[1500] Grey Knights Assaulty Army -Friendly

[dr_nick22]

HQ- Gk Grandmaster - Mastercrafted NFW, Icon of the just,
Retinue- 5 Gk Terminators, 1 with Thunder Hammer & Storm shield.
Transport- Land Raider Crusader.

Troops 10x Power armour Grey Knights - Incinerator

Troops 10x Power armour Grey Knights - Incinerator

Heavy Gk Dreadnought - Assault Cannon, Extra Armour, Incinerator.

Heavy Gk Dreadnought - Assault Cannon, Extra Armour, Incinerator.


I know it's pretty damn small for a 1500 point match, but that the way it always is with Grey Knights.
This match is going to against Dark Eldar, but if the list works well, I'll probably just use it for other ones.

In case you wanted to know, the models I have at my disposal are- GK hero, 12 terminators, 17 PAGK, 20 IST, Inquisitor, Vindicare Assasin, Callidus Assasin, GK Dreadnought, Land Raider Crusader.

I am planning on buying a few more PAGK to make the 20, and a Dreadnought, so if this list isn't very good, please tell me soon so I don't waste my money on them. Thanks.

[Gimmers]

Gimmers=Red

Originally Posted by dr_nick22

HQ- Gk Grandmaster - Mastercrafted NFW, Icon of the just,
Retinue- 5 Gk Terminators, 1 with Thunder Hammer & Storm shield.
Transport- Land Raider Crusader.

I heard this is an extremly devestating unit, I have no experience with it, but mEGALO ( the wise one ) explains it is a higly juicy target, would you still surivive if this unit got destroyed?

Troops 10x Power armour Grey Knights - Incinerator

Troops 10x Power armour Grey Knights - Incinerator

Now I never advise specail weps on PAGK, NEVER, well the psycannon but you lose 2 strength when you do, and if you face an oppenent like me you will only hit 1-2 models max.

Heavy Gk Dreadnought - Assault Cannon, Extra Armour, Incinerator.

Heavy Gk Dreadnought - Assault Cannon, Extra Armour, Incinerator.

Nice

I know it's pretty damn small for a 1500 point match, but that the way it always is with Grey Knights.
This match is going to against Dark Eldar, but if the list works well, I'll probably just use it for other ones.

In case you wanted to know, the models I have at my disposal are- GK hero, 12 terminators, 17 PAGK, 20 IST, Inquisitor, Vindicare Assasin, Callidus Assasin, GK Dreadnought, Land Raider Crusader.

I am planning on buying a few more PAGK to make the 20, and a Dreadnought, so if this list isn't very good, please tell me soon so I don't waste my money on them. Thanks.

[dr_nick22]

Yeah, the GM+retinue+LRC would be a target too good to resist trying to blow to smithereens, seeing as it takes up a bit under half my total points (Aaaargh! GK are so damn expensive!).

But if I can make it across the other side of the table intact, fire an assault cannon, multi-melta and 6 twinlinked bolters, hop out, fire with 5 storm bolters and charge with 20 str 6 power weapon attacks, I'd say that'd pack a punch.

As for the LRC being blown up, str 8+ weapons only can harm it, and every str 8+ wep in the game (to my knowledge) can only fire once. If it hits, it still has to penetrate. If it penetrates, it still has to roll well enough on the table. If it does blow up, then the guys have to jump out and make 2+ armour saves.

Not the biggest chance in the world of it being blown away, especially if I don't let the str 8+ weapons see the tank in the first place.

You're probably right about the spec weps in the PAGK squad, it hasn't been of much use in games i've played so far really. I'll think about changing it.

[Diggums Hammer]

Originally Posted by dr_nick22

As for the LRC being blown up, str 8+ weapons only can harm it, and every str 8+ wep in the game (to my knowledge) can only fire once. If it hits, it still has to penetrate. If it penetrates, it still has to roll well enough on the table. If it does blow up, then the guys have to jump out and make 2+ armour saves.

Don't get me wrong, because Landraiders are excellent tools against the right armies ( orks, Deamonhunters, but against Eldar/Dark Eldar and Tau, these can be popped pretty easy. It is an all eggs in one basket approach.

What about some teleport homers and deepstriking?

[mEGALOMANIAC]

One major point first: never take a LR/LRC against an Eldar or DE force. They have Brightlances/Darklances (depending which army this is), which literally tear heavy armor apart. Normally I'm against the whole HQ/LRC thing because of the "eggs in one basket" thing, but it CAN be done. But against DE, it won't work, believe me.

