for the Tyranids! What it did say was "Without Number", and any players familiar with Seeding Swarms know what that potentially means. ;)

Also, Toxin Sacs aren't exactly new biomorphs... Maybe You meant Toxic Miasma? This was been mentioned in the article.


Ultramarines r cool, yes, the OOE will in all likelihood be gone according to rumours... However, those same rumours state that the reason for this is the fact that Regeneration would now become a standard biomorph upgrade option for 'Fexes! ;)

We shall see if it will remain as effective as OOE's ability.

My god the new stelars look ugly :glare: and the brood lord is even worse.

Where did you dig those up!?!

Seriously, those models look frighteningly uncool.

I hope it's just the paint job and the quality of the photos themselves.

Originally posted by blueguy@Feb 21 2005, 19:46
Where did you dig those up!?!

Seriously, those models look frighteningly uncool.

I hope it's just the paint job and the quality of the photos themselves.
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I agree. They suck and then some. They look just like some I have now. Not buying those, nosireesir.

They had better outdo themselves with the rest of the models, especially the fex.

Dre3013 :ph34r:

Edit: After looking at those pics again, I absolutely have 6 genestealers that look exactly like those, 100% exactly the same models. I bought them from eBay where they were listed as being from Battle of Maggrage, on 2 large sprues with some termagaunts and a load of spore mines. Are the "new genestealers" really the ones from Battle of Maccrage, or have I stumbled upon some top secret stuff here? I am utterly disappointed.

Did You think GW would redesign the 'Stealer just for Macragge, and then redesign it again? :rolleyes:

Yes, the new 'Stealers will look the same as those in Macragge... The Macragge 'Stealers ARE the new 'Stealers for all practical purposes. The only difference is that the actual separately-sold 'Stealers will be multipart, allowing for a bunch of poses and biomorphs.

The concept art for the new 'Stealers was great, and the actual model isn't half bad, just not as good as the concept. I also like the older heads better.


Anyway, WD 303UK has shed some light on the new Tyranids, and I've already brought that up for discussion here (http://www.librarium-online.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=32749).

uzi 99 i said like toxic sacs

I want to see plastic gargoyles sold in boxes of 12 or 16. No more falling over?

Soo, are the mutations coming off as i heard rumored? And will the 'fex broods for elites be like obliterators and you can only take 3? **i'm not talking about IWs, of course.** And are you able to tell us at all or even have an idea or range of what the points would be of how low it would have to be, to be in elites choice? Also the brood lord... its kinda... well it seems like it doesnt fit the tyranids, but fits the genestealer cult.


--By the way this new codex seems like its gonna be so FRICKEN awesome.--

Originally posted by Couchman+Feb 22 2005, 15:35--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Couchman @ Feb 22 2005, 15:35)</div><div class='quotemain'>i said like toxic sacs[/b]
--- No, You said "new enhancements will be avalible like toxic sacs"... To me it looks like You're suggesting Toxic Sacs would be something new, when in fact they are not.

That's why I'm asking whether or not You were actually referring to "Toxic Miasma", which is a new Tyranid biomorph according to the WD 303UK news article.

But if You were referring to Toxic Sacs, then my comment stands... Not new. =)

<!--QuoteBegin-SlugEmpire@Feb 23 2005, 06:05
Soo, are the mutations coming off as i heard rumored?[/quote]
--- WD 303UK mentioned what happened to biomorphs (and thus Mutable Genus), but for one-off Mutants, don't know clearly yet.

In case people aren't bothered to read the link I posted before, biomorphs have been made part of the unit entries.


And will the 'fex broods for elites be like obliterators and you can only take 3?
--- Unfortunately, the WD 303UK article doesn't mention whether the Carnifexes (HS or E) would be chosen as a single choice of 3, like Zoans or Biovores... It can very well be they still occupy a slot all by themselves, but we can't know for sure just yet.

All we do know is that yes, You can have 2 Tyrants, 3 Elite 'Fexes and 3 HS 'Fexes.

Nothing yet on how low the points limit for E 'Fexes would be.

