Need help/discussion on foot chaos lists.

[thegodofnothing]

I've been working on viable or at least sound chaos foot lists. I would really appreciate suggestions or comments on past experience.
Couple topics:
Is lashwhip a requirement?
Units larger than 10 a good idea?
Fabius Bile upgrade a cheaper choice than cult troops?
Which cult troops?
Good foot support choices (Defiler/Oblits/Raptors/Chosen)
Etc.
Thanks!

[Mad Cat]

Is lashwhip a requirent?
Not mandatory but lash of submission is a great power.

Units larger than 10 a good idea?
No

Fabius Bile upgrade a cheaper choice than cult troops?
He is poor

Which cult troops?
Plague marines are great. berserkers really need rhinos to last. Sonic armed noise marines are good for fire support and holding objectives. 1Ksons are only ok.

Good foot support choices (Defiler/Oblits/Raptors/Chosen)
Raptors and chosen are poor. Termies are good. If you only take footsloggers then take oblits as you then have no tanks at all. If you have lots of rhinos then take preds and vindicators instead to overload enemy antitank power.

[bliss-giver]

Lash is always useful, and I expect would be esp. so in this case, but warptime is also very effective.

Your units never need be over 10 even in an army like this. However, have you considered MoN, to help them survive.

I never use Bile, he isn't a great hq, and the ability is nowhere near perfect.

Don't bother with berzerkers, plague marines are suited to this environment, being very survivable, You will only ever get the most out of noise marines and 1K sons when more than two can fire ie, out of a rhino. I find 1K sons good against MeQ, and are also survivable against low AP weapons. Noise marines are good for support both in assault and at shooting.

Chosens outflanking can make them useful, especially when tooled up well, raptors and bikes aren't too good at the moment. Terminators are good at surprising the enemy, and catching them unawares, combi-weapons allowing for good fire support. Oblits are always useful, but as has been said, taking tanks here will see them too much attention.

[thegodofnothing]

I tested a list last night. Sadly the Thousand sons stood up the best even in combat. I played against SW so there were a bunch of power weapons. Oblits did really well and Bolt of change was great at close range tank popping.

2 units of max plas chosen outflanking worked fantastically as well, completely messing up his right flank.

[bliss-giver]

A quick thought, have you tried lesser daemons?

A unit or two to appear when you are near to the enemy and assault straight away at full strength is always useful.

[thegodofnothing]

I haven't tried it yet. Fluffwise since my army is a paradrop army I guess they'd be commandos or something.

[bliss-giver]

It may not be your thing, but I find them useful, esp. in a list like yours, but many never bother using them, and say that they are rubbish.

[thegodofnothing]

Tied them and they didn't pan put so well. Kind of sad because I like the idea of them.

[Age]

I've always found fabius bile to be a lot of fun, normally running 3 squads of CSM with his 'upgrade' when I take him. While it can backfire, it simply encourages more suicidal plays with the squads who are in the process of killing themselves. The strength upgrade and fearless are well worth the risk in my opinion, especially as the chaos marines remain so much cheaper than the cult troops. I think most people have a problem with him not being an MEQ killer, getting him into combat with guard or eldar is hilarious though, he slaughters them. For fun games, he's great. Tournament, probably not so.

Units larger than 10 tend to be a little unwieldy and lack further special weapons than basic units, though they definitely have staying power, and if you do end up rolling 'slow, painful death' on fabius' table, it helps the squad remain useful for that much longer.

Foot CSM are hideously slow though, so if I'm playing a foot list I always take terminators, teleporting up field helps your troops survive until they get there no end. If we only had a bloody drop pod/dreadclaw!!

[bliss-giver]

I would sugest trying them out at least once more, as I've had games where they turn out to be infinitely useful, and others where they do very little, or just die.
They may not be your thing, but everything I playtest, I test at least twice.