Warhammer Armies: Beastmen (BoC 6.5)

[ZombieCancer]

I think Bestigors with skirmish rule would over do them and probably cut into an unbalanced unit.
*The list so far is looking great and my only feedback from last post is maybe bestigors get like the black orcs, armed to da teef like rule, so they can be equipped with what ever a player would like for a turn. Just idea though, keep the ideas coming

[frozencore]

Originally Posted by ZombieCancer

I think Bestigors with skirmish rule would over do them and probably cut into an unbalanced unit.

Why? There are already units that do this in other armies, and you can take Morghur to give Bestigors skirmish now.

[Phoenix]

Opinions welcome on the following please :

Bestigor Herd

Bestigor: XXpts/model
MX WS5 BSX SX TX WX IX A2 LdX

(X = same as currently)


Unit Size: 10+

Mark of Chaos: Undivided

Equipment: Hand Weapon.

Options:
-Promote one Bestigor to a Musician for +Xpts.
-Promote one Bestigor to a Standard Bearer for +Xpts.
-Promote one Bestigor to a Gouge-horn (+1A) for +Xpts.

-Any unit may be equipped with Additional Hand Weapons (+2 pts/model) or Great Weapons (+3 pts/model).
-Any unit may be equipped with Shields (+1 pts/model) and Light Armour (+1 pts/model), Heavy Armour (+2 pts/model) or Chaos Armour (+3 pts/model).
-If a Bestigor Herd is not equipped with any Armour or Shields, they may be made Skirmishers for +3pts/model. The unit gains the Raiders special rule.
-Any unit may exchange the Mark of Chaos Undivided for the Mark of Khorne (+ pts), Nurgle (+ pts), Slannesh (+pts), or Tzeentch (+Xpts).
-One unit in the army may carry a magic standard worth up to 50 pts.

* An army cannot include more Bestigor Herds than it has Beast Herds

[Stunted_Merc]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

Opinions welcome on the following please :

Bestigor Herd

Bestigor: XXpts/model
MX WS5 BSX SX TX WX IX A2 LdX

(X = same as currently)


Unit Size: 10+

Mark of Chaos: Undivided

Equipment: Hand Weapon.

Options:
-Promote one Bestigor to a Musician for +Xpts.
-Promote one Bestigor to a Standard Bearer for +Xpts.
-Promote one Bestigor to a Gouge-horn (+1A) for +Xpts.

-Any unit may be equipped with Additional Hand Weapons (+2 pts/model) or Great Weapons (+3 pts/model).
-Any unit may be equipped with Shields (+1 pts/model) and Light Armour (+1 pts/model), Heavy Armour (+2 pts/model) or Chaos Armour (+3 pts/model).
-If a Bestigor Herd is not equipped with any Armour or Shields, they may be made Skirmishers for +3pts/model. The unit gains the Raiders special rule.
-Any unit may exchange the Mark of Chaos Undivided for the Mark of Khorne (+ pts), Nurgle (+ pts), Slannesh (+pts), or Tzeentch (+Xpts).
-One unit in the army may carry a magic standard worth up to 50 pts.

* An army cannot include more Bestigor Herds than it has Beast Herds

That'd rule, my 20x Besties would be more threatening on the tabletop at least.

-K

[frozencore]

Very cool.

I like all the options, but some of them are unnecessary, like light armor. If you want armor you will probably go full bore.

Lizardmen are cheaper, have a similar statline (aside from WS but they have much better leadership) and have heavy armor and a shield for free. I think the Bestigors should at least have the heavy armor for "free." They could then have the option to trade their armor for the raiders rule plus some cost. I'm not sure that having a unit with heavy armor and skirmishers would be that game-breaking, it would be annoying to loose the armor since all the models currently have it. In the end it is just nitpicky tweaks. I estimated the value of a unit with great weapons and skirmish with their statline at around 17 points, and you have it at 18, which is pretty spot on in my book.

[Phoenix]

Originally Posted by frozencore

Very cool.

I like all the options, but some of them are unnecessary, like light armor. If you want armor you will probably go full bore.

Lizardmen are cheaper, have a similar statline (aside from WS but they have much better leadership) and have heavy armor and a shield for free. I think the Bestigors should at least have the heavy armor for "free." They could then have the option to trade their armor for the raiders rule plus some cost. I'm not sure that having a unit with heavy armor and skirmishers would be that game-breaking, it would be annoying to loose the armor since all the models currently have it. In the end it is just nitpicky tweaks. I estimated the value of a unit with great weapons and skirmish with their statline at around 17 points, and you have it at 18, which is pretty spot on in my book.

Cool, thanks man

The lack of skirmish armour is just to keep it ''themey'' imo. Light armour may be ok.. but writing that in terms of an options rule could get very faffy lol. I may drop their base cost as they have no armour as standard, although i was hoping their stat line increase to that of Chaos Warriors would account for that lol.

[frozencore]

Yeah, you would think that, but with the recent books units are getting more stuff for their points. The power creep is quite obvious when you look at what you get for X points in an old book like Beasts of Chaos, when compared to the something in Warriors or Lizardmen.

[Phoenix]

Lol, true. Thing is, this is version 6.5, not 7 As in the OP, i want to keep it as a book that someone could look at and believe it to be totally the product of GW during 6th ed fantasy.

[Phoenix]

Got a chance to test out the new Centigor last night!

All was well until they actually had to try and DO something...

T1: Drunk +Stupid

T2: Charged by giant, who yells and balls (? - i lose by 2). Centis break, flee the board, causing a Beasthers (with Wargor and Shaman in...) to also flee... off the freakin board!

Ahh well, beasts wouldnt be beasts without centigor Hopefully ill get a better game with them next time (btw, the 2x4 minotaurs went on to wreak havoc )


PS: id like some thoughts on the marks of chaos. Specifically which units should automatically get MoCU, and which should have access to other marks, and under what circumstances (e.g minos same as general, etc).

I gave Centis MoCU. Im gonna drop the Shaggoth champ bit (i feel its very un-fluffy) and hence no Dragon Ogre can be marked, aside from that its just the basic Herds and Hounds that arent MocU basic. Should it be made an optional upgrade for beast herds? Or all units?

Thanks for any input/feedback

[frozencore]

Well in the new Warriors book pretty much everything can be marked, including Dragon Ogres.

I don't know if Beasts really need it, or would even use it. Our basic troops are supposed to be cheap, so it kind of defeats that purpose adding on expensive marks. I guess that can be a player choice, though, as some people mark marauders.

Try using Undivided on standard beast herds and let us know how much it really effects the game. Now that I think about it rerolling psychology tests might make them more balanced in larger point games with terror causers, but not be overly powerful because of their generally low leadership.