After reading WD303 i'd have to say by the wording that You'll still only be able to buy one carnifex per Heavy support choice.

Ultramarines r cool, yes, the OOE will in all likelihood be gone according to rumours... However, those same rumours state that the reason for this is the fact that Regeneration would now become a standard biomorph upgrade option for 'Fexes!

We shall see if it will remain as effective as OOE's ability.

If thats the case and the new regeneration rule for fexes is that of old one eyes's I NEVER want to play nids again.

Tyranid Army Set will be out in the US in May (barring any fine print I might not have noticed about a later date), and will cost around 225$ IIRC. The exact release date is unknown.

This information is from the Diamond Previews retailer catalogue... They're stock suppliers for comics and gaming stores, and offer GW stuff amongst others. Thus unless GW pulls a really, really fast one, the vicinity of May is when the Tyranids are out. No mention (or pictures) of the Codex or specific models.

And yes, this means that the leaked PDF on GW release schedules seems legit.

Um the last thing the tyranid need is more buffs. If GW do anything but nerf the tyranid (at least somewhere fair) ill quit 40k forever. Im sick of uber bugs and 24 inch leapers. Ruins the game and is just plain unfun!

Originally posted by Bruiser117@Feb 28 2005, 14:31
Um the last thing the tyranid need is more buffs. If GW do anything but nerf the tyranid (at least somewhere fair) ill quit 40k forever. Im sick of uber bugs and 24 inch leapers. Ruins the game and is just plain unfun!
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Of course, you don't take into account that we've got to sacrifice any sembalance of ranged combat to pull off a 24" assault (and get incredably lucky to boot). You play Orks, another CC army. Getting close is part of the game for both of us. If you're having trouble with gaunts, why don't you ask some other Ork players for some tactics that will help you defeat them?

Massed Choppa Boys would seem to be highly effective given that most Tyranid units rely heavily on armour saves. Move all your units into cover and wait, then strike with ten initiative. Deny your Tyranid opponent the use of cover saves, and he'll be forced to rely on his armor saves (which your Choppas halve)!

When the new Ork codex comes out, you'll undoubtedly recieve some new fun Ork options, but really, I doubt very much Games Workshop cares if you quit the game or not (it would seem foolish, the Orks are a very fun army to play with, win or lose! Waaagh!).

Originally posted by PoptartsNinja@Feb 28 2005, 16:55
Of course, you don't take into account that we've got to sacrifice any sembalance of ranged combat to pull off a 24" assault (and get incredably lucky to boot). You play Orks, another CC army. Getting close is part of the game for both of us. If you're having trouble with gaunts, why don't you ask some other Ork players for some tactics that will help you defeat them?

Massed Choppa Boys would seem to be highly effective given that most Tyranid units rely heavily on armour saves. Move all your units into cover and wait, then strike with ten initiative. Deny your Tyranid opponent the use of cover saves, and he'll be forced to rely on his armor saves (which your Choppas halve)!

When the new Ork codex comes out, you'll undoubtedly recieve some new fun Ork options, but really, I doubt very much Games Workshop cares if you quit the game or not (it would seem foolish, the Orks are a very fun army to play with, win or lose! Waaagh!).
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Pluss it takes points(which can take away from your mass of units), to put buffs on your guys, thats why i think it might be hard to use the new regeneration biomorph :hmm:, because it might be to much points to add on since its a good ability.

Dunno if you guys have seen these yet, but I just found them myself and thought I'd share them with all my Giant Maneating Bug friends. Appearently this informatin was leaked at Gamesday Germany. This appearently is the new Genestealer Broodlord (http://www.landraider.com/news/new_nid_broodlord.gif) and this is the new Genestealer (http://www.landraider.com/news/new_nid_stealers.gif).

