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Hello all, I am a new daemons player and am working to get my army up. I picked myself up a great unclean one last night at my local shop. I have an idea of the gifts I want to use on him but I am not really sure how to use him in a game. Hes a good spell caster, and general but I am just unsure about keeping him in the thick of battle or hiding him behind a unit. So my questions to you guys is:
What kind of gifts do you give him?
What LvL of Wizard?
How do you find him most useful, and in what roles?
Common mistakes that I should avoid even though they seem like great ideas?
Well ill go ahead and get it started.
I was thinking a LVL 3 Wiz, Trappings of Nurgle, Stream of Bile, and Pestilant Mucus.
I figure I would run him slightly hidden behind a unit but im really not sure. Also, cant decide between trappings of nurgle and the balesword. I am not sure whether to use him as a melee unit or to keep him back for a bit.
Don't be afraid to run him up. With trappings this guy is basically unkillable.
I like level 4, Trappings and either Noxious Vapors or Staff of Nurgle. Nasty offensive magic, PITA to kill, and still fights like a champ (even better if the enemy has all 1's for stats and is swinging last!).
You don't see a GUO very often because the others are much more in your face, but he's still an awesome pick.
Check out ==My== blog: www.bnhblog.blogspot.com
I'm not only a daemon general who fields a GuO almost always as his general, I am said player who just had his very long post deleted by his computer, and will now be giving you the shorthand version of this. You want thing to be expanded upon, you can ask me. If that talk about a tactica is still around, I'll write up the original again if anyone wants. Note all below is based on a multi-god (otherwise buy epidemus and more heralds you cheesy jerk)
First my recommended build
lvl 3, Trappings of nurgle, noxious vapours, slime trail
GUO general army purpose: The GUO is for daemons players who intend to actually use thier GD as a gneral in the orinigal sense of most armies, i.e. as a leadership buff for near by units. He is designed to be useful while doing this, and to survive that long to do so. while other daemons gain thier points back by destroying other units, this one relies on saving army points elsewhere as well.
(Below are in comparison to other GD choices)
Stregnths: Survivability, highest strength of all GD on average. Highest unit strength. Acceptable magic. Best spells low level
weakness: Slowest general, cannot fly. Magic is least effective lore, and has little benefit to magic defense. Has no defense against miscast. Very exspenive. Low Ws and attacks.
Deployment: Given he will be your general, you want him near many units. Better leaning towards a flank, where high movement can be properly used to support successful flank. Aim to be directly across from viable attack target (listed further below). Being depolyed so late in phase should make all these possible.
Recommended lvl: 3
Why: With no defense against miscat you don't want to be rolling many dice on such a pricey unit. Since most the best spells in this lore have low casting value, you don't need many dice to roll anyway. Pool dice often better going to mages with better lore. Take lvl 3 for number of spells and extra DD
1: Best spell for a GUO, as it is always useful to have in the game. Also, being a monster, it will usuualy effect everyone in a combat
2. Good against armored units, and with proper build can assure a victory before taking a charge
3. too situational to take regulerly. Unless it seems like you will need it, shold be the first spell you give up for 1
4. Good against average T armies, but otheriwse has to high of a casting value to be worth taking for basic damage done.
5. Take if you expect a low toughness character to be a nuisnace (elf, skaven, skink, goblin) Otherwise is rarely worth the dice/risk
6. Too high casting value, too short range, give the option for extra VP to be gained by enemy. Worst of all, if your in a situation to actually use this on the proper unit, you should be moving away instead of getting in range.
Gifts of note:
Balesword: Worth taking for certain builds, but mostly if you expect high numbers of combat heros, or many ogre sized units. Otherwise basic Flail is fine.
Trappings of Nurgle: Unless you plan to have a balesword, you should always have this. Always.
Noxious Vapours: A bargain, one of the most useful gifts tactically. highly recommended.
Slime Trail: Negates possiblitly of a non-ranked unit coming to save a unit in combat.
Gifts to avoid.
Nurgling infestation/Staff of Nurgle: Too costly
Nurlge's Rot: Doesn't count for CR unless it removes a rank, and that should never ben an issue if you play the GUO properly.
Stream of Bile: you don't want to be in charge range of any unit this would be useful on.
Chariot- S8 in first round of combat means instant kill and the cheapest builds can easily shrugg off impact hits.