Incinerators in the PAGK units are a waste, take either 0-2 psycannons or nothing at all. DE get fleet of foot, meaning that unless the DE player is horridly bad, you won't ever have a chance to shoot those templates (same advice vs Eldar & Nids). Psycannons have the range, ignore just about every armor save the DE have, can take down their vehicles as well as infantry, and since they ignore invulnerable saves, can smoothly destroy their HQ/Elites before combat is joined. I'd put either one psycannon in each unit, or two in one unit & none in the other. Don't go crazy with 'em, but they ARE my weapon of choice against DE-like forces.

Same comment about the Incinerators on those Dreadnoughts - stormbolters with psycannon bolts are a better choice versus DE. If you want some variety (since Assault Cannon are overkill vs such fragile vehicles), a Plasma Cannon/Missile Launcher dread would rock here - templates only work at long range versus such fast armies.

Now, the HQ. GKT, while awesome, aren't the best choice versus some armies, notably DE & Orks. They'll tear up his Troops, sure, but if he gets his HQ/Elites into CC with your GKT squad, you've just lost your squad. Seriously. I'd actually go with a lone BC, and spend the points saved on another full (or nearly so) PAGK squad. Join the BC to a PAGK squad, and the extra 22 stormbolter shots will tear a hole through the DE.

[Emp.]

Originally Posted by mEGALOMANIAC

Incinerators in the PAGK units are a waste, take either 0-2 psycannons or nothing at all. DE get fleet of foot, meaning that unless the DE player is horridly bad, you won't ever have a chance to shoot those templates (same advice vs Eldar & Nids). Psycannons have the range, ignore just about every armor save the DE have, can take down their vehicles as well as infantry, and since they ignore invulnerable saves, can smoothly destroy their HQ/Elites before combat is joined. I'd put either one psycannon in each unit, or two in one unit & none in the other. Don't go crazy with 'em, but they ARE my weapon of choice against DE-like forces.

~ Sorry mEGALO, but, psycannons are FAR from being able to shred a DE HQ. (I have knowledge in the Eldar area as I play them too). The Dracon/Archon, whichever he takes, can have a 2+ invulnerable from shadow field. So you might be saying "well so what? psycannon ignores invulnerable saves." But he can choose to take it as a normal save type thing and will ALWAYS be rolling a 2+ save for any and all attacks (besides a c'tan wep). My friend plays DE (I play Eldar) and he has a streak of 53 2+ saves made in a row right now. BUT! the psycannon WILL shred Wyches (6+/4+). BUT HERE'S THE PROBLEM! DARK ELDAR CAN HIT YOU ON FIRST TURN! WITH THEIR WYCHES! YOU WILL NEVER GET TO SHOOT THE PSYCANNONS TO MAKE THEM USEFULL! THEIR RAIDER CAN MOVE 12", HAVE THEM POP OUT 2", THEY CAN THEN FoF 1"-6", AND CHARGE 6"-12" DEPENDING ON THEIR COMBAT DRUGS WITH I-5 OR AUTO-GOING FIRST! (sorry if it seems like im yelling or something, I just want to get the point across.

Originally Posted by mEGALOMANIAC

Same comment about the Incinerators on those Dreadnoughts - stormbolters with psycannon bolts are a better choice versus DE. If you want some variety (since Assault Cannon are overkill vs such fragile vehicles), a Plasma Cannon/Missile Launcher dread would rock here - templates only work at long range versus such fast armies.

~ For this battle you want a Lascannon/ML dread. YOU MUST TAKE OUT THE RAIDERS BEFORE THEIR CARGO TAKES OUT YOU!

Originally Posted by mEGALOMANIAC

Now, the HQ. GKT, while awesome, aren't the best choice versus some armies, notably DE & Orks. They'll tear up his Troops, sure, but if he gets his HQ/Elites into CC with your GKT squad, you've just lost your squad. Seriously. I'd actually go with a lone BC, and spend the points saved on another full (or nearly so) PAGK squad. Join the BC to a PAGK squad, and the extra 22 stormbolter shots will tear a hole through the DE.

~ I could go either way here.

@Dr_Nick - What type of DE does your opponent play Kabal or Wyche Kult? That info could help us a lot more. (please read the caps sentences as they are your best friend against DE).