Originally posted by Edicius@Mar 1 2005, 00:01
Dunno if you guys have seen these yet, but I just found them myself and thought I'd share them with all my Giant Maneating Bug friends. Appearently this informatin was leaked at Gamesday Germany. This appearently is the new Genestealer Broodlord (http://www.landraider.com/news/new_nid_broodlord.gif) and this is the new Genestealer (http://www.landraider.com/news/new_nid_stealers.gif).
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They've been shown alot, dont worry... BUT WHAT THE HECK. I mean the broodlord is sorta cool... but its to human like, i hope they came up with some other cool stuff for the codex. See the idea for a broodlord is cool but i think they coulda done better. I guess the broodlord has a cool edge to it.

Yeah figures.Sorry 'bout that, I'll be slinking back to my Imperial forums now. :unsure:

sorry guys but i think the brood lord looks really cool. (i'm trying to think past the colour scheme) basically it looks like and sm genestealer: regular stealers come from humans don't they? (btw i don't know whether fluffwise its possible to breed a stealer from an sm but thats what it looks like)
the new stealers look alright but i'll postpone properly judging till i see better pictures of both of them
and it looks like the new codex will be something these marine players should fear. as they should! bout time something other than Sm (counting other power armour armies here too) was considered overpowered.

Frankly any new nid models will be welcome.....all the more parts for me to convert............bu ha har.

Like a fat man at a Harvester, Im already eyeing up that broodlords body as a
frame to build a deamon prince around.........oh....soooo good......mmmmm....

I agree with the general principle of not having too many big bugs.......but what you gonna do.....as long as I can beat nids and beat others with nids Im ok with it. Besides, most people have trouble with the little guys rather than the big'uns (not me, I use Death Guard) so armys made of lots of big bugs are often easy to toppel compared to the slavering hords.

I must admit I am looking forward to wumping some Ork with the
new Fix.......mmmm.....sythe tail (+1D3 attacks half strength)
or mace tail (+1 attack at full strength).........no, need more tails.......

Nope, none of my friends know how to deal with the tyranid either

And also Hormagaunts are infinitely better than slugga boyz in combat. They are quarenteed the charge and completely ruin the orks advantage. Why would hormagaunts do poorly against low armoured models? Its not like they have rending claws.

And besides, my biggest problem is the big bugs. They slay my warboss in one turn before he can hit, and then kill most important models before they can hurt him. I don't have lascannons like the sort of other armies so I have to try and take him down in combat but frankly its impossible. Plus the fact that his carnifex can sit back and fire pie plates (Ordance Blasts at like S-8) at my boys while I have to sit and watch is ridiculous.

what about xxap guns and those damned slugga boys

A Nob with a Powerklaw in a decent size Mob will own a TMC anytime... As long as the Nob doesn't end in BtB contact with the TMC!

It's essentially the same as the SM "Hidden Fist" tactic with VetSgts and PFists: As long as the model isn't in BtB, the TMC can't target it. Thus normal Boyz will die, while the Nob will get to hit the TMC with the Klaw. Orks have it actually better than the SM, since Orks get Choppas and decent-sized units.

Just try not to get swarmed by Gaunts or shot to bits by Biovores (and the BStrangler 'Fex, it seems ;) ).


Oh yes, just making sure: Your opponent is rolling to-hit as usual with the BStrangler? It is not an Ordnance weapon, and thus needs to hit just like normal weapons since that what it is: A normal Assault weapon which uses the Large Blast marker. Many newer Tyranid players tend to get confused by it, so I just want to make sure.

And hey, look on the bright side: You still get Your Armour saves! :D

Frankly, if the Tyranid player was smart, he'd take 2-3 Biovores instead of a BStrangler 'Fex. The 'Vores are much more efficient in killing masses of enemies, I find.

Or is he fielding both against Your Orks? =)

The simple fact is that orks are probably the hardest thing to take on tyranids with, don't feel bad, watch what happens when bugs go up against a shooty tau army, it's just not pretty.

Anyway, orks have a couple of things that work well against bugs, and the fact is that an ork army can be made just shooty enough to cripple a nid assault if you know how to sink points into it just right. Anyway, shouldn't this be in 'nid tactics or ork tactics at this point? No disrespect, we just seem to have gotten off topic...

Slugga Boys can't kill it fast enuf (wounding on 6s) and will attack last so most in ranged will get killed before they can reach.