Shock Cavalry / small cav units- Low unit strength of these mean without extra characters, the 5 man shock cav. unit is outnumbered with a single kill. GUO can challange, meaning champion in there for added damage is usually an easy target. high strength attacks
If opponent starts removing champion, use noxious vapours to kill some before they attack. If he starts packing a character in there, start using balesword to kill him.
Shooting regiments- they're usually ten strong meaning you will gain outnumber. can't wound, and you won't be stopped by SaS.
Hero on foot/on non-terror mount- You can probably win one combat before he can shave ten wounds off you.
Hero on terror causing mount- If you have a balsword, simply killiung the mount will usually spell the hero's doom.
Ogra sized units- they can't wound you well enough to make up for thier lack on CR, Take Balesword against armies with large numbers of these.
Any flank or rear charge on a regminet- they'll simply never get rid of you
Target to avoid.
Regiments- The GUO can, at best, lose by 2 to any unit with a static CR of 5.
Anything that causes poisen damage- these units often have many attacks. Don't tempt statistics
Anything unbreakable, ITP, etc- You don't need to be tied in combat forever, and you not going to cause these to flee from outnumbring.
Basic strategy and use.
The key to using a great unclean on is to get him in combat with a unit he can beat (list above) while keeping him near the center of the battlefield so the majority of core and slow troops can use his ld for daemonic instability tests. All other matters should be ignored, and if you build him properly, this can even include getting the charge. The speed he gets into combat is most important (turn 3 at latest). Shooting is to be ignored because it either won't work against him, and if it possibly can is often in such few numbers and has to go through so many steps that it likely isn't going to deliver a strong enough, multi-wound hit to stop you before combat. If it attracts fire, it is saving other, more vulnerable parts of your army (and saving you points)
The goal is to break a unit (regardless of how many points it cost among those recommended above) and get through the enemy line. Given the 2d6 pursuit rool of the GUO and the fact he may well recieve the charge, are then to spend the next movement phase. You should spend the next movement pahse abusing free monster turns to line up a flank or rear charge at very short range (around 8'). You'll either charge the intended and remove it's static CR, or have it flee from terror and do so to another unit that also in range to charge.
While using the GUO on the battlefield in it's intended role is dependednt on the gifts it's given, spells it has, etc., there are several ways to counteract it's strategy.
March blocking- You cause terror, so if it's in 8' you are undoutbaly able to make it so it will need to take a terror test before it can block you a second time. You can also cast offensive magic at it if in range.
If deplyed properly though, bridging the gap between the center and a flank, this can trouble all units who try this. They run the risk of being on your offensive flank and thus aiding the advance of flesh hounds, juggers etc. Wrose, they are on a flank you intend to refuse/ anchor, as this is where flamers tend to make thier home (and burn everything around it to the ground.
charge denial- These are often done with cheap units and intend to pull you away from the fight. If so, take thier offering to nurgle and abuse monster turn to get back to the main plan anyway.
Charge trap- Like before, it intends you to take the charge. but with the plan to lure you into a counter charge after previous unit dies/ flee. If you want to fight the unit that will do the counter charge take it. With slime trail it will still be an even fight, If you win, you may be in a better position if following the main plan. If you don't want to fight it, treat is as a march block as you manuver to a better point.
Anvil and hammer- classic ploy, but for it to work against the GUO means you need a very big hammer (either large regiment with GW, or something mounted in large numbers). Unfortunatly, given the range of a GUO's charge. there require the casting of a very large net. It's better for said fish to swim away wwith superior agility to the regiment and hope they try to persue, wasting thier pricey units while your army devourer the rest
Hammer and Anvil- Like above, but with the role reversed. Gives the GUO something juicy to target that it may win against (shock cavalry numbering around 7 with champion, hero on non-terror causer), hoping you'll take the challenge and then smack youwith the tough as nails ranked unit that you can't hope to win against. This follows the same as above, but this time flee on to the flank of the rnaked unit, keeping the expsensive bait out of combat as both units awkwardly manuver around
Both hammer/anvil traps, if put against a properly deployed GUO, also run the risk of attack by the flank of the army as they deal with the threat of the GUO. Simply stay out of range of one of the units while flamers shoot or manuver a cav unit to take advantage if deployed properly.
I think that should cover about everything....
Good God so much rep! Thanks a ton ===ME=== and Vampfan, exactly the info i was looking for.