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  1. #1
    Confused Corgi Angron88's Avatar
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    1500 pts undivided friendly

    As I tend to ramble constantly whenever I try to type an army list down, I think it would be best if I just get straight to the point.

    A friend of mine, who plays as Imperial guard, suggested that I give all of my assault squads (the ones with 8 members) Infiltrate so I can avoid the punishment they would take running against his massive guard army, another friend's Tau gunline of death (his army includes firepower-heavy crisis suits, 3 sniper teams, broadsides, a few units of tau fire warriors and a whole lot of other nasty shooters.) and finally, most suited against my 3+ save marines, the dreaded Necrons.

    Taking this suggestion, I opted to take him up on the thought and dished out more points than I'd like to mention to give my 3 squads of 8 marines and my Lord infiltrate. To back up this strike force, a Defiler with a havoc launcher and an autocannon squad of tank hunting Havocs as well as 2 squads of 6 marines armed with 2 plasma guns each. And just a quick note, the obliterators have deep strike so I can get their nice twin-linked melta guns to meet with some armored vehicles.

    *All models have the mark of chaos undivided except the Obliterators

    HQ- Chaos Lord, Lightning claws, frag grenades, Infiltrate, 2 Hounds, Demonic Aura

    Elites- 2 Obliterators

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, flamer, melta gun

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, flamer, melta gun

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, flamer, melta gun

    Troops- 6 Chaos Marines, Champion, 2 plasma guns

    Troops- 6 Chaos Marines, Champion, 2 plasma guns

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, tank hunters, 4 autocannons

    Heavy Support- Defiler, indirect fire, Havoc launcher, smoke launchers


    As this army is divided into two parts, I'd just like to make it clear what squad does what

    Infiltrating horde- Chaos Lord (and hounds) all 3-man chaos marine squads, obliterators

    Firebase- Havocs, 6-man chaos marine squads, defiler


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  3. #2
    LO Zealot Ironangel256's Avatar
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    291 (x6)

    HQ- Chaos Lord, Lightning claws, frag grenades, Infiltrate, 2 Hounds, Demonic Aura
    I would actually drop the two hounds to get him speed and resilience / strength.

    Elites- 2 Obliterators
    Yummy...

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, flamer, melta gun

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, flamer, melta gun

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, flamer, melta gun
    Have those flamers ever really helped you? I have only found them to be effective in CoD or against orks / nids. I would try to switch to all melta or do 2 squads melta and one squad with dual flamers.

    Troops- 6 Chaos Marines, Champion, 2 plasma guns

    Troops- 6 Chaos Marines, Champion, 2 plasma guns
    I would get these guys infiltrate as well, otherwise they are gonna be hard pressed to get into range with those guns.

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, tank hunters, 4 autocannons
    Not bad, optimum number os 8 man.

    Heavy Support- Defiler, indirect fire, Havoc launcher, smoke launchers
    I would say to drop this thing entirely. It will draw all of the AT fire from the opposing side, being the only piece of armor. If anything I would make some of the changes I suggested above and try to grab a 3 man squad of bikes to continue with the assualty theme. something like 3x bikes, 1x melta, AC w/ D. str + PW should do nicely.
    IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT!

    I survived LO Chat thanks to: Karmoon, Rabbit, Process, Tossy and Meish.

  4. #3
    The other Kind of Fluff Rabbit's Avatar
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    946 (x8)

    Ironangel made some excellent suggestions. I would follow them to the 'T.' If you're facing lots of swarm armies, then having more flamers than meltas isn't a bad idea. I wouldn't mix them. General rule fo thumb: With special weapons, it's best to take two of the same kind.

    H.Q.: D. Resilience is virtually an automatic upgrade for c.c. h.q's, as is d. strength. Also, if you're going to take infiltrate, as Ironangel said, you might as well take d. speed and get that first turn charge.

    Havocs: At the 1500 mark, you'll need no less than seven in order to ensure their survival. Eight is better (like Ironangel mentioned), but you can probably get away with seven, if you're lucky.

    If you chose to drop the defiler, and I strongly suggest you do, your main priority would be to make those changes that Ironangel recommended, that is, before you invest in any additional units.

    Good Luck.
    Spambot kill tally. . .337

  5. #4
    Confused Corgi Angron88's Avatar
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    Because I already explained the changes, I apparently wasn't logged in so I lost the message. Rather than re-writing everything I just want to point out a few things.

