1850 point List Against Static Tau?

[Alex2284]

If everything goes to plan, I should be playing my Tau friend for an 1850 point game tomorrow afternoon. I'm trying to come up with a list that will be able to get up close and personal to his static fireline as soon as possible, with several squads outflanking or deepstriking as soon as the dice permit. We don't play any other way than all out murder. No victory points, objectives or anything like that. When the last unit falls the game is over. I've come up with an almost 1850 point list, but have about 140 points left to spare with what I've come up with so far. The list is as follows:

HQ

Farseer with:
Doom
Fortune
Spirit Stones
total - 130

Avatar of Khaine
total - 155

Troops

Guardians x10 with:
Scatterlaser
Warlock
Conceal
total - 135

Guardians x10 with:
Scatterlaser
Warlock
Conceal
total - 135

Elites

Scorpion x6 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
Shadowstrike
total - 133

Scorpion x6 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
Shadowstrike
total - 133

Harlequins x 10 with:
Troup Master P.Weapon
Shadowseer
H. Kiss x9
total - 266

Fast Attack
Swooping Hawks x5 with:
Exarch
Sunrifle
Skyleap
Total - 147

Swooping Hawks x5 with:
Exarch
Sunrifle
Skyleap
Total - 147

Heavy
War Walkers x 3 with:
6 Scatterlasers
total - 180

Fire Prism with:
Holofield
total - 150

He fields something along the lines of as follows ( I can never remember all the upgrades he gives, but I'm guessing they're what's to be expected of a static fireline:

Commander with 2 Crisis Bodyguards
2 Squads of 12 Fire Warriors
1 Kroot Squad consisting of 11 Kroot Warriors, Shaper and 2 Kroot Hounds
3 Crisis Suits
2 teams of Gun Drones (15 in total between the two squads I think)
3 Broadsides with Railguns
Hammerhead with Railgun
Hammerhead with Ion Cannon


As I said what I have in my army so far brings the list to 1711 and have 140 points (the 1point over won't be a problem, we normally allow about 25 point difference). I'm not sure what to do with that extra 140 points but my strategy would be something like this...

Deploy the Avatar as close to him as possible, with my Guardian Squads and Harlequins, with Farseer attached, within the required distance to be fearless. They will move as quickly as possible towards the line. Since we seldom play on a field longer than 72 inches, good fleeting/running permitting, I should be able to get within shooting range within a few turns. The warlocks are in the guardian squads to provide some defence against the longer ranged weapons such as the Railgun submunitions, though more than likely they will be aimed right at the big bad Avatar to try and take it out as quickly as possible. He loves killing my Avatar first. But if he's shooting all the long range weapons at him, that means I may have at least a couplpe of turns where my guardians are not harassed.

The Harlequins are going to be okay due to Veil of Tears until at least 24 Inches so they won't be under too much threat until closer. One Question I have though is if the Shadowseer cna have a Harlequins kiss as well? In the Codex, it says what the cost is for each upgrade for a Harlie and what weapons it can be given, but before that it says any model can have a H.Kiss so I'm guessing it's allowed?

The Fire Prism is to offer me some kind of cover fire for my footslogging men as they move up the table. Although he has 4 things with Railguns equipped, and will clearly outgun me with them, I think it's necessary to have something that can shoot back, even if it's just the one thing. I gave the Prism Holo-fields, because I know he'll want to destroy everything that can shoot back at him and will go for my Prism either before, during or after he goes for my Avatar. Even if it gets shaken or stunned, it's still there and he's spent a shot or two trying to take it out and it may have a chance to blast something in the face before it finally goes down.

As for the rest of my army, they all start in reserves. If I'm horrendously lucky with my rolls, the War Walkers will arive, along with the 2 squads of Scorpions as close as possible to the main bulk of his army. From there, the Walkers will unload their shots into the Kroot squad. They are the biggest threat to my Scorpions and I don't want them to charge me, so any hits which wound will go right through their armour, killing them outright (assuming cover doesn't come into play). If I can thin their numbers out enough, I can either get them to take a morale check, and/or completely take the bite out of their charge.

