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Hey, i wanted to inquire some information about my anti armor army... I am getting ready for 1000 points tournament and having a hard decision what to put in and what not... Hope you will help me, so that's the army list:
Firstly the idea of this one: bikers with turbo boosters move to shooties of lighter heavy support and then terminators teleport to them using teleport homer. On the other side a squad of havocs are taking out heavy stuff, while troops advance and then unleash a squad of bloodlashers to a bit thinner force... On that time chaos lieutenant must have been dead already, because he is only kinda decoy...
+Power fist, bolt pistol, daemonic aura, daemonic flight, MoCU.
Chosen Terminator squad (5)
Chaos Space Marine squad (7: 3 pistols, 3 bolters)
+MoCU, 1xHeavy bolter, 1xIcon bearer, 1xAspiring champ (Power fist, bolt pistol, MoCU, mutation)
Chaos Space Marine squad (7: 3 pistols, 3 bolters)
+MoCU, 1xHeavy bolter, 1xIcon bearer, 1xAspiring champ (Power weapon, bolt pistol, MoCU, Spiky Bits, Daemonic strength)
Bloodletters of Khorne (5)
CSM Bikers (3)
+AP (power weapon, telport homer)
Chaos Havocs (5)
So this is it... One thing that i don't like is that it has so much of everything and in the same time it has nothing... I want to leave only demons or only terminators and pump up my units a bit... Additionally i have 2xRhinos, 1xObliterator, a bunch more of terminators, bikers, bloodletters and marines... I would be glad if someone could help me about improving my 1000 pts anti-armor (because major of enemies in tournament will be armored (2xsm, 3xcsm, 1xtau, 1xnecrons and 1xTyranids...)) army...
Alright, well, I'm no expert, but I'll give it a go. I'd reccommend dropping something, either the Terminators or the Bikers. I would imagine bikers would be easiest. Well, maybe the bloodletters, in fact, well, it's up to you. I'll let you decide what to drop, but I don't think I am wrong when I say something has to go. I'd wager it'd be better for you to sprinkle points amongst the other units.
HQ: Alright, I am not sure what yout want to achieve with this fellow. I guess early assault to keep the enemy busy until your terminators arrive? If so, I'd go for the "infiltrating speed lord." Buy infiltrate and Daemonic Speed for him, it will allow him to get first turn charge on the assumption you protect him during deployment in case your opponent gets the roll to go first. Replace his powerfist with at least a Power weapon, preferably something fun like a Darkblade, or if you have the points Mark of Nurgle and a Manreaper. Coupled with Daemonic Strength, will let you cause some serious chaos amongst the enemy battle line.
Elites: Looks ok. I'd throw in a Reaper Autocannon or two. Also make sure you point in at least one Chainfist to handle tougher enemies or armor that gets in your way. You seem to be a little light on anti-armor power. Maybe think about giving these guys Tank Hunters, 4x Str.8 shots in Rear Armor is a powerful thing. :yes:
Troops: The CSM squads look mostly good. I would also include a Plasmagun along with a Heavy Bolter for each squad. You may want to beef up the sizes a little, adding one or two more Marines for each sqaud. The champs look fine. However, I'd stick with all bolters for the fire support. But, that's just me.
Bloodletters look fine, consider adding more if you decide to keep them.
Fast Attack: Again, I'd add more. Three guys can dissapear quickly, one template shot, or one rapid-firing sqaud and you might lose a lot of points. If you keep them, add another one or two guys. Maybe add a meltagun as well. And of course, D. Strength on the Champion.
Heavy Support: Now for these guys. :shifty: Drop the missile launchers and go all Autocannons with Tank Hunters. Simply amazing. I almost guarantee something will die, be stunned, or otherwise disabled everytime you shoot armor with them. It's a great configuration. If they don't have a Mark you can infiltrate them, but I wouldn't too daring you need these guys in this list to survive. I would add Mark of Undivided and then throw in three more guys to use at meatshields for the Autocannons.
After reading your thoughts on the list I think I'm going to reccommend dropping the Bloodletters so you can use their points in other, perhaps more needed places. Anyway good luck, I hope this advice is helpful. Let me know how it goes.
"If you can wait til I get home, then I swear we can make this last."
Hi there, ok first off I may be repeating some things that hotspike18 has already said but bear with it, I defiantly agree with him on the note of "Something’s have to go". Well then here goes:
Ok, well I would defiantly agree with "it has so much of everything". Your bikers will die horribly without support, and a massive chunk of your points is being taken up by your termies.
Anyways, as almost all your up coming opponents are MEQ's, you should build your list to combat them, and then use that list to the best of its abilities against the nids.
Having said all that, in regard to the suggestions I have made you may have realised it would divide the army neatly in half:
Lightly tooled Lord + 2x CC squads in rhinos for close combat
2 Shooty squads + either a havoc squad or predator forming a solid fire base
keeping it flexible, with a solid body count (about 40 men). And each part of the army is supported by another. The plasma guns and melta guns will tear through those MEQ opponents of yours, and the Havocs will cleave through tanks (meltas can help if you really need it) and cut down many a Nid
Please keep in mind, the changes I have suggested are all biased by my own personal preference, tactics and experience. So if you don’t like something I have suggested, fair enough its your army, your the one who has to play it at the end of the day.