And Zap Guns are only useful against vehicles. They only have a 24" range, and range between 2-10 Strength, meaning on average it will wound the Tyrant half the time (and the tyrant has 4 wounds meaning I would have to prey that the tyrant gets his leg stuck in a hole a foot in front of the zap gun for like 8 turns)

Originally posted by Bruiser117@Mar 2 2005, 05:07
Slugga Boys can't kill it fast enuf
--- Did You not read what I said? =)

It isn't the Slugga boys that will kill the TMC, but the PKlaw Nob. The Sluggas are just "added wounds" for the TMC to slice through if it wants to kill the Nob.

Any wounds caused by Sluggas are just a bonus: The reason Sluggas are good (better than SM in this case) is that although both have equally poor chances of wounding, the Choppas will reduce the TMC armour save. Additionally, Slugga boys are much cheaper, which means You're either losing less points or can field a larger and more survivable mob in the first place than what SM players could.

Of course, the problem with a large mob is that it's easier to hit with Biovore Spore Mines... But really, this discussion would be better served in the Ork or generic Tactics&Strategies forums. Other Orks might be able to point out better where Your tactics are going wrong, and it's unlikely that they read a post about Tyranid Rumours... ;)


So please, lets get this thread back to news on 4thEd Tyranids.

In the front of the new UK white dwarf, there is a editors write up about some new info on the nids. Here's a brieft run down of *some* of the new stuff.

The armies seem to be split into three groups, Light wieghts (Guants, swarms and the like), middle wieghts (warrios, zoanthropes and other synapse creatures) and heavy weights (carnifexs' hive tyrants and such). The rumours about being able to field up to 8 monstourus creatures is true, you will be able to do so (Yes, that means you could field up to 8 carnifexes depending on the limit they want you to field).

The lightweights will get the "Without numbers" rule, which means that after they get killed they can come onto the board. It works exactly like the sustained attack, If a unit is killed or under 1/2 strenth, you can take that unit off and bring it back on your table edges, or one of the short table edges at full strength. The downside ? You opponent can potentialy rack up ALOT of victory poits.

They hint at the fact that middle wieght creatures with synapse will be able to ignore the insta kill effect.

The new codex will apprently feature alot of fluff as well, from first contact to current day, so people will have a real feel for them.

Regarding the biomorphing. From what I was hearing in other boards and rumours, it was thought that this had been dropped completely. This is not 100% true. Seems that biomorphs will be included in the unit listing as a mini wargear list under each unit entry, making it easier to create biomorphed armies

No mention of the patriarch, but they do include the pic of the new genestealers that have been going around.

Enjoy :)

What i have heard is that the Without number rules only apply in a paticlar mission as such they arn't going to be used in regular games. At least that it was the staff i have talked to are saying.

Originally posted by synack@Mar 3 2005, 14:50
In the front of the new UK white dwarf, there is a editors write up about some new info on the nids. Here's a brieft run down of *some* of the new stuff.
--- Welcome to the board! (Y)

However, it pays to read previous posts... I've already offered this lowdown earlier. Of course, the actual lowdown is on the Tyranid thread, but I've linked it here pretty recently, on page three of this topic. ;)

Though I suppose I should've made the link a bit more obvious. ^_^


The rumours about being able to field up to 8 monstourus creatures is true, you will be able to do so (Yes, that means you could field up to 8 carnifexes depending on the limit they want you to field).
--- It does not. Although they don't spell it out this clearly, it is most probably a reference to total 8 TMCs. That means two Tyrants, three Elite 'Fexes and three HvyS 'Fexes, assuming similar brood sizes and fielding rules to current Codex or even the rumoured "1-3 'Fexes as single 0-1 choice".

Regarding the latter, no actual statements of any sort in the WD.


Regarding the biomorphing. From what I was hearing in other boards and rumours, it was thought that this had been dropped completely.
--- Clearly shows You're a newb around here! ;)

What WD303 states is exactly the way I've believed they'd deal with it for a long time... The customization factor was simply too good to throw away, especially considering the newer Chaos, IG and SM Codexes.

