Very competitive de 2250 tourny list - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
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    Very competitive de 2250 tourny list


    Dreadlord: hvy armr, SD cloak, cold one (pendent of khaeleth, crimson death, E. shield) 257
    Master STB: hvy armr, shield, SD cloak, lance, cold one (hydra banner) 214
    L1 Sorceress: (seal of ghrond) 130 L1 Sorceress: (2x dispel scrolls) 150

    16 Warriors: shields 112
    15 Warriors: shields 105
    10 Crossbowmen 100
    5 Darkriders 85
    6 Harpies 66

    15 Black Guard: (C, ST) 223
    Chariot 100
    8 Cold One Knights: (C-ring of hotek, ST, hag graef) 308

    4 Reaper Bolt Throwers 400
    Total: 2250

    This list is rock hard and very competitive, I've won plenty of games using it. The Cold One Knight unit with the Dreadlord and Master STB can take anything on, Bloodthirster, Blood Knights, especially other big cavalry units.
    I use 4 bolt throwers for a reason: take out anything that can hurt your knights.

    The only changes I've ever done were:
    1 Hydra for 2 bolt throwers
    1 dispel scroll for
    dark rider's repeater crossbows
    1-2 assassins for sorceresses (depending on what I'm playing)

    Let me know what you think and feel free to use this list against your friends, are they in for a big suprise.


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  3. #2
    Senior Member Dire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OUTRAYJE View Post
    This list is rock hard and very competitive, I've won plenty of games using it.
    You have to be kidding. Sorry. That's simply not true. And perhaps you were playing vegetables.

    No, really. Let me say why I don't think it's strong...

    Dreadlord: is nice, but could be easily soaked in his CoK unit by not very hard flank attack. Not to mention his lack of manveroubility as well as mobility. In such a big CoK unit... The same goes to Standard. I can understand using 5 Cok with such BSB, as I've been practising it, but no 8 and not with Dreadlord. Waste of points. Pretty much big misunderstanding. They are so many so easily screwed points...

    Sorceresses: loads of caddy points that are not really viable. The only 'might' way for Druchii is single caddy holding long enough for the rest to kill enemy sorcerers or part of their number. Just too many points.

    I can't imagine less than 20 Warriors holding anything.

    Crossbowmen are fine.

    DRs are fine, but I'd personally give them crossbows.

    Reapers are fine.

    Now I tell you - once you loose your Reapers, you have nothing to fight with. Really. You have no potent magic, vulnerable Warriors, very little other shooting... No Scouts...
    And your BG have no SoHG. That's heresy.

    No rock-hard universal units there. CoK's aren't going to make it (especially as enemy cavalary usually is a lot faster, not to mention flyers).

    Tell me, how would you face HE or VC? Or Daemons? Or Empire Gunline? Or Lizardmen?
    It's not that your army is very weak. It just wouldn't perform well against those mentioned. Not to mention other Dark Elves... Therefore in my humble opinion it's far from any real competetiveness.

  4. #3
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    Thanks for replying Dire, great comments.

    I made this list to play in the tournaments around the dallas/ fort worth area that I regularly participate in, most of the guys in my gaming group are lone wolf gt regulars so I see a lot of diversity as well as competition.

    Most of the lists I play against are not very balanced and are either very magic oriented or combat oriented so I made my list accordingly.

    The Cold One Knight unit does have a lack of mobility and speed (I've learned the hard way plenty of times), so I always place it in the middle of the board or across from the enemy's best unit so it will always get into combat, the speed was a big problem until I put in the always strike first banner, the unit along with the dreadlord and master take out everything, they're rarely in the same combat for more than a turn. You get charged, no problem! the dreadlord has 5 attacks str 6 reroll misses first turn. and he strikes first.

    Magic was always a big problem and the one thing that really hurts my army, so I run 5 dispel dice, 2 dispel scroll, and the ring of hotek, not alot gets past that, even a slaan and the lord of change is afraid of the ring of hotek.

    If the enemy has shooting then my shooting takes then out, I'm not afraid to wait a turn and hit them with a 24 bolt volley

    As far as core goes, I had to cut down alot to fit everything else in, as a result I tend to use them as support groups, get my Black Guard stuck in then flank with the warriors

    As far as fighting other armies I'll make another list

    Thanks for the response!

  5. #4
    Shrubs for the Blood God Undead Bonzi's Avatar
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    Your list is not 'rock hard' by any strech. It suffers from the same weaknesses as any deathstar style list does (i.e. for every army that can't deal with this list there will be another army that automatcially trumps it). It is the same win big or go home mentality that can be seen in every deathstar list.

    As to specific problems:

    #1. E. Shield is pointless on your Dreadlord. Crimson Death is two handed so he can't use both in close combat. Besides he already has a 2+ without it or a +1 with a mundane shield and he has the Pendant.

    #2. Your Warriors are sub par. If you want core flankers use 10-12 Corsairs or 5 Dark Riders with RxB's. I would personally drop one unit for a second unit of Dark Riders and the other for a second unit of RxB Warriors. The shooting will do more for you that the small warrior units will.

    #3. More Harpies. Any list with Cannon/Bolt Thrower/Stone Thrower spam with destroy your CoK unit. You need more Harpies to screen the few units you do have and to hunt/block LoS of enemy war machines.

    #4. Your BG are a useless points sink. They do not fit the CoK deathstar style of play. Drop them for a couple small units of 5 Shades that can marchblock and flank charge. Use the remaining points for Harpies.

    #5. Personally I would drop the charriot and split your CoK's into two units. Put the DL in one and the master in the other. Two units of heavy cav. are always more dangerous than a single unit of ranked up cav.
    The only honorable options left to we combatants is seppuku or semantics...which amount to the same thing really.
    -Undead Bonzi

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by OUTRAYJE View Post
    You get charged, no problem!
    You say so? And what if you have just scored flank charge rending your Big D pretty much useless?

    Think about it twice. CoK are good lone-standing unit, but lack potential to become ultimate killers, the potential that may be easily ofund in Black Guard.

  7. #6
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    Thanks for the input guys!

    First a response to Undead Bonzai: You are absolutely right about the e shield, I changed that immediately, I also raised one of the 15 warrior unit to 20 and took out one bolt thrower to put an assassin inside the black guard unit to give it some punch. In the tournament rules you're allowed one of each special choice so i run my chariot next to the CO Knight unit.

    Next a response to Dire: To deal with flank charges I put my dreadlord on one flank and the master on the other and that helps a little bit, The only times that I usually get flanked is from poor positioning due to overrunning from hatred. I like all the things that Black Guard can do the only problem is that they tend to be a missile magnet and with low armor thats not good, I usually screen with either harpies or dark riders.

    Thanks for the comments guys!

  8. #7
    Senior Member Dire's Avatar
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    Pfff... in such case you're simply being hit on Master's flank. Ain't on hard hitting in there, only an option to get your BSB screwed and your unit run down with ease. Ain't no stubborn, ain't no BSB. And you're so vulnerable to shooting.

    Sry mate, such unit doesn't work when you're facing a potent opponent. Their very squishy loads of points being your army's only protection. BG with Assassin are not such, but are still a lot of points. Consider changing your army in such a manner to gain efficiency over power cumulating.

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