Firstly, thanks for responding. Secondly: why do you cling on autocannons so much? I am not very experienced, maybe i misunderstand something, but aren't krak missiles better against 3+ armor than autocannons?.. I mean strength is good against vehicles, i understand that but heavy infantry of my mentioned enemies will simply roll their armor saves... That is my opinion and i would be glad if someone could change it
About the type of army: sorry ronin, but that is not the army type i would like to have... I want to kick my enemy in the guts at the start of combat, if you catch my drift
hq thing: Hotspike thanks, i think that is all i needed for him
I am still not sure about what to do about scalpel part... Daemons or termies are the choices... Termies cost pretty much, and when i will be deepstriking them, they paraboly will shoot one turn, and then they will be in constant heat of close combat, thus loosing some advantage, besides, they will need either bikers or lieutenant... I am still not sure about it. And daemons are more close combat, can charge the turn they arrive, and cost less... So in some way i would prefer them rather terminators... Could anyone else give me a hand?
p.s. hotspike: the troop squads were bigger and had plasmas, however i had to drop them thus increasing my budget :>
Anyways, good luck with the list.
Glad to be of help. :yes:
BTW - most players swear against Chosen for different reasons. (Point costs vs. Stat Line, etc.) If you want more of an assault-ish force, daemons are certainly a viable option. If you take out the termies you can prolly afford some more bloodletters and another set of daemons. Maybe daemonettes, I hear their nice.
The thing with Autocannons is that with Tank Hunters, you are almost guaranteed (as far as odds go) to get some hits and do SOME kind of damage which usually means said armor won't be doing anything next turn. So lets say you are shooting at the toughest vehicle, a Land Raider. Out of 8 shots you should hit with 6. When you roll six dice you should get a six everytime. Now this won't always work out, but it can work better too. Anyway, try it, you'll be amazed how fast extra terrain shows up on the field.
"If you can wait til I get home, then I swear we can make this last."
Ok guys... I was thinking a bit and remade that army of mine... Take a look:
Damn only now, when i am writing i remember that everything is infiltrated or will be deep striked So... I put my havocs at some tanks or smth that they can take out, put my troops in some middle of battleground, and my lieutenant as close to some support stuff as i can. In the game lieutenant will make some havoc in enemy lines, while havocs will be taking out big stuff and troops will come a little bit closer and give some support fire. On second turn (hopefully) squads of csm will summon 2 squads of bloodletters, which will (hopefully) tear the armor of space marines, chaos space marines, necrons and tau apart, while one squad will be giving support fire and another will help from inside.
+Dark blade, Bolt pistol, Daemonic aura, Daemonic speed, MoCU, Infiltrate
CSM Squad ( (support)
1xIcon bearer 2xHeavy bolter; Infiltrate MoCU
CSM Squad ( (CC)
1xIcon bearer 2xPlasma gun; Infiltrate MoCU; 1xAC (Power weapon, Bolt pistol, Daemonic strength, MoCU)
Chaos havocs (
3xAutocannon 1xMissle launcher (i realy want to have at least one :>); Infiltrate Tank hunters.
So it's 984 pts and i have 16 pts left, if i counted correctly...
Please comment... I put only bloodletters, just because i have only bloodletters (becides i like bloodletters )It's a tournament, not official however and i am only allowed to have 10% GW proxies in my army however, i think that this one is a bit better than previous list...
Last edited by demord; March 29th, 2007 at 17:24.
so you can proxy 10% of your force?
and you have 1 obliterator
yummy, 2 obliterators for you then
most versatile and deadly unit we have in our arsenal
durable and scary as h%ll
on your list then, 2 units of bloodletters?
they are good against MEQ troops fair enough
but in terrain, against hoards, vehicles, not so good. They aren't all that hard to kill
they are also expensive. Almost as good at killing termies as anything but apart from that specialist role?
like the HQ : )
the CSM squad can't have 2 heavy bolters : (
if you want a heavy bolter doom squad you have a heavy slot, go for 3 heavy bolters and 3 marines, icon and infiltrate, MoCU
plasma CSM squad is good, although i suggest a power fist as it's an expensive squad which is easily locked in combat with something like a dreadnaught or big beastie. That powerfist gives you a chance.
personally i'd drop the letters for another CSM plasma squad and go with the 2 oblits, think thats about the points (completely rough, haven't counted anything)
Well csm squad can have 2 heavy bolters just like 2 plasma guns: 2 heavy or 2 special or 1heavy and 1special... Besides they are going to move, because they are summoning one squad of demons near enemy lines, and they are kinda backup... About powerfist: yeah i was thinking about it too... Maybe i should change it... About oblits: damn i am so much in love with them too however... There is no space for them... And as far as i understand from you and from others i realy shouldn't drop bloodletters because they are excellent against the enemies i will face... Well... except for tyranids. I think they are so gonna kick my ass if i would fight against them... Hope not Any other comments?
EDIT: Sry my bad they can't have 2 heavy weapons so i would make a bolter instead of heavy bolter and sum of points drops by 5...
Last edited by demord; March 29th, 2007 at 18:37.
Primary army: Eldar.
Secondary army: Chaos.
Switch around the special and heavy weapons so you won't lose anything. The squads can have a Heavy Bolter and a Plasmagun, they just can't double up.
I'd reccommend making the bloodletters one nice big unit (major combat punch, plus losses will be more acceptable) and then maybe including an Obliterator. Hmmm, I think by my fast math you still need a point or two...Maybe drop MoCU on the Lord, but I'd rather see the D. Str on the champion go first. Anyway, hope this helps.
(hotspike18 in disguise - using a friends login right now)
I'm not here for the respect, just here to spread the clarity of a very complicated game