The Two Swooping Hawk squads will drop templates as they arrive, hopefully landing on and wounding some Fire Warriors. If Scatter Dice permit, I aim to be outwith Rapid Fire Range of the Warriors Pulse Rifles, allowing me to fire my Lasblasters/Sunrifle at a squad. Although I don't expect a huge number to die, I need to reduce the number of Warriors as much as possible, with any luck causing a morale and/or pinning test.

What the Scorpions do depends on how well the Walkers and/or Hawks do. If they manage to whittle down the various squads I attempt to kill, then if possible I will have the Scorpions try to maneuver themselves to fire their pistols at the rear armour of the two Hammerheads. Although their chances to even glance rely on 6's there's still a possiblity and it might help soften it up. Either way I charge the tank, and since it will more than likely not have moved I will auto hit. He uses Flecherette (sp?) so I might take some casualties but with any luck, the armour saves will keep them low. Normal Scorpions will only be able to glance again on 6s, but the Exarch's biting blade will auto hit and have a better chance of causing some damage. If the other squads fail in their killing duties, the Scorpions will try to get to whatever can cause the most damage to the rest of my men and try to take them out.

Whilst this is happening, the units I deployed on my table half will be running as fast as they can towards the line. If possible, the Farseer will be Fortuning the Avatar to help with the inevitable Railgun for he will be taking, hopefully keeping him alive for as long as possible, more so to keep the rest of my men Fearless, as opposed to his CC capabilities. If the Avatar lives long enough to be useful, then all the better.

So yeah, that turned out to be waaay longer than I thought it would be. If you guys have any suggestions for what I should do with that remaining 140 points or any obvious flaws my strategy has, feel free to inform me. I know my plan involves a hell of a lot of good rolls for reserves, fleet etc. but with a bit of luck I might just be able to pull of a victory for a change.This is my first real attempt at formulating an army list so it might toally suck, but go easy on me if it does!

[nakaruru]

Sounds decent for getting to his lines and causing damage the big concern I have it that you only have two guardian squads that score. He could infiltrate/outflank the kroot which will win in combat against them he can also deepstrike the drone squads and even the suits to get at them. Now because it's just a go until they are dead I think you will be fine as the longer it goes the more melee he has to endure. For the last points perhaps you could go for a unit of storm guardians. decent in melee fearless from your avatar and generally ignored for bigger targets.

[travasty420]

well, ok. you have a problem with needing a ridiculous number of 4+ rolls to get your guys in from reserves. solution? autarchs. screw the avatar/farseer (yes, i know i will be outcast for saying that), and go with 2 autarchs. rework as so:

x2 autarch 120x2=240
hawk wings
mandiblasters
power weapon
fusion gun

Guardians x10 with:
Scatterlaser
Warlock
Conceal
total - 135

Guardians x10 with:
Scatterlaser
Warlock
Conceal
total - 135

ELITES

Scorpion x8 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
stalker
Shadowstrike
total - 170

Scorpion x8 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
stalker
Shadowstrike
total - 170

fire dragons x6 with:
total - 96

Fast Attack
Swooping Hawks x5 with:
Exarch
Sunrifle
Skyleap
Total - 147

Swooping Hawks x5 with:
Exarch
Sunrifle
Skyleap
Total - 147

warp spiders x5
ex
dual death spinner
surprise assault
withdraw
total - 152

Heavy
War Walkers x 3 with:
6 Scatterlasers
total - 180

Fire Prism with:
Holofield
total - 150

falcon with fire dragons inside:
EML
total - 135

1857

i think u got a real winner here. you will use primarily the same tactics, however, instead of needing 4s, you will only need 2s on turn 2. this is vital against tau. an army that hits ridiculously hard and fast. i was able to up your scorp squads, and even managed to fit in a small fire dragon squad with a falcon. the two autarchs can either be attached to the two swooping hawk squads or go in on their own, and drop their own haywire grenades. either way you look at it, i just took most of the luck aspect out of the way. now, i am not totally sure that this list WILL WORK AS INTENDED, but i think that it will provide more of the things that you were looking for, while still keeping most of your core list, if not adding to it. let me know what you think.

trav

[Alex2284]

I do like the list you came up with Trav, though I don't have a Falcon or Autarchs. Might look into getting them, though in the develpmoent hell that is my fluff for ym Craftworld, my Autarch turned traitor for some reason I haven't come up with.

