Need help vs Lost and the damned (1500 Chaos) - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
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    Need help vs Lost and the damned (1500 Chaos)

    Hi there,

    I play a world eaters army, with the following list:

    1500 Pts - CSM: World Eaters Army

    1 Daemon Prince @ 147 Pts
    Mark of Khorne; CC Weapon (x2)
    Daemonic Stature
    Daemonic Speed
    Daemonic Resilience
    Daemonic Strength
    Daemonic Aura
    Feel No Pain

    7 Khorne Berzerkers Chaos Space Marines (Troops) @ 204 Pts
    Chainaxe (x8 ); Bolt Pistol (x7)
    #Furious Charge
    1 Free Aspiring Champion
    Power Fist (x1); Bolt Pistol (x1)
    Talisman of Burning Blood


    7 Khorne Berzerkers Chaos Space Marines (Troops) @ 180 Pts
    Chainaxe (x8 ); Bolt Pistol (x7)
    1 Free Aspiring Champion
    Power Fist (x1); Bolt Pistol (x1)
    Talisman of Burning Blood

    7 Khorne Berzerkers Chaos Space Marines (Troops) @ 180 Pts
    Chainaxe (x8 ); Bolt Pistol (x7)
    1 Free Aspiring Champion
    Power Fist (x1); Bolt Pistol (x1)
    Talisman of Burning Blood

    8 Bloodletter (Troops) @ 208 Pts
    Bloodletter

    5 Khorne Berzerkers Bikers (Fast Attack) @ 268 Pts
    Mark of Khorne; Chainaxe (x6); Combi-Bolter (x5)
    1 Aspiring Champion
    Power Fist (x1); Combi-Bolter


    1 Chaos Predator (Heavy Support) @ 145 Pts
    Autocannon; Lascannon Sponsons
    Daemonic Possession

    1 Chaos Predator (Heavy Support) @ 165 Pts
    TL Lascannons; Lascannon Sponsons
    Daemonic Possession

    Models in Army: 41

    Now he plays LatD, and he uses something like this:

    3 aspiring champions of khorne with powerfists

    3 units of about 20 or more mutants with mutant bosses with powerfists

    1 unit of 6 traitors with an autocannon.

    1 Leman Russ

    1 Defiler

    3 units of 8 furies

    1 unit of 6 daemonettes


    My zerkers just can't kill enough mutants a turn to get to the powerfistwielding baddies, so once I hit with al my marines, they are still standing and thwack me with 9 powerfist attacks. His daemons also have higher initiative than my marines, and my bloodletters are fearly useless against his troops. Also, he has a frightening score of hit rolls on his scatter dice, so usually he will render 1, sometimes 2 squads useless with his ordnance.

    I don't know how i can wither down his numbers, my daemon prince can't taken a unit on on it's own because of the 9 powerfist attacks.

    I've now been massacred 3 times in a row, and it isn't funny anymore.

    Could you guys please give me some tactical advice?


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  3. #2
    Dancing Peanuts? You bet! Robizzle's Avatar
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    106 (x4)

    Thats a toughie. He looks like he has a pretty hard army, so I'll say this:

    Try getting as many squads into 1 mutant squad as possible. If you can pile in your Prince, 2 squads and your bikes, you should rip a squad to shreds, without worrying about the power fist. If you can than consolidate into cover, he can't counter charge you very well. You probably need to take down the Russ and Defiler quickly, but against this army, personally I would say drop the autocannon predator and get another squad of bloodletters. These things are really worthwhile against mutants.

  4. #3
    Slave to the flesh The_Outsider's Avatar
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    251 (x8)

    Assault everything in one place, overwhelm his squads with yours. Assuming you can survive the defiler and Russ you will rip his army to shreds.

    Go for a flank and then roll the army up from behind, to keep himself safe he will have to do some major redployment or throw 1 or 2 squads at you to slow you down.