All they've done is streamlined it a bit... Hopefully no more need to meticulously count the species of an army for Mutation purposes, or discrepancies between army list and Mutable Genus entries! :D

This is a little off topic but........

A Nob with a Powerklaw in a decent size Mob will own a TMC anytime... As long as the Nob doesn't end in BtB contact with the TMC!

It's essentially the same as the SM "Hidden Fist" tactic with VetSgts and PFists: As long as the model isn't in BtB, the TMC can't target it.

Independant Characters and Mosterous creatures can not split their attacks between individuals in a squad. They can attack the entire squad and the enemy will select the victims within 2 inches. They can choose which squad to attack if they are in combat with more than one squad but they cant split their attacks between them. If an independent character if in the squad he will count as a seperate unit so an attacker can send all his attacks against him or the squad he accompanies, but not both.

Sooooo.....even if the Nob is in Base Contact with a MC or IC he cannot be selected because he is only a squad character and not an IC.

Independant Characters and Mosterous creatures can not split their attacks between individuals in a squad. They can attack the entire squad and the enemy will select the victims within 2 inches. They can choose which squad to attack if they are in combat with more than one squad but they cant split their attacks between them. If an independent character if in the squad he will count as a seperate unit so an attacker can send all his attacks against him or the squad he accompanies, but not both.

Sooooo.....even if the Nob is in Base Contact with a MC or IC he cannot be selected because he is only a squad character and not an IC.

Sorry but the Tyranid FAQ mentiones that TMC still follow their rules in the Tyranid codex, as such they can still select any btb model.

As Dreachon said... Tyranid Monstrous Creatures are not ICs. Normal MCs have never been able to allocate, thus that point is irrelevant to this discussion.

ICs lost the rule which allowed them to target specific models in CC, and thus are not able to do so any longer.

TMCs follow Codex rules, which still allow them to target specific models in BtB contact. Furthermore, the 4thEd Tyranid FAQ explicitly states that You still follow Codex rules, in addition to the 4thEd regular MC rules. Thus TMCs can still pick and target models in BtB contact in CC since 1) It's a Codex rule and 2) The FAQ says to follow Codex rules.


Will this rule remain in the 4thEd Tyranid Codex? I'd hazard a guess that no, it will no longer be around, streamlining the TMCs with others. However, until then the rules are explicitly clear, and TMCs can pick off and eviscerate any character dumb or unlucky enough to end up in BtB contact.

This is why it's very important to be aware of other armies special rules as well, not just Your own and the generic rules! ;)

So normal independant characters can't target specific models... but tyrants can? So its basically a fluke not changed. Sweet (sarcasm). And when I said before that sluggas can't kill them fast enough, I meant he squad, even a nob with a claw would take like 4 rounds of combat to kill it, and it may take one wound off of it, but after clearing out like 5 boys it'll then move right into btb contact and **** it. To the other guy who said zap guns... no, 50 / 50 chance of wounding and a 24 " ranged, practically useless. It would be like 100 pts spent to maybe wound a tyrant once or twice if I was playing a newbie player, if he was any better than they are useless.

Almost everyone I know agrees that orks have the toughest time against tyranid then any other race, mostly due to the nature of both types armies.

Tyranid are good on the charge, and have monstrous creatures with one major weakness (they can be killed by Shoot the big ones, so if you are any other race besides orks that will have long range high strength ap-2 weapons you have a chance...)

Orks are good on the charge, and don't have those long rang ap-2 weapons with high strength to even affect the tyrants one disadvantage.

Also, despite both races being good on the charge, the tyranid are faster, with a base statline better than Orks AND the movement of calvary (for one more point)... so the tyranid WILL get the charge, meaning that the orks only advantage is gone.

I'm not saying that tyranid are so uber powerful or anything, but coming from an ork player, with friends that play other races (and are more experienced than me) that agree with me that the orks have it tough against tyranid... and right now there is nothing they can really do... and this codex is only spraying good things upon them, so i'm just putting it out there that if I come into contact with tyranids at a tournament im screwed. Hopefully the ork codex coming out like in a few years (when ill be in college, which is no good for me because ill probably be out of the hobby) will give me a chance against the bugs. Damn...