    1- I am adapting this list into an Iron Warriors army.

    2- There is no reason to give the lord d. strength as he still can't take out tanks and he gets to re-roll any failed to hits.

    3- I can't take hounds anyway because followers can't infiltrate.

    4- Iron warriors let me use more than one unit of obliterators, so they will be independent.

    5- I am adding another Havoc squads for points reasons (gets me under the limit and not 50 under.

    6- To keep in character of the army, I will not use any fast attack (no bikes)

    7- I don't want to give my lord D. speed as he could get separated too easily and overwhelmed (considering the fact he seems indestructable and unstoppable in combat)

    8- As there is a good chance a friend of mine will start a 'nid army, the large blast str 8 battle cannon (also useful against necrons) will be too valuable to pass up

    And 9- thank you for all your help, I would never be in the place I am if it weren't for your support and advice

    *all units except the obliterators have the mark of chaos undivided

    HQ- Lord, Lightning claws, frag grenades, bolt pistol, Infiltrate, D. Aura, Resilience

    Elites- Obliterator

    Elites- Obliterator

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 melta guns

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 melta guns

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 flamers

    Heavy Support- 5 Havocs, tank hunters, 4 Autocannons

    Heavy Support- 5 Havocs, 2 Heavy Bolters, 2 Missile Launchers

    Heavy Support- Dreadnought, Plasma Cannon, Missile Launcher, smoke launchers

    Heavy Support- Defiler, Indirect fire, Havoc Launcher, smoke launchers

  6. #5
    0!=1jumpin'punch'swing jONESIE's Avatar
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    103 (x3)

    Hey Champion!

    Ok, to be honest, I like the changes, I like the newer list. It has style.

    My only qualm is the 3x Fist on the troops- I'm the type, as Rabbit and Ironangel suggested, to not have different special weapons in the same unit. So, going to all flamers/meltas is great.

    Yet, I also do the same with the Champions. You can't shoot armour with the flame unit, why bother with anti-armour 'Fist on the Champ? I'd take Flamers with a Power Weapon + Dae Strength Champ, just out of preference- then, there are no mixed roles, and the units role is clearly defined. Flamers + PW + Dae Strength = wanting that tasty Inititive, IMO

    Also, one could argue that the Defiler is using Indirect, why bother with the (expensive) Havoc Launcher, but, it's autocannon + havoc launcher makes it an agressive moving platform. Your choice

    5x Havocs with 4x Heavy Weapons is risky, but that's your choice, and with the Infiltrating Lord + Troops + 4x Heavies, should be ok- you'd be down the opponents neck pretty quickly! {goofy} But don't be suprised if the opponent hits tham and they fall over, taking away all those valuable VP's.

    Maybe dropping missle launchers on teh second Havocs, and giving them an Aspiring Champion + Kai Gun? (bearing in mind the new Codex within a years time ). I have seen great success with Heavy Bolters + Kai Gun Havocs.

    Anyways, good Luck Chief, tell us how it fares
    Last edited by jONESIE; June 9th, 2007 at 12:01. Reason: Typos! Always the typos! *twitch*
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaffar_Hasad
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    They still exist?
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  7. #6
    Confused Corgi Angron88's Avatar
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    Well, on the flamer squad, I kind of made a typo with the copying and pasting (I forgot to change his equipment, I was going to make the change you noted)

    Then, on the Havocs, the kai gun idea is actually really viable and I will toy around with that, probably taking out the indirect fire on the Defiler for the extra "mess around" points.

    By the way, the havoc launcher is actually only a mere 10 points if upgraded from the Defiler's heavy flamer (after all, who would put a flamer on a support unit?)

    Seeing as the only other qualm on the list is the lack of bodies in the havoc units, assuming I dont go too over the top on the 2nd havoc squad, it should work out. Worst case scenario, I take the Dreadnought's plasma cannon off and replace it with a heavy bolter or autocannon.

    It's about 7:15 where I am right now and I am still too tired from partying last night, I'm just going to sober up and come up with a few slight changes and be back in about 2 or 3 hours.

    -Cheerio!

