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Hi. I'm looking into playing Dark Elves after playing a few years of Warhammer 40k. Because of this I'm not really sure how well this list would play but the more advice the better.
Also a quick question. Where the Dark Elf Master's entry says that it has one choice only for both close combat weapon and ranged weapon does that mean you can choose one from the close combat list AND one from the ranged weapon lists?
Or does it mean only one choice from both lists?
Here it is:
Level 2 Wizard
Ring of Hotek
Additional Hand Weapon
16x Dark Elf Spearmen-127
16x Repeater Crossbowmen-180
10x Black Ark Corsairs-120
5xCold One Knights-179
5xHar Garneth Executioners-60
All advice and help is much welcomed
Why does the Sorceress have the Ring of Hotek? This makes casting magic for her VERY dangerous. Switch it for a Dispel scroll, you'll need one for every 1k.
Where is the master supposed to go? In the Spearmen or the Corsairs? I'm not to sure about hsi kit. If you're going foot, I think there are better options than the Blood armour, for instance just getting him Heavy armour, shield and a SDC, this will bring him up to a 2+ save anyways, without you needing to kill anyone first. The Heartseaker is ok.
Why do you have your Spearmen in a unit of 16? ^^
You need to have them in ranks of 5 to get a rank bonus, you know
I'd suggest bumping them up to 25 and giving them a Warbanner. That unit will hold fast against many a charge, especially with the Master in with them.
Why a unit of 16 Crossbowmen? And why a FCG? I'd suggest dropping theese to 11 and putting the Sorceress in with them for protection.
A small unit of 10 Corsairs, seems like a flanking element to me. So why are they kitted out with a FCG? Drop them down to Musician if anything if you're going to use them as flankers. They won't really be able to tackle a unit on their own at this size, so if you want them for full frontal killing, get them up to 20-25, or get them to 15 and give them the Sea Serpent Standard.
CoK's are nice, but why FCG? They will do just as well without the Standard and Musician. I'd drop at least the Musician. I've always prefered Chariots, but maybe that's just me
The Executioners are another flanking element, no? Well, i've been thinking about theese to and I guess they're "OK", but that's it. Be very wary of enemy shooting, seeing as a unit of Fast Cavalry can make theese guys loose their flanking use.
I'd actually consider changing both the CoK's and the Executioners for Chariots, giving you some real Hard hitters in this list (that you do lack at the time being).
All in all, there's a few thigns that this list lacks:
- Proper magic defense. You can't mesh the Sorc with the RoH, that's ludicrous to say the least. 3Dd won't save you. Drop the ring and get a scroll.
- Some kind of steadfast units. At the time being, you don't have any unit with a full rank bonus. At least get the Spearmen up to 20-25 models
- Hard hitters. At the time being, you have one hard hitter in the form of the CoK's. Try and shift around some pts, get a Hydra
- No way to take care of enemy warmachines.
- No real obvious plan. I see all theese units and I go "What are they supposed to do?". Try to get somekind of idea on what you want to accomplish with your army, and then get a unit to complete thoose tasks. Get RXB-men for supportive fire, get Spearmen to hold the line, get CoK's to smash the enemy, get a Hydra to scare them and rip them to shreads.
Your units are not optimised at the time being, and I see that you could rework some of them
Follow some of my advice, write a new list and I'll have a look at it ^^
OK Thanks for that. As I said, I'm new to fantasy so all of your advice there is appreciated. I'm pressed for time though so I'll write up a new list a soon as possible.
Also I looked on the GW site and didn't see a Cold One Chariot. Are these models still production anymore or do you have to convert your own?
They seem to have recently removed it from the website.
Is it jsut me that see this as a sign that we might get a plastic one soon? perhaps together with 8th ed?
Oh yeah. Because I remember seeing a chariot on the website in some stage of the past. For the time being though, if I was going to convert one how would I go about it.
I'd say, buy a Chrace Chariot and convert that ^^
That's more or less what I plan to do ^^
Level 2 Wizard
Additional Hand Weapon
20x Dark Elf Spearmen-151
12x Repeater Crossbowmen-140
10xBlack Ark Corsairs-100pts
10xCold One Knights-314
This is a revised list. Not sure if it is that much better but surely an imporvement.
Btw, apart from a hydra, what can be used to take out a war machine
Don't take such big cold one units. If you are using that many just break them into two groups. FC isn't needed on either unit, just take a banner or music, or better yet nothing.
Paying 40 extra points for 4 more shots a turn isn't ever worth it when they are S3... Just take a unit of 10 for 100 with no upgrades. Ranged units are ultimately disposable chaff, don't spend more than you need to on each unit.
20 spears with FC cost 155 points, you have the numbers wrong.
What weapon are the corsairs using? In a min sized unit I usually recommend using RHBs instead of the extra weapon. My real recommendation is to just not take them, but that isn't overly helpful if you want to use them. (corsairs are a generalist unit in an army of really good specialists)
1 level 2 wizard is never going to cut it in any game over 500 IMHO. At low points you will get better millage with just taking combat characters and saving the magic for 1500 and above. (and then you should bring 7+ power dice or don't bother) If you are worried about defense, seal of ghrond and ring of hotek on masters is a good option.
There are things to be said about CoKs over chariots:
US 10, its pretty big, as knights are a flanking or small unit killing force. Chariots only get US4, so can't take away ranks and don't get the outnumber very often if at all (important if you cause fear)
S6 on the charge, sure it is only 5 attacks at that S, but then you get 5 more at S4, and a total of 10 S4 in subsequent rounds or if you don't charge. Chariots are only S5, so that is 1d6+1 (average 4.5) S5 hits, with 2 attacks at S5 on the charge, and 2 S4 attacks. If they don't get the charge or in subsequent rounds you only get 4 S4 attacks.
Armor save: CoKs have a 2+, chariots have a 3+
Faster. CoKs can march, chariots can't
Advantages of Chariots:
Small frontage. In certain situations that actually matters, especially if you multi charge or have multiple chariots or cramped deployment zone.
T5. Being hard to wound is a good defense, especially in an army that is almost universally T3.
Cheaper. at 100 points it is 35 less than the cheapest CoK unit.
Shooting. Believe it or not the riders are armed with Rxbs. not that great considering the volume, but every bit helps especially when fast cav or wizards are running out alone.
I personally use both, often in the same list. The CoKs I run without any upgrades at all. Keeps them cheap, and they can still do their job as well as a full kit unit. The chariots I use paired up with other heavy hitters (like BG or hydras). Often it is a fire magnet, which is fine as well (since it can take it better than other things)
As for taking out war machines:
Shades, harpies, dark riders, and bolt thrower counter fire works.