The tyranid swarm is approaching, the hive fleets beasts of destruction and havoc are near at hand, The Hive Fleet will arrive at Holy Terra on or around 5/20/2005, will the Imperium of Man hold out against this terrible siege??]

How do I know this you may ask? The almight God - Emperor of man has told me by directing me here:

http://www.scifigenre.com/itemDetail.aspx?...X&nItemID=21211 (http://www.scifigenre.com/itemDetail.aspx?sid=XRWW0PHLQLJHNLX&nItemID=21211)

Originally posted by Bruiser117@Mar 11 2005, 10:47
So normal independant characters can't target specific models... but tyrants can? So its basically a fluke not changed. Sweet (sarcasm). And when I said before that sluggas can't kill them fast enough, I meant he squad, even a nob with a claw would take like 4 rounds of combat to kill it, and it may take one wound off of it, but after clearing out like 5 boys it'll then move right into btb contact and **** it. To the other guy who said zap guns... no, 50 / 50 chance of wounding and a 24 " ranged, practically useless. It would be like 100 pts spent to maybe wound a tyrant once or twice if I was playing a newbie player, if he was any better than they are useless.

Almost everyone I know agrees that orks have the toughest time against tyranid then any other race, mostly due to the nature of both types armies.

Tyranid are good on the charge, and have monstrous creatures with one major weakness (they can be killed by Shoot the big ones, so if you are any other race besides orks that will have long range high strength ap-2 weapons you have a chance...)

Orks are good on the charge, and don't have those long rang ap-2 weapons with high strength to even affect the tyrants one disadvantage.

Also, despite both races being good on the charge, the tyranid are faster, with a base statline better than Orks AND the movement of calvary (for one more point)... so the tyranid WILL get the charge, meaning that the orks only advantage is gone.

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See, the great devourer, consumer of worlds will destroy you all. That's what we've been saying all along!

Seriously though, and I've said this before. Orks can whup nids, it requires killer cans and the like, plus orks with flamers, but it's not that inconceivable. No, they can't easily take out hive tyrants or fexes, but they are reasonably well equipped if you set them to just tie them up.

Meanwhile, on the Sept world of Vior'la...

"Por'vre Mal'ker've?"
"Yes, Shas'O Mor'gan'Ores?"
We're going to need to stock up on a lot of white paint, and come up with more ways to deal with kill markings. The Tyranids' smaller creatures will get to come back again and again, and I'm afraid that all of our Fire Warriors' guns will be painted completely white by the time we are done."
"Ahh, I see the problem. I'll have several metric tons of white, blue, and gold paint ready for you by the end of the day."

It looks like I'm going to need to bring a laptop with me for calculating crunchies removed. :lol:

More seriously, though... Regen as an option? No instakill on warriors? Better hope those point costs go up to match.

I played against a Brood Lord at gamesworkshop in a scenario. My 120 point Chaos Lord survived for 3 whole turns against him. I don't know much about it, but he was rolling a LOT of dice when he attacked.

Maximum TMCs on a board will now be 8, as Carnifexes which haven't been biomorphed and upgraded can be taken as elite choices, with the modded fexes still allowed as heavy support. Add that to the possible two tyrants allowed and you get 8 TMCs. No way an oppponent will kill all of those before they reach close combat :D

Originally posted by - Yorkiebar -@Mar 15 2005, 08:56
Maximum TMCs on a board will now be 8, as Carnifexes which haven't been biomorphed and upgraded can be taken as elite choices, with the modded fexes still allowed as heavy support. Add that to the possible two tyrants allowed and you get 8 TMCs. No way an oppponent will kill all of those before they reach close combat :D
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:hmm:
I think people will be upset that GW is doing that.
Well.. aslong as they don't get regeneration then I think its kinda fine. :)

Originally posted by Bruiser117@Mar 10 2005, 19:47
So normal independant characters can't target specific models... but tyrants can? So its basically a fluke not changed.
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GW smegged up with the Tyranid FAQ. If you follow it to the letter, TMCs may not be targetted separately from their squad in close combat and may also make their attacks even if they are not in base-to-base contact. Furthermore, they are attacked using the squad's majority weaponskill and wounded with the majority toughness. Wounds dealt to the squad in close combat may also spill over into the TMC.

