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I play three different armies and repeater bolt throwers are the bane of my existence. I am trying to get a sense of what my three armies can do to deal with this threat. I am hoping my dwarfs can fare better than the other two...
I find facing two repeater bolt throwers to be nasty enough, but seeing how well they work, one of my gaming friends has currently fallen in love with taking 4 of them.
What is our beardy response to elven repeater bolt throwers? Are miners our only option? I was thinking of the rune that gives 5+ ward save to all in 6" while I try and hit them with thunderers and maybe a grudge thrower or two... In my thinking, Gyrocopters just can't make it their for the charge before being ripped to shreds...
Have any of the long beards around here faced such a terrible threat? Repeaters can tear us apart before we can cross the field, how have you survived to tell the tale of the battle?
As a side note, dwarfs with all of their engineers and being the masters of the siege weapons how come they have not been able to figure out the repeater part of a bolt thrower, man that frustrates me.....
Thanks for any feedback.
It frustrates me too that we, being the best engineers in the world and having fought against them elves once for a few hundred years, can't fire multiple shots.
The masterrune of grungni is your best bet, and then return fire with a bunch of cannons or bolt throwers with rune of penetrating. I'd advise a bunch of bolt throwers, because with engineer and rune of penetrating, these are cheaper than the elven toys. Even with alternating rune combinations ( one with penetrating, one with rune of penet. and rune of burning, one with penet. , burning and reloading, and one with reloading ) you will beat them at price.
What they can do, we can do too, but better!
Concentrate all bolt throwers on one repeater at a time. Because they only have 2 crewmembers you might be able to kill both at once.
My concern is the lack of repeating. We get one shot at them they get 6 back at us, and randomizing on our crew who don't have that great an armour save. I am afraid we might lose the arms race with the Bolt throwers...but I was thinking of trying to deal with it in a similar manner, maybe 4 bolt throwers on my side. We have two extra crew but they get 6 shots each. I wonder how the math hammer works on that for who might come out ahead. 4*6 = 24 shots compared to our 4 shots. I hope our extra two crew are quick on their feet. The difference being that our shots could actually take out the machine and theirs are only effective when they hit the crew.... hmmmmmm maybe we would come out ahead?
Are their any other long beards out there that can come up with some odds for a 4 vs. 4 Bolt thrower shoot out. Elves vs. Dwarves. Who should disable whom first?
33% chance to hit crew, 66% chance to hit machine. 24 shots hitting on a 4+ for range would be about 12 shots hitting... 4 on crew 8 on machines. Strength 4, toughness 4 means about 2 wounds on crew and most likely 0 wounds on machine? Machine is still functioning?
33% chance to hit crew, 66% chance to hit machine. 4 shots. 4+ for range would be about 2 shots hitting... ugh I don't know how to procede from there, but it would most likely be one dead crew and 0-3 wounds on a machine? Machine still functioning?
So, we should each have about half crew left, but we might actually have some wounds on their machine? As far as I can reckon it seems like a close call or a pretty even split, I think after adding an engineer and some runes we are about equal for point costs... so, as long as we go first we should come out ahead?
Maybe with that 5+ ward save within 6 inches in with the machines it will work out in our favour!!! Now, if it weren't for those pesky dragons charging towards us at the same time we might have a chance.
Please help me with the math hammer for those that are good at it.
Last edited by Kizmit; February 22nd, 2010 at 01:32. Reason: Double post for some reason
"Fah! Multiple shots? Waste of ammunition. Just because some flimsy elven bolt thrower has some glammered up gizmo doesn't make it any better! And why try to plink one sorry elf one at a time when a well aimed grudge ought to take care of the lot of them? Beardlings with their cannons this and their gunpowder that."
The delightful irony being that Dwarves probably invented the Repeater Bolt Thrower since they did make the repeater crossbows that the Darklings are so fond off (thank you very much umgaki scum!) We probably don't use them because of their popularity amongst the elves and our devout distrust of their unfaithful, untrustworthy methods.
'An open mind is like a fortress with its walls unguarded and its gates wide open' -Blood Ravens
if you have problem with lots of Bt's or machines.
For destroying them;
First option, Canon (with forging) with master engineer, with entrenchment. (-2 to shooting against it) On average and if you are a good guesser (be! you are a dwarf general) it will destroy 1 per shot.
Miners with anvil.
Gyrocopter charge (don't lean on it, that Repeater Bt's can one shot gyro, Bs4 St6 no armor save d3 wound.
quarrellers, (10 of them shoots at long range 1/3 of them hits= 3-4. 1 of them hits crew and kills it, nearly you can kill 1 BT in 2 rounds.)
For prottection, Master rune of Grugni on a Banner.
Don't use Grudge thrower on them unless you don't have anything to shoot at. It is hard to score a direct hit on a machine with it. (of course you may be lucky, once i have killed a repeater BT with it ).
And if i see my opponent birings 4 Repeater BT's in field and it is a Dark elves army, I would be more happy because it means he doesn't have a Hydra.
Last edited by deeyo; February 22nd, 2010 at 09:00.
Last weekend i had an tounament. I used the ms rune of grungi and thank god that i take it! I think miners work great againt the rb's but 4 is alot so maybe 2 units of 10-15 miners work..
I had to face 90 skinks though... it's alot more devastating then 4 bolt throwers :@ but the 5+ ws is great it saved me alot of lives during 3 battles(4th one was against vc)
Spread out your warmachines. Put a few bolt throwers in forest. That will give them a -1 modifer to shoot at them, increasing the odds, and pesky dragons can't fly-charge into them anymore, because you can't fly into a wood. They will have to use their normal movement characteristic and for that they will to land first and spend a turn in plain sight of the bolt thrower. When that happens you will just push the bolt thrower into the forest 1.5" so he can't see you anymore. Therefor I don't expect him to send a dragon towards it.
And other tricks involve a master engineer entrenching his warmachine, and another bolt thrower with the Masterrune of defence. It might be a bit pricy to be sure, but -2 modifier, and enemies will lose a charge bonus against the entrenched master engineers bolt thrower, who will wack em with a great weapon or something.
First blow that promoted chicken they call a dragon out of the sky with all your bolt throwers ( shouldn't be too hard, large target, mwuahaha. And D3 wounds of doom ) and then start blowing his units or bolt throwers to pieces.
You can consider taking 5 or 10 miners merely as a distraction. It will cost them a turn of firing, or they get chopped up.