[Terzo]

[quote]~ Sorry mEGALO, but, psycannons are FAR from being able to shred a DE HQ. (I have knowledge in the Eldar area as I play them too). The Dracon/Archon, whichever he takes, can have a 2+ invulnerable from shadow field. So you might be saying "well so what? psycannon ignores invulnerable saves." But he can choose to take it as a normal save type thing and will ALWAYS be rolling a 2+ save for any and all attacks (besides a c'tan wep). My friend plays DE (I play Eldar) and he has a streak of 53 2+ saves made in a row right now. BUT! the psycannon WILL shred Wyches (6+/4+). BUT HERE'S THE PROBLEM! DARK ELDAR CAN HIT YOU ON FIRST TURN! WITH THEIR WYCHES! YOU WILL NEVER GET TO SHOOT THE PSYCANNONS TO MAKE THEM USEFULL! THEIR RAIDER CAN MOVE 12", HAVE THEM POP OUT 2", THEY CAN THEN FoF 1"-6", AND CHARGE 6"-12" DEPENDING ON THEIR COMBAT DRUGS WITH I-5 OR AUTO-GOING FIRST! (sorry if it seems like im yelling or something, I just want to get the point across.[\quote]

You can't take the shadowfield save as a normal save. The codex states it's a 2+ [i]invulnerable[\] save. Thus ignored by psycannons. The bigger problem (though I have no field expereince with DE) would be his incubi retinue, which can have a 3+ save. That's what will make the psycannon ineffective. Also you mention that psycannons well never get to shoot the raiders as they get tied up in CC too fast....then later mention taking a dread to take out raiders with. I'd rather go with psycannons, seeing as they're cheaper and protected from Dark Lances. Plus, they can glance all of the DE vehicles (penetrate if they don't move more than 6 inches).

Something to think about, don't neglect storm troopers. Their hellguns can be useful against DE, and I wouldn't care too much if they drop. Grenade launchers would make good special weapons, as they can glance the DE vehicles (krak) or drop a small blast template (frag).

Another suggestion:
Use an inquisitor with a heavy bolter retinue, then take the callidus assassin. The inquisitor will tear into the DE, and callidus can screw his wyches, neural shred the HQ squad, or just wreak havoc in general.

[Emp.]

Originally Posted by Terzo

You can't take the shadowfield save as a normal save. The codex states it's a 2+ [i]invulnerable[\] save. Thus ignored by psycannons. The bigger problem (though I have no field expereince with DE) would be his incubi retinue, which can have a 3+ save. That's what will make the psycannon ineffective. Also you mention that psycannons well never get to shoot the raiders as they get tied up in CC too fast....then later mention taking a dread to take out raiders with. I'd rather go with psycannons, seeing as they're cheaper and protected from Dark Lances. Plus, they can glance all of the DE vehicles (penetrate if they don't move more than 6 inches).

~ For the dreads, I only mean that if you get first turn. It's really the only chance you can get to stop the Raiders.

~ The shadowfield, you can take the shadow-field's save instead of the normal 5+ save and because the AP of the psycannon is a 4, he gets the "normal" shadowfield saving throw. (This really could go either way but at my hobby store (GW) we play is that way. Could be different that's why it's causing confusion and difficulty).

[Gimmers]

I find the name of this list oh so funny example:
Daemonhunter=Assault
Tau=Shooty
Thousands Sons=bastards

[dr_nick22]

I probably will put a psycannon in each squad or just give them no spec weps.

I could try the Inquis with Hvy bolter ret, I was thinking about that a while back, but the models never arrived so I cancelled the order. I'd have to order the guys again.

I will take out the LRC, and if I take Termies, I'll probably deep strike

I just won a Callidus Assasin as a prize in a comp a few days ago, so I could try it out, but I'd need an Inquis, and I've found he's crapola without a retinue, and I don't have a retinue at the moment.

I'll change the incins on the dread to storm bolters with Psy bolts, sounds good.

I will most likely change one of the dreads to Las cannon, Missile launher, but never both. THis is supposed to be an assaulty army, so I want my dread's to be able to hold their own in combat.

I don't particularly like the idea of dread's with long range one shot weaponry, seeing as how someone mentioned that the DE can be across the board and assaulting in 1 turn, but I understand the need to shhot down the raiders.

An assault cannon can blow up a raider fairly easily anyway, four str 6 rending shots...

I don't know whether he has Kabal or Wych cult, I'll ask him later today, I didn't even know there were different factions in DE. I am somewhat new to this though, but I have had some good experience recently.

As far as I know he has about 6 raiders, about 40 or so warriors, 5 scourges, some talons/talos (whatever they're called) Archon with Incubi bodyguard. That's what he owns to my knowledge, not neccesarily what he's using.

I don't think he even has Wyches, so no worry there. If you want, I'll see if he has an army list today, and tell you whats on it. You have to show each other before a game anyway, so it shouldn't matter that much.