I read it like the first paragraph in the codex describing TMCs says: they combine the characteristics of both monstrous creatures and independant characters. I stop there and follow the new rulebook -- which happens to use Tyranids as an example of an army with monstrous independant characters.

Originally posted by Ostsol@Mar 18 2005, 03:19
Wounds dealt to the squad in close combat may also spill over into the TMC.
--- They may not, unless You have equal Armour saves. Since most often Your TMCs have ExtCar and thus clearly better saves than anything else, You follow Mixed Armour rules as normal.

Note that Mixed Armour also applies to shooting at TMCs with units of Tyrant Guard (if the TMC has ExtC). The TMC may not be specifically targeted, but that does not mean it could not be wounded as per the normal rules.


Also, the new rulebook doesn't use Tyranids as an example for Monstrous ICs. What it does is use Tyrant Guards as an example of a unit which has specific rules allowing them to protect other models from being targeted.

Until the 4thEd comes out, TMCs are not ICs, just like they never have been.

Originally posted by Uzi-99@Mar 17 2005, 19:32
--- They may not, unless You have equal Armour saves. Since most often Your TMCs have ExtCar and thus clearly better saves than anything else, You follow Mixed Armour rules as normal.
Mixed armour rules just change how wounds spill over to various models in the unit. Either way, wounds can spill over.

Also, the new rulebook doesn't use Tyranids as an example for Monstrous ICs. What it does is use Tyrant Guards as an example of a unit which has specific rules allowing them to protect other models from being targeted.
The oddity is that such an example is used at all. If Tyranids do not have ICs, why bother mentioning a unit that can protect monstrous ICs? Even if the FAQ and codex currently define TMCs as having certain characteristics of ICs, that definition is from the wrong edition.

Until the 4thEd comes out, TMCs are not ICs, just like they never have been.
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By the FAQ, that is true -- though it makes little sense. It's entirely silly to maintain an anachronistic set of rules when it should have been plainly obvious to GW what the 4th Edition version of TMCs should have been. It is extremely frustrating that no one at GW could be bothered to publish a new version of the FAQ (and perhaps other armies' FAQs) to correct such issues.

Fortunately for me, all of my current opponents agree with my opinion of the FAQ. Of course, if I do play against someone who demands that I adhere to what GW has published in this matter, I will grudgingly comply.

Originally posted by Ostsol@Mar 18 2005, 05:40
Mixed armour rules just change how wounds spill over to various models in the unit. Either way, wounds can spill over.
--- True... But at least the rules are clearly defined. (Y)

IMO, anyway! ^_^;;;


Fortunately for me, all of my current opponents agree with my opinion of the FAQ. Of course, if I do play against someone who demands that I adhere to what GW has published in this matter, I will grudgingly comply.
--- Well, my take is not so far from Yours... Although I fervently adhere to the current fact that Tyranids have no ICs, I do treat TMCs in a manner similar to ICs in assaults: I require my TMCs to be in BtB contact to fight and they count as a unit in their own right for CC targeting purposes.

Simply because joining them with a Gaunt brood to get potentially up to 32 extra wounds in CC would be... A tad overpowering, to say the least.

Also, it makes no sense that You can choose to fight against a SM Commander, almost identical to the members of his retinue, but could not target a bloody Hive Tyrant from amongst Gaunts.

So although TMCs aren't ICs, I do think that they should follow these two particular rules.

The same would go for a Necron Tomb Spyder with Scarabs, although TMCs joined with other Tyranids are clearly the most problematic instance of the lack of rules in this regard.