Anyway, I had my game, and for the first time I won! In the end, the final unit I decided to add was a Wraithlord. It's purpose? To put rightin frontof my Avatar to help it stay alive! Truely a waste for my poor undead hero, but as predicted, he went right for it. it was mostly so he could kill my Avatar though. It only lasted one full turn before dieing. My flatmate managed to go first so it wasn't surprising the WL only lasted one turn before being taken out in the 2nd. He loves using Railguns against it, but it was a heroic sacrifice.

Not much happened turn 1 other than a bunch of railgun shots. Everything moved, then fleeted.

Turn 2 saw yet more Rail guns being fired at the WL and it died. Due to fortune, my Avatar wasn't injured. I only managed to get my war walkers into the board from outflanking, but they managed to shoot then assault some gun drones, which ran off the board (He predictably deployd everything very close to his own table edge). My Fire Prism managed to destroy his Railgun Hammerhead.

On turn 3 he managed to kill one of my War Walkers, causing it to blow up, but the low S of the blast couldn't hurt the squadron. My Scorpions arrived this turn, but due to the deployment roll, arrived too far away from any enemy units to do anything other than shoot.

Turn 4 wasn't too eventful. Few more pot shots between the fire Warrior squads and War Walkers, with the War walkers, ,taking out a big chunk of the FW squad before Assaulting reducing its number to 2 models. Hawks finally arrived but their grenades were lass than effective.

Turn 5 is where it gets interesting. More or less everything that wasn't a railgun was firing at my two Swooping Hawk squads. The thing is, I save what must have 4/5 of every wound suffered. Rapid firing Fire Warriors, twin-linked Gun drones, the lot. One squad is reduced to 2 men and runs away (only to be regrouped by proximity to the Avatar who was down to 2 wounds, the next turn) but the other squad attacks the Ion Cannon Hammerhead. The Flechette kills one man, but the Exarch and sole other Hawk get the Haywaires in. End result - Vehichle explodes! It takes out my 2 remaining hawks, buit what a way to go! My Fire Prism fires its gun into the Kroot Squad set to dispersed, which takes about a third of the kroot out the game. The stupid Kroot squad then lays into my nearest scorpion squad, which are promtly murdered. Unlucky for the Scorpions, but I had another squad behind them to help clear up the mess next turn. By this point, the Avatar has got withing 12 inches of his command squad, throwing the Wailing doom at them, taking out a bodyguard suit.

By turn 6, my main lines are finally approaching his line, and things are looking bleak for the Tau. His Kroot are wiped out in combat, His commander dies by a focused Fire Prism shot after the avatar takes out the other bodyguard with his Wailing doom, and the remaining War Walker gets into combat with the remnants of his Crisis team, effectively stalling them till the end.

At the end of turn 6, he throws in the towel, believinbg he can't counter the approaching units I have. Hands are shook, pride and defeat are felt and we pack up our men. A true game of honour. For the whole game, my 2 Guardian Squads, Harlequins and Farseer didn't see any actual fighting whatsoever. If they game has lasted another turn, they would have been within range to unleash much shuriken fire. That being said, he still had a few units remaining, had he continued, I may not have won quite so distinctly.

In summary, ,I'd say my first proper army list worked quite well against my flatmates particular brand of gaming. Chances are now however, he will know what I'll be planning and no doubt rearrange himself to better deal with me if I try the same. Like Trav said, if ,I had the Autarchs instead of the Farseer/Avatar my reserves would have almost definately arrived faster. I might consider this in the future since the Avatar was almost uneccessary except in the role of Railgun target.

Luck was most definately on my side that fight, it could have gone the opposite wasy if I had been unlucky.

[Braver]

you could probaly get rid of your warlocks in your guardian squads and add another 10 man guardian squad with scatterlaser. You get another squad but less survivability...well more targets for the enemy is good when you need distractions.

[Alex2284]

The two Guardian Squads I had never got shot at once. They didn't fire either. My flatmate gave up just as they were approaching Shuriken Range so the Warlocks were kind of redundant.