  8. #7
    Confused Corgi Angron88's Avatar
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    HQ- Lord, Lightning claws, frag grenades, bolt pistol, Infiltrate, D. Aura, Resilience

    Elites- Obliterator

    Elites- Obliterator

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 melta guns

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 melta guns

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, power weapon, strength, 2 flamers

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, tank hunters, 4 Autocannons

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, champion, Kai gun, 2 Heavy Bolters

    Heavy Support- Dreadnought, Plasma Cannon, Missile Launcher

    Heavy Support- Defiler, Havoc Launcher

  9. #8
    The other Kind of Fluff Rabbit's Avatar
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    946 (x8)

    Looks pretty good.

    I won't advise putting d. speed on your h.q., simply because you're against it, other than to say that it would greatly improve your army.

    Power Fist -vs- Power weapon & daemonic speed: Any time you have a large number of wounds in a squad (like , and you don't have a particularly high init (that is, 4 or lower), then it's ALWAYS better to have a fist. I don't like being so matter of fact about it, but honestly, it really is the case. The only exception is for E.C. marines, but that's a bit off topic. Second, against Nids, Eldar and Dark Eldar, you'll be going last anyway, so preserving your init isn't important. Remember, you have 8 wounds protecting the a.c., which is more than enough to make up for the 1I conferred by the fist. Plus, you want your a.c. to be hitting as hard as possible, and you simply cannot produce a good number of kills with a power weapon & daemonic strength on 4I models.

    Havocs: Increase the autocannon havoc unit to 7, then decrease your other havoc unit to 5. This effectively gives each havoc squad 3 wounds, before you start losing heavy weapons or your kai gun. As it stands your autocannon havocs only have 2 wounds, and your other havocs have 4.

    Defiler & Havoc Launcher: I just want to make sure that you know about firing ordinance weapons. Whenever you fire an ordinance weapon, that model cannot fire any other weapons. This means that your havoc launcher upgrade will only be in use when your battlecannon is not. In other words, it's a conditional upgrade. In my experience, I've fired the secondary defiler weapons twice (that's ever) in a game. Given that, it may only be 10 points for the havoc launcher, but that's 10 points that are 100% wasted.
    Spambot kill tally. . .337

  10. #9
    Confused Corgi Angron88's Avatar
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    Eh, whatever. Just to finish justifying the means on the Power weapon, because they both cost the same points, I will just go with two champions and switch them depending on who I am fighting. That said, there seems to only be the problem with the havoc launcher, so, if it will make you happy, Rabbit, fine, the Havoc launcher goes bye-bye and the numbers get chamged. Hey! I've got enough points left over to give those smoke launcher back! And on top of all this, my Dreadnought can get extra armour, finally!

    HQ- Lord, Lightning claws, frag grenades, bolt pistol, Infiltrate, D. Aura, Resilience

    Elites- Obliterator

    Elites- Obliterator

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 melta guns

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, powerfist, 2 melta guns

    Troops- 8 Chaos Marines, frags, infiltrate, Champion, Powerfist, 2 flamers

    **(Variant Champion; Aspiring Champion, power weapon, strength)**

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, tank hunters, 4 Autocannons

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, champion, Kai gun, 2 Heavy Bolters

    Heavy Support- Dreadnought, Plasma Cannon, Missile Launcher, Extra Armour, smoke launchers

    Heavy Support- Defiler

    I'll get to work playtesting a bit more, Thank you guys for all of the help and I wish you good luck scouring the Galaxy of the foolish Loyalists of the False Emporer
    Last edited by Angron88; June 11th, 2007 at 23:06.

  11. #10
    LO Zealot Ironangel256's Avatar
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    291 (x6)

    HQ- Lord, Lightning claws, frag grenades, bolt pistol, Infiltrate, D. Aura, Resilience
    The bolt pistol isn't really needed here.

    7- I don't want to give my lord D. speed as he could get separated too easily and overwhelmed (considering the fact he seems indestructable and unstoppable in combat)
    Chaos Lords tend to actually work well on their own as long as you play it smart. Charging them into lone ICs and run of the mill troops = smart. Charging them into higher initiative assualt troops = bad idea.

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, tank hunters, 4 Autocannons

    Heavy Support- 6 Havocs, champion, Kai gun, 2 Heavy Bolters
    The kai gun is cool and all but I would actually drop it in favor of getting more ablative wounds for the squads.

    Other than that, it looks fine.
    IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT!

    I survived LO Chat thanks to: Karmoon, Rabbit, Process, Tossy and Meish.

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