2k Army of the Tallyman - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
    Son of LO Phaeron Typhoon's Avatar
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    172 (x7)

    2k Army of the Tallyman

    Well, once I finish my woodelves I would like to potentially start up daemons, something completely different from my glass cannon, skirmishing army. Here is what I am thinking

    Epidemius the Tallyman

    Herald of Nurgle
    Noxious Vapors
    Nurgles Rot or Soul Hunger
    Palanquin

    Herald of Nurgle
    Noxious Vapors
    Nurgles Rot or Soul Hunger
    Palanquin

    19 Plaguebearers
    Full Command
    Icon of Eternal Virulence

    19 Plaguebearers
    Full Command
    Icon of Eternal Virulence

    12 Bloodletters

    5 Nurglings

    5 Flesh Hounds
    5 Flesh Hounds

    2 Beasts of Nurgle


    This comes out to exactly 2k. I went with the Icon instead of Seeping Death because at some point, with Epidemius there, almost every hit should be a poisoned attack. I'm also not sure if I should drop a unit of Nurglings for another unit of Flesh Hounds.

    When I move up to 2,500 I plan on dropping the last unit of flesh hounds and adding a level 4 GUO

    -EDIT-

    This list has been edited, Read replies below for reasons.

    Last edited by Phaeron Typhoon; May 20th, 2008 at 23:08.
    "I am the architect of fate!"

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  3. #2
    Shrubs for the Blood God Undead Bonzi's Avatar
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    207 (x5)

    If you going Epidemius you need to maximize you nurgle spell and poison potential to get the full bennefit of the "tallyman" rule.

    Switch out your Heralds stream of Bile for Staff of Nurgle or Noxious Vampors. Both of your Heralds should be level 1 Wizards. With the "tallyman" rule you'll be casting those low value nurgle spells with ease. In anycase nurgle heralds are fairly slow and you might only get to use stream of bile once a game so its better to take things that will have a bigger use.

    Drop the Bloodletters for 10 Horrors with Banner of Sorcery. More DD and an additional spell the enemy will need to face. Your lose flanking power but gain more effect in your nurgle magic phase.

    Drop the Flesh Hounds for more nurglings or more Beasts of Nurgle. A unit of 2 Beasts is all it takes to negate rank bonus and thats all the more poison attacks to throw at the enemy.


    With the changes I've suggested you'll gain a LOT more poision attacks AND you'll gain a very dominant nurgle magic phase by turn 3 or 4.
    The only honorable options left to we combatants is seppuku or semantics...which amount to the same thing really.
    -Undead Bonzi

  4. #3
    Son of LO Phaeron Typhoon's Avatar
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    172 (x7)

    I would agree with your suggestions were it not for the nature of the magic phase that you are suggesting. I actually had my heralds in your suggested setup and this was the scenario that kept bothering me. First of all, with only one spell a piece, the only spell i am guaranteed is the first one, which makes the staff of nurgle useless. Without any ranged spells, my opponents will just dispel the staff all day long, then when i get to CC when i can use my spell, i cant even use the staff.

    Now lets assume I actually rolled a useful (yet high cost) spell. I cant even start casting it until i get into CC to get the necessary tally of poisoned kills, which in turn makes the staff unusable (since i am now in close combat).

    with a unit of horrors, i can get one ranged spell to help draw out dispel dice, however with the average 4-5 DD and 1-2 scrolls i will never get my staff of nurgle to go off or the horror's spell.

    As for getting more nurgle units, i really think that with all my units except 2 being nurgle that i am well of as is. The khorne units help provide me with some needed armor busting power.

    I am going to combine the two beasts into one unit however, have them on one flank and the fleshhounds on the other
    Last edited by Phaeron Typhoon; May 19th, 2008 at 17:12.
    "I am the architect of fate!"

  5. #4
    Shrubs for the Blood God Undead Bonzi's Avatar
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    207 (x5)

    If all that is true then by your logic you should still drop stream of bile from your heralds as it might be used once before combat and then its done. Noxious Vapours is still more usefull than what you have now.

    My thought on staff of Nurgle and lvl 1 wizards is this.

    There is no bad nurgle spell. With Tallyman along for the ride you can cast anything you get and the really useful spells like the first one or pit of slime can turn the tide in your favor. So you would have 3 lvl 1 wizards casting spells + 2 bound spells. Both Heralds cast their spells with 2 PD (each needing 2 DD or more to stop) and the Horrors cast their spell with 1PD +1 to casting (needing 1-2DD to stop), then 2 bound spells that the enemy will be sure to throw 2 dice at because its too dangerous to try to dispell with just one. Thats needs an opponent with 8-10 DD to stop your magic phase, yes your only going to get through 1 or 2 spells a turn after you burn his scrolls up but those nurgle spells can be ugly and even the Horrors have the potential for 7 str 7 shots. This isn't your Vampires or Ogers magic phase, your not going to see burn through like in those magic phases but what gets through will still be potent.

