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It's Pure Cheddar, people will not have fun playing against it.
It's fine, some lists can beat it and it would be a fun list to play against.
There is no such thing as a cheesy army.
I like this list alot, so much so I fear it may be considered Cheesy. What do you guys think?
Herald of Tz
Master of Sorc
Chariot ot Tz
Herald of Tz
Master of Sorc
Chariot of Tz
Banner of Sundering
Lord of Change
4th level Sorc
Will of Tz
4 Fiends of Slaneesh
4 Fiends of Slanessh
The Banner of Sundering can be swaped out for Icon of Chaos Victory. Or if I kill 1 fiend for the banner of hell fire, or kill 1 fiend for icon of dispar and give one hearald a spell breaker.
In most games I would give lore of beasts to both heralds.
With boon of TZ this list has enough PD to shove magic down most High elf and Khorne armies throats. It is supremely manuverable. With Beasts it can take on gun lines and warmachines on turn 1. It avoids conflicts with big blocks and simply shoots them or rear charges them in concert with the fiends.
you actually have 14 PD 3+2+2+5+2.
I dont consider it too cheesy since you are relying entirely on the magic phase and you only combatants are pretty much the fiends and LOC.
Doh! Forgot the Pool Dice, Thanks!
The list is ok, but it may not have enough units to stand up to the likes of horde armies or brettonians. Your magic phase will be very impressive, but two scroll caddies in a fast, combat-based army will hamper your phase so much in the first two turns that you may not get a great return on your investment.
Your fiend units are nice, but they are too big and will be somewhat unwieldy to maneuvre, reducing one of their great strengths, their speed. If you're looking to take on ranked units with them, then you better hope you roll well, especially against tough units like dwarfs or saurus.
I know that you want your magic and maneuverability to carry you against gun lines, but if you lose first turn and one of your vital units gets shot up (like a herald/your GD), then you're playing from the backfoot already.
If I were you, I'd reduce the size of the fiend units, pick up some furies and possibly another hard unit (like flesh hounds or even flamers). I wouldn't use the Banner of Sundering, your magic phase is already pretty strong. If you put a scroll on one of your heralds you'll have enough anti-magic. Then you can go for either the Icon of Despair (to work with the Masques abilities), or drop the Masque and use the hellfire banner (which will work incredibly well given the size of the chariot base extending the range and with your powerful magic phase).
Overall the list is ok, but if your magic phase gets shut down early on and something key gets shot up then you'll be struggling. If your diversify just a little, giving the list more flexibility, you might be able to cope better.
Great advice. Some of which I already took. I went for the hellfire banner and reduced one squad of fiends to 3. I am seriously considering swaping out the LOC with Kairos who is much more resistant vs warmachines and shooting.
If you want to take Kairos, it's probably best to take the blue scribes with him. Kairos needs as many PD as he can get and blue scribes can give them to him. The thing to note with Kairos is that you have to be so careful with him to avoid being charged or locked in combat. The normal LoC can at least hold it's own in combat (and if you take Lore of Fire with Master of Sorcery, it can butcher almost anything with flaming sword). Kairos, on the other hand, becomes merely average even with this boost. If, however, you find that you never commit your LoC to combat (which given how few units you have, I would find unlikely), then Kairos is a major upgrade.
If you're having trouble with warmachines and shooting you really should invest in furies. Combine them with magic movement spells (from the heralds) and hide your LoC for a turn (or limit line of sight) and it shouldn't be a problem. The fiends and your magic should take care of the rest.
Well the list I actually built and have used the past 3 weeks is as follows. (it's 8 wins 0 losses so far).
10 Horrors x3
1 Herald of Tz, Mastery, Chariot
1 Herald of Tz, Mastery, Chariot, BSB, Banner of Hellfire.
1 LOC, Will of Tz, Power Vortex
Blue Scribes (fanstatic unit for the price).
I may consider taking my 4x squad of fiends down to 3 and putting flames of Tz on my herlads. I will also be putting in 1 more horror just to make use of the points as soon as I get the models.
LOC is a great choice, had a few close calls against cannons, but the ability to charge into the rear of a block and send it packing is priceless...
You still have people to play you with that list? How do you deal with rank and file units? Hope to blast through with magic? Your only fighter are the Fiends and maybe LOC... I guess you could charge in with chariots but unless they get backup they will be gone too...
I'm afraid this list would be fun, but nothing more.
It completely lacks any substance, and with 14 pd you won't get far in the magic phase at 2000 pts.
To base everything on magic, i'd like at least 18 pd on four casters (and the good old staff of change from HoC...good times gone...).
But anyway, i suggest to reduce a little bit the magic impact, and get some bulk troops;
for instance you could lose:
masters of sorcery (just focus on firepower),
chariots (useless if not supported by anvil troops),
the magical banner (your dd defend you quite well)
the masque (go for pure tzeentch magic, meant to be firepower)
and maybe add a couple of plaguebearers (horrendous combo fluff-wise, but who cares anymore XD )
It's better, it's shiny, it's warped...it's Chaos.
Not sure what you mean by people "You still still have play you with that list?" The statement implies that my list is too powerful yet the rest of your post implies that it is not strong enough. Why exactly would people not want to play this list?You still have people to play you with that list? How do you deal with rank and file units? Hope to blast through with magic? Your only fighter are the Fiends and maybe LOC... I guess you could charge in with chariots but unless they get backup they will be gone too...
I am new to WHFB but so far (8 games and 8 wins 0 losses to date) I have not had to hope to blast through with magic I have been blasting through with magic. It is true That I have not been facing much in the way of top tier lists. (Though I did meet a pretty optimized 2nd gen slan list).
I take on ranks by dancing around them and frying them with magic. Then double charging them with my LOC and or chariots on one flank (usually the rear) and my fiends on the other. Some times I just avoid them alltogether or let them have my cheap horrors while I destroy the rest of his army.
Last edited by russellt; July 7th, 2008 at 21:08.