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So I'm hoping some experienced beastman players can give me some advice and answer a question or two...or three.
On a one to ten scale-
How cost effective?
I'm really torn as the original reason I wanted to do beastmen was the dragon ogres and the Shaggoth. But they don't get it anymore so like I said, I'm torn. How bad is losing the Marks of Chaos for Beastmen?
A little advice ont he first units to buy, and a good way to build up the army over time so I've got a playable force soon. Is it better to spend points on heroes and magic weapons, or masses of infantry?
All right, let's address the questions.
Fun - 9. It's an army that's pretty fun to play, and you'll definitely get to roll A LOT of dice, between the Leadership tests, the magic, and the attacks (which would be re-rolled if you pass your Primal Fury tests).
Competitiveness - 7. Let's just be straight-up here - you have to be careful on how you build your army, because there are some pretty bad choices in this book (most notably every single thing in the Rare section). In general, if you stick to infantry or monstrous infantry (supplemented by magic), you'll be all right.
Cost-Effectiveness - 8. Our Battalion is dirt-cheap, and you'll use every single model in there. It's also fairly easy to convert some neat-looking characters out of them, so you don't have to really spend that much $$$, considering it's a Horde army.
To be honest with you, the loss of Marks wasn't a big deal in terms of combat effectiveness, thanks to Primal Fury. Re-rolls to hit on every round of combat > any benefit marks ever gave them.
As was mentioned above, get the Battalion. When you're done with that, get it again. After that, consider a third. When you have your infantry base established, I recommend deciding whether you like Chariots or not by giving 1-2 of them a try (I don't like them, but other successful players do), and decide whether you like the models for Razorgors and Harpies. If you do, your choice is easy. If you don't, I recommend conversions, because they really are that useful (I made my Razorgors out of Savage Orc Boar Boyz pigs and Chaos Spawn, and my Harpies are made of Daemonette and Tyranid Gargoyle bits). Lastly, I recommend getting some extra boxes of Bestigors.
Good luck, and welcome to the Herd!
Last edited by rothgar13; January 28th, 2012 at 23:10.
What about minotaurs? I really like the models for those guys.
In general, they're not worth it, unless you build the army around them. The most successful build (usually referred to as a "Minobus") requires multiple Minotaur characters, so it squeezes down on the points you have available for magic. I don't consider it as strong a build as the infantry heavy army, but it's still pretty solid.
Wellt hey are the models tha tkinda drew me to the beastmen now tha thte shaggoths are gone, the minotaurs that is, what makes them bad?
Fragility. You pay a lot of points for something that has T4 with a 6+ armor save, which is weaker protection than a Bestigor. This combination means that if your opponent has shooting, it's headed right at 'em. They're also sporting average Initiative, so chances are they'll get attacked at or before they swing. This is why the build that uses them successfully protects them with Minotaur characters, who are much, much harder to kill with the proper equipment. It should also be noted that Bloodgreed can be a double-edged sword, but you can use Chariots (to chase stuff down) and chaff (to keep redirectors out of your way) to mitigate it, so it's not a big deal.
Suggest, if you would pleae a good start minotaur build/ playstyle? They really are the units I like, if they suck I might go a different army.
It's fairly simple, actually. You take a unit of 6-9 Minotaurs, and put it front and center. Next, you spend your Core allowance on Chariots, Ungor Raiders, and Gore. Thirdly, you bring Razorgors and Harpies to guard flanks and chase off redirectors. Last and most importantly, you suit up three of the baddest Minotaur characters the book will allow you to bring, and you spend any and all leftover points on magic. I'll put up a sample army list of what I would do, and you can take from that what you will.
I'd appreciate that. Any suggestions on harpy conversions? Thinking daemonettes with fury wings?
I used Gargoyle wings, personally. I also converted Razorgors using the boars from Savage Orc Boar Boyz and some bits from Chaos Spawn. Anyway, here's a sample list for 2500 points (this is the total I usually play in, and I think it illustrates where I want to go with the Minobus well):
Beasts of Rage - 2500 points:
Core - 625 points:
40 Gors, Additional Hand Weapons, Full Command
2 x Tuskgor Chariot
4 x 5 Ungor Raiders
Special - 644 points:
6 Minotaurs, Full Command (Bloodkine has the Blackened Plate), Shields [Minotaur characters go here]
2 x Razorgor
2 x 5 Harpies
Heroes - 619 points:
Gorebull, Armor of Destiny, Battle Standard-Bearer, Shield
Gorebull, Armor of Silvered Steel, Great Weapon, Ironcurse Icon
Bray-Shaman, Additional Hand Weapon, L2 Wizard, Shard of the Herdstone [Lore of Shadows]
Lords - 617 points:
Doombull, Gnarled Hide, Heavy Armor, Ramhorn Helm, Shield, Sword of Swift Slaying, Talisman of Preservation
Great Bray-Shaman, Additional Hand Weapon, Dispel Scroll, L4 Wizard [Lore of Shadows]
Grand Total: 2500 points
The strategy behind the list is fairly simple - the Minotaurs run up to whatever they see and blow it up, while the Wizards camp out in the back by the Herdstone and provide support in the form of debuffs and magic defense. The Gors can grind lesser infantry down and provide ranks to break the more elite stuff, the Chariots and Razorgors can bring some extra combat resolution and help make up for the Minotaurs' puny pursuit distance, the Ungor Raiders generally get in the way and provide some rudimentary shooting, and the Harpies will let you hunt down war machines and pick off lesser units that try to get in the Minotaurs' way. As for the unit itself, it's protected from fire, has a nominal save against war machines and 3 really tough guys guarding the front, so you should be all right.
Last edited by rothgar13; January 31st, 2012 at 21:36.