Apparently, he didn't know his Kroot could infiltrate/outflank. Since he now knows this, it is entirely possible he will try to outflank me the same way I did to him. I would theorise that if it did happen, another squad of Guardians would be useful. Conceal is again of not much use in that scenario since Kroot Rifles have a worse AP than guardian armour anyway.

[Braver]

more bodies on the ground is a greater benefit than a warlock that doesnt assist in the gaurdian main function - Heavy weapon support battery with locks of wounds (well it tries but not cheaply).

If you are able to get your guardians with in 36" and i believe you can (my games are on smaller table tops) then the scatter lasers will do okay. I like them now and i will endeavor to have at least two sqauds in all my games.

[travasty420]

the thing with tau that really irritates the hell outta me is how damn powerful their firewarriors are. seriously. also, gun drones are VERY annoying. congrats on your excellent win!! i applaud u! however, i want to return to something i told u before, harlies are not worth their points. if you had popped in some more scorps/spiders/banshees, you would have had 266 more points that would have done something for you. do you and your flatmate always play the same way? ie. objective based or annihilation based? if you always play annihilation, than that also frees up some more points, because instead of worrying about capturing an objective, you can pump up your squads with more points to get the most bang for your buck. just some food for thought.

trav

[Alex2284]

Basically I play 3 or 4 people regularly and it is always an all out murderfest. Objective claiming is never involved. The reason I fielded the Harlequins was because in every other game I have played against my flatmate, he has been able to shoot my men as they run towards him. Because I tried somethign different (mass amounts of units deepstriking/outflanking) they were very surplus to requirements. Though he's now aware of the danger such a strategy poses to him now, he won't fall for it so easily the next time.

Until he has a job or big wadge of cash, his army isn't going to change much I think, but he now knows he can put Kroot in reserve and outflank also. Not sure how smart having a single squad approaching from the sides would be, but if he were to get into CC with something that couldn't fight back too good (Guardians for instance) it could completely wreck my non-CC units as they approach the line for shooting. The Avatar could help I suppose but if a big enough squad gets into CC with him, he will succumb to those 6's to wound. My lucky armour save rolls would only go so far.

Maybe another squad of Scorpions to help defend the advancing Eldar line? I guess keeping my men away form the sides of the board would help too and if my Farseer could doom or Guide (depending on what powers I give) the appropriate unit, even a well placed volley of Shuriken Fire could help thing their numbers a fair bit. Perhaps from a Dire Avenger squad? Not much on the CC front, but capable of unleashing a bladestorm or using defend to help lower the number of attacks they get?

Any suggestions that would help would be muchos appreciated. Having finally won a 1vs1 I would like to win again.

[travasty420]

i would take out the normal guardians, and replace them with 10 storm guardians with 2 fusion guns. u will save about 40 points per squad there. nix the holofields on the prizm, 35 pts. get rid of the harlies, 266 pts. so far, thats about 380. with that you can get another fire prizm, 265 left. u could do a 10 man warp spider squad. those are nice and annoying with str 6 shots. or u could get another storm guardian line with a DA bladestorm squad with a few points left over. oooo. also, get rid of the hawks, or only take one squadron. yeah, take one squad. with remaining points either buy a serpent for your DA squad, or buy another DA squad. so it would look like...

HQ

Farseer with:
Doom
Fortune
Spirit Stones
total - 130

Avatar of Khaine
total - 155

Troops


storm guardians x10
2 fusion guns
96

storm guardians x10
2 fusion guns
96


storm guardians x10
2 fusion guns
96

avengers x 10
dual cats
bladestorm
152

avengers x 10
dual cats
bladestorm
152

Elites

Scorpion x6 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
Shadowstrike
total - 133

Scorpion x6 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
Shadowstrike
total - 133

Scorpion x7 with:
exarch
Biting Blade
Shadowstrike
total - 149

Fast Attack
Swooping Hawks x5 with:
Exarch
Sunrifle
Skyleap
Total - 147

Heavy
War Walkers x 3 with:
6 Scatterlasers
total - 180

Fire Prism with:
total - 115

Fire Prism with:
total - 115

total = 1849

i was lookin at the storm guardians today, and they are nasty. if u wanted, u could oust the 3rd scorpion squad, and go for warlocks with enhance for all 3 guardian squads. let me know if u like the looks of this!

trav