Spine fists... are they being made to be more expensive?????? Just because if you got them with twin-linked now they probubly will be made more expensive
--that would be horrible if they changed the points--

Also i see that the only reason they did the elites thing with fexes (since they made them have broods of three and you could take 9 TMCs alone in Heavy support), is that they could take three powerful Fexes and biovores and zoans, all at the same time, with more TMCs... Other wise i see no point. Which if you ask me is awesome but yeah.


--everybody's models per list is gonna go down so much because they'll get so caught up in biomorphs :D :P --

Originally posted by SlugEmpire@Mar 22 2005, 05:21
(since they made them have broods of three and you could take 9 TMCs alone in Heavy support), is that they could take three powerful Fexes and biovores and zoans, all at the same time, with more TMCs...
--- We already know pretty certainly that You can't take 9 HS Carnifexes...

Phil Kelly (one of the guys writing the Codex, so he should know) stated that maximum number of TMCs is 8. That would translate into 2 Tyrants, 3 Elite 'Fexes, 3 HS 'Fexes. It doesn't matter how many there are per brood, the bottom line is that You can't have more than that if the quote in WD 303 was correct.

Though a potential total of 8 TMCs is still probably very scary to a lot of players... I'd imagine Orks and Necrons to be the first to complain (IMO for good reason) if such TMC-heavy armies actually materialize, and I doubt others would find it a picnic either.

Originally posted by Uzi-99@Mar 22 2005, 14:53
--- We already know pretty certainly that You can't take 9 HS Carnifexes...

Phil Kelly (one of the guys writing the Codex, so he should know) stated that maximum number of TMCs is 8. That would translate into 2 Tyrants, 3 Elite 'Fexes, 3 HS 'Fexes. It doesn't matter how many there are per brood, the bottom line is that You can't have more than that if the quote in WD 303 was correct.

Though a potential total of 8 TMCs is still probably very scary to a lot of players... I'd imagine Orks and Necrons to be the first to complain (IMO for good reason) if such TMC-heavy armies actually materialize, and I doubt others would find it a picnic either.
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well yeahhhhh i knew that uzi, i was just saying because you can have those brood sizes, dont think i didnt read the info people sent ;)

--i was just saying it to explain what i ment--

But thanks, i didnt relize that you could have 2 for hw and only 3 in elites and only 3 for heavy support i thought since the brood size can go up to 3 that you could have just up to 8 TMCs not a certain amount in each.

Though a potential total of 8 TMCs is still probably very scary to a lot of players... I'd imagine Orks and Necrons to be the first to complain (IMO for good reason) if such TMC-heavy armies actually materialize, and I doubt others would find it a picnic either.

I for one will NOT know what to do with an 8 TMC list like that... I mean, Tyranids are already hard with 3 TMCs against Necrons at 1500pts, EIGHT?! I really don't know... I'll field a 9 Heavy Destroyer, 5 Destroyers, and 6 Wraiths... maybe that might do something... maybe...

Ack! :o

the new hive tyrant pic is in the warhammer40k sneek peaks in the news section of gamesworkshop. :D

Yeah its true they are bringing outa new codex and they are bringing out new models for tyrsanids like hive tyrants etc

Dont really know if this has been mentioned yet but the New Tyranid Codex is due for release on the 4th of June in the Uk (At least that's what a new release poster i got of a games workshop employe says.)

so July 4 in UK...and being that UK is a month ahead in terms of releases, that would mena that the tryanid 'dex would be out aug 5th, since the 4th is a thurs :confused: ?

4tHEd Tyranid Codex, US-release, is scheduled for shipping in June. When it hits the shelves... No dates, but in all probability within a few weeks of the estimated UK date.

I had a dream that the codex was released and there were two versions: one costing $12 and another costing about $34. I don't know what the difference was, but while searching for the entry for Raveners, I saw a whole bunch of anti-Tyranid Space Marine characters and special units. . . *shudders* Yeah, that was definitely a nightmare. :p

I luv the old one eye.
It's indestructable and for only 164 pts.
Every one I've played with with it says its the most powerfull creature on the field and its never even lost a wound in my hands!
But I can see why opposition might not like him.