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    Hi guys, well I'm the LatD guy he talks about. I've only played 4 games with them till now and I'm still gaining experience with every battle. I play 40k for a while now so I'm no Noobie. In our battles, I always get to deploy first for some reason and the games we played were Cleanse or Pitched Battle missions, last time it was with escalation, so his deployment zone was kinda cramped. In the last battle (escalation), my tanks didn't do a thing because they arrived a bit late, but the rest went good for me. I used 3 deamon units in turn 2 to charge a zerker unit and wipe it out, consolidating with them all in cover as much as possible. I don't think it's easy for an army like his with 41 models to group up on me, cuz I almost have 2,5 times as much models. And we aren't really of the mindset to change our army according to the opponent. I' still tryong stuff out and so is he, but he has to win sometime... He's getting depressed, somehow my LatD also won from a very shooty marine army(nilla) even though I don't have bloated mutants and walked straight to him....:shifty:

  6. #5
    Senior Member JORMAGI's Avatar
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    Ok as an experiened Lost player with a list not too diferent from Cowbertha's I have some hard words for you:
    MY LIST HAS NEVER LOST TO KHORNE, not once, pisses the local players off. (Well at least the khorne croud.) And it's not not just wins it's usually crushing defeats. I can imagine your frustration.

    Mutants are idealy suited to destroy elite CC squads.(Say the entire Khorne army. . .) They can't help it. It's nothing against your list. In fact in my opinion it's one of the best World Eater lists I've seen. You are the unfortunate victim of a bad paper rock sissors game you you keep picking rock, an he keeps picking paper.

    If you want to beat that list. . .play a diferent army.
    Votewar MKV 2nd place. . .

    Back from internet limbo, and glad to be here.

  7. #6
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    Heh, yeah I guessed as much. But I'm not giving up, the fact that it's hard doesn't mean it's impossible (I hope), and him beating me all the time makes me want to beat him even harder.

    So yeah, I guess it's just a bad match of armies.

  8. #7
    Senior Member JORMAGI's Avatar
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    Well since you're a good sport about it I'll try to give some thoughts that might help a bit.
    Each Bezerker on the charge will kill about 1.2 mutants. This means that if you can manage to keep the numbers even then there will be no retribution. Not on the charge they kill .67 each. So if you are charged be sure to outnumber 3 to 2 and you will still always win. Also getting the charge is a big deal. (though I am staiting the obvious with that last sentance.

    The problem is that if you keep your guys together to get the outnumbers then the become pieplate bait. You kill your oponent in one turn and are free to be shot up in the next shooting phase. I have often lost one squad to concentrated zerkers only to destroy them with a few pie plates. Ordinance is deadly when troops are packed together. . .

    Hmm I might suggest if you know you're going up against this list don't buy chainaxes. That will save you a few points to use on other stuff as they're not going to help you vs av5 muntants.

    You might look at dropping Furious Charge as well It's most usefull effect is the ability to go first against MeQ's, but you already have the inititive. After the first turn you're str bonus is gone, and you're bogged down with a bunch of mutants.

    These things will make your zerkers cheeper, so you can get better numbers against the mutants. this does two thing for you: lower the impact of the powerfists hurting you, and allows you to take more zerkers so you can kill these guys faster. Basicly your ideal CC phase is you killing a ton of mutants you get hit with a few powerfists, loose a few guys, then wipe out the fists on his turn. then on your turn you charge another mutant squad and do it again.

    So if your not above tooling your army to beat him go with as many bare zerkers as you can take. that's 20% more zerkers and each one is as good as the standard tooled one (well against this army anyway.)

    Dropping your bikes and bloodletters will give you 25 more (well 24 you want to stick with sacred #'s as these are less effective vs mutants.

    Corse vs a normal army list I already said that you've got a pretty sweet setup as it is.
    Votewar MKV 2nd place. . .

    Back from internet limbo, and glad to be here.

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    thanks for the tips, I have thought about taking a unit of 16 marines, see how that works, maybe then I will have enough attacks to sweep the ENTIRE killzone clean (usually, it's just the powerfist guys and a few mutants standing, and then they pile in).

    Anyway, we are having another match tonight, so I'll try something new.

    Thanks alot for all your comments

  10. #9
    Librarian from Hell Andusciassus's Avatar
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    Make sure to keep that lord out of the Champs/Mutant bosses killzone's. If you are not base to base with any mutants after your attacks he cannot retaliate. If the Power fists are not within the 2" radius they cannot allocate hits on him. That ought to keep him alive.

  11. #10
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    Actually, he can retaliate if I kill all his engaged models. You still count as being in contact, so they can strike back (otherwise you could actually kill to many models and allow him to rapid fire the next turn).

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