    Also don't dismiss the magic just because you might not be an offensive powerhouse. The magic also has the secondary purpose of giving your army some magic proection as well. You have only 2 DD in 2000 points which leaves you wide open to even the lightest of offensive magic and Lore of Light or Fire is gonna make you cry. Regeneration offers only so much protection and then your out in the cold. With what I've suggested you would have a threatening magic phase and fairly decent magic defense.
    The only honorable options left to we combatants is seppuku or semantics...which amount to the same thing really.
    -Undead Bonzi

  6. #5
    Tyranid Warrior Fanatic Phalanx's Avatar
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    146 (x7)

    Though I'm sure you've already considered a GUO for your 2K pt army, I would consider him just about mandetory if you have epidemius. A GUO can easily get you up to the first level on turn 1, and right now you don't have anything to take advantage of levels 2+. With a GUO you can dominate the magic phase- think Rancid Visitation on even just a 6+. You now only need 2 dice to cast it. You have a 50% chance of casting plague wind on 3 dice now. Even if you don't take levels on the heralds, I think having a GUO (even at just level 3 with trappings for 585 or something similar) can help a lot. If you haven't tried it, I would recommend it. If you've already done it before and didn't find it that useful, then I'd like to hear about it.
    40K armies: Tyranids (2001), Space Wolves (2008), Sisters of Battle (2011)
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  7. #6
    Son of LO Phaeron Typhoon's Avatar
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    172 (x7)

    I know that all the spells are useful, my point was that the first one (the only one I can be sure of getting) doesnt help me get off the staff bound spells since one spell is only for CC while the other is ranged. Like i said, if I do happen to get a decent spell, i will most likely have to wait several turns before the tallyman special rule gives me the necessary boost to my spell casting.

    So either way i start out with only the staff of nurgle to cast, which will always be dispelled. Even with my craptacular magic defense, i don't think its worth it to spend 200 points on 2 DD and 2 bound spells that will most likely get dispelled what with the lack of any other high priority spells.

    I really think that unless running a herald of tzeentch or a greater daemon (or playing tzeentch obviously), it is impossible to have any sort of magic phase worth the points invested into it.
    "I am the architect of fate!"

  8. #7
    Shrubs for the Blood God Undead Bonzi's Avatar
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    Even if you don't want the staves, upgrading to lvl 1 wizards is still a solid investment. 100 points for 2 DD is about what any army has to pay for that protection and most do without thinking about it. my only problem with ignoring any magic defense is that at that point your not making an all comers list, which if your doing this just for giggles its fine, but unless you only worry about fighting Dwarfs or Mono-Khorn every other army in the game is gonna give you a run for your money with their magic.

    I can warn you your main opponenet will likely have at least 2 Heralds of Tzeentch at 2000 points. Lore of Light, Lore of Beasts, Lore of Fire, Lore of Death, or Lore of Shaddows....wheeeee!!!
    The only honorable options left to we combatants is seppuku or semantics...which amount to the same thing really.
    -Undead Bonzi

  9. #8
    Son of LO Phaeron Typhoon's Avatar
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    172 (x7)

    Quote Originally Posted by Undead Bonzi View Post
    Even if you don't want the staves, upgrading to lvl 1 wizards is still a solid investment. 100 points for 2 DD is about what any army has to pay for that protection and most do without thinking about it. my only problem with ignoring any magic defense is that at that point your not making an all comers list, which if your doing this just for giggles its fine, but unless you only worry about fighting Dwarfs or Mono-Khorn every other army in the game is gonna give you a run for your money with their magic.

    I can warn you your main opponenet will likely have at least 2 Heralds of Tzeentch at 2000 points. Lore of Light, Lore of Beasts, Lore of Fire, Lore of Death, or Lore of Shaddows....wheeeee!!!
    There is also more to magic defense than just paying out the wazoo for a couple dispel dice. My 1.5k WE list rely's on killing the enemy mage for much of its magic defense, my flyers, fast cavalry, and Alter Noble are there to get to the mages fast and obliterate them.

    I think I am going to drop a unit of nurglings and get another unit of fleshhounds for just that purpose. They can tear any mage apart, and with MR(3) the mage can try to throw any spells at them he wants until they get to him. And if my opponent keeps the mage out of harms way, then the mage most likely is in no position to do much damage with his spells either

    As for this list being a take all comers or not, No, I did not make this list with the sole plan of fighting your khorne or dwarf lists Bonzi :happy:. I merely planned on taking what magic might come like the champ that demons with Regeneration are. Of all the magic you listed, the only ones that are scary are Light and Fire, and thats just because I lose regeneration. I still get a decent wardsave to help protect me.

    --EDIT--

    I edited the list to take into account some changes. Since I will not be paying points to upgrade my Heralds to Level 1 mages, what daemonic gift would you suggest that I use along with Noxious Vapors. I was thinking Soul Hunger or Nurgles Rot, but any other ideas are welcome.

    OR

    I could try to fit in a GUO, then I would be more than happy to get level 1 heralds with the staff of nurgle. If I decide to do that then what would you suggest I do in order to fit in 620 points of Daemon (level 4 with trappings).
    Last edited by Phaeron Typhoon; May 20th, 2008 at 21:12.
    "I am the architect of fate!"

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