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I need help i can beat any army except sisters of battle, damn faith points! they keep out manuvering me what can i do to make this list more mobile?
DP, Aura, Armour, Resiliance, Speed, Strength, Stature, Dread Axe, CCW, Spiky Bits, Master Crafted 191
3 x Oblitirators 210
3 x Oblitirators 210
3 x Oblitirators 210
8 x Marines /W Bolt Pistols&CCW, Infiltrate, Furious Charge
AC, Mutation, Strength, Visage, Melta Bombs, Pair Lightning Claws, Master Crafted, Spiky Bits 265
8 x Marines /W Bolters
2 x Plasma Guns, AC, Plasma Pistol, Power Weapon 165
5 x Havocs
4 x Missile Launchers, Tank Hunters, Infiltrate, AC, Aura, Power Weapon 213
Vindicator, Mutated Hull, Parasitic Possesion 160
All Las Cannons, Mutated Hull 175
Basalisk, Indirect, Mutated Hull, Parasitic Possesion 175
Mark of Undevided 26
2000 points Exactly
Why 8 man in the regular CSM squads but only 5 in the havocs?
Drop the AC from the havocs, too... they shouldn't see an assault, not with tank hunting and infiltration - you want them shooting only. And 1 power weapon in the squad isn't going to help if you get charged by an assault unit.
For your Daemon prince, you can't master craft a Dread Axe... no daemon weapons / gift of the god weapons can be master crafted, only spiky bits.
And 9 oblits? that's a bit much, isn't it? Especially since one exorcist can ruin their day with insta-killing ap1 rockets.
As for mobility, you're about as mobile as an IW army can get with a squad of infiltrators, two vehicles, and some oblits.
EDIT - POSTED SAME TIME AS MOOB
Iron Warriors eh? I was under the impression that they weren't very mobile. Stand your ground, pound them with heavy fire power and have your squads protect each other.
HQ - Not legal. You're 10 points over your gift limit, plus you cannot mastercraft a daemon weapon and mastercrafting a normal CCweapon is totally useless.
This guy need toning down. You have the Chaos Warscythe which is brill against sisters, but he just ties up too many points.
You could do without Armour or Strength to be honest - they're quite superfluous especially considering howmany ap1 weapons the sisters can muster...
Elites - ... not much to say here really. Obliterators are amazing.. but 9.. possibly overkill.. maybe reduce them to two per squad?
A wasted opportunity here. Your assault marines have no assault weapons (give them 2 meltas) and if you want to pimp up their AC, give him a powerfist, mutation and spikey bits.
The plasma pistol on the only power weapon in the squad is a really bad idea. Drop it.
16 marines @ 2000 points??
All i'm saying is that.. as Chaos players we have access to what i think IS the best unit in the game - Chaos Space Marines. You should at least consider trying to use them a bit more to balance your force out a bit.
Havocs - Where are your meatshields? Drop the champ and have 4 meatshields. Infiltrate AND tank hunters. You have 9 obliterators too, that's quite enough lascannon fire, consider taking autocannons.
Predator - drop mutated hull in favour of possession.
Others - can't comment.
I dunno.. it's the typciall IRon warriors list really which abuses obliterator and also 4 HS slots. I can see the appeal, but i'm not convinced. I just think that if you tone down on some of the IRon warrior perks that you can get a really really devastating list.
LO RulesOriginally Posted by AnonymousOriginally Posted by Cyric
Yeh karmoon is right about the Hq lots of pts spent.
need more basic marines, the ac has too many upgrades
my main concern is with the heavy support, vindicators fine, its just the basilick should lose possesion and mutated hull, hopefully u should be able to hide this and shoot indirect ,its meant to be a cheap killer. the possesion should be moved to the las predator.
The havocs jsut need 8 marines 4 with rockets, but i use 4 heavy bolters for mass infantry death. U definatly have enough tank killing support with you olits. drop the AC use the points somewhere else.
hope this helps.
Hope is the first step on the road to dissapointment.
1500 Iron Warriors
2000 Biel-Tan Eldar
2000 Imperial guard
You should consider dropping the armor. I second the arguements about the master crafted. Spikey bits is ok on this guy but I am not a fan of putting too many points into any HQ. Also being over gift points is a no no.Originally Posted by santrialStandard iron warrior line up so all good.Originally Posted by santrialThis unit is a liability more than a benifit. First, it is a lone assault unit that has no friends to back it up. Second, it is not very mobile. A cc squad should be able to reach far targets or run down its enemy. Sometimes that means someone else to hold the target down, but these guys are too easily outrun. Finally, the champ needs a major downsize. He has double rerolls but since you can only reroll EACH DICE once you can easily waste one of the upgrades. Also, the melta bombs are not so great as you would be much better served just by having meltas in the squad. That would add more damage before your charge and make them better tank hunters. The lightening claw pair is simply not worth what you pay for it. MAYBE on a lord with a lot of attacks, but in general you won't get 30 points of value out of them.Originally Posted by santrial
I imagine you mean this as a counter charge unit to shut down enemy assaults. Just keep in mind that all your eggs in one basket or trick can backfire.The double plasma isn't a bad idea, but you should consider that for only 5 more points one of those could be a las cannon. Also, this unit would benifit a lot from a MOCU. Definitly take off the plasma on the champ. I know three plasma in the squad has a lot of appeal but his being only 12inch range severly reduces its usefulness compared to cost. Feel free to overlook that if you really like the pistol.Originally Posted by santrialYou seriously need more bodies in this unit. For only 20 points you get a sheild to keep those guns firing. As it is now every pistol round is crushing and if your enemy can get just three wounds they will be under 50% and giving away victory points. I say drop the AC all together. Do to majority saves rules you waste the aura and the pweapon is a unworthy upgrade on a hiding shooty unit (especially when you estimate it cost you 23 points to have that weapon).Originally Posted by santrialDaemonic possession is simply better than the parasitic. You will get your points back by ignoring the shakens more often than the repaired gun will help you.Originally Posted by santrial14 armor is nice, but I prefer daemonic on this one too. Your call.Originally Posted by santrialI agree with Farseer Benillus. Just keep this keep and hidden. It is a headache without more points sunk in.Originally Posted by santrialWhat do you mean by this??Originally Posted by santrial
I look forward to seeing where you go with this. I am not sure why it is sisters in particular out manuvering you. A strong mech Tau or beardy skimmer eldar list seem like they would be a bigger headache. Is that just one of your better regular enemy players?
Last edited by studentochaos; September 4th, 2006 at 04:50.