1st eldar list (500-1000 pts)

[akaean]

Hello, this is my first post on this forum, and I'm a brand new player to 40K and am about to get my first 500 point list up and painted. I was posting here to get some advise about bumping it up to 1000 points and what models I'll need for that.

To get started, here is my 500 points list.

Farseer 83
-Doom, Singing Spear

Waveserpent 100
-Twinlinked Shuriken Cannons

10 Dire Avengers 152
-Exarch, Duel Shuriken Catapults, Bladestorm

10 Guardians 85
-Shuriken Cannon

War Walker 40
-2 Shuriken Cannons

War Walker 40
-2 Shuriken Cannons

Totals: 500 points, 20 infantry, 3 vehicles

Farseer and Avengers ride in Serpent. Alot of bullets. Singing spear and rear armor shots with cannons are my only anti vehicle. But I don't expect to see terribly many vehicles at such a low point value.
--
now I need to start thinking of what I'll need to move my total up to 1000 points. After pouring over my Codex, this is what I have come up with.

hq
Farseer 123
-Singing Spear, Spirit Stones, Guide, Doom

elites
Waveserpent 100
-Twinlinked Shuriken Cannons

troops
10 Dire Avengers 147
-Exarch, Bladestorm

10 Guardians 95
-Scatter Laser

10 Guardians 95
-Scatter Laser

Heavy Support

2 War Walkers 140
-4 Eldar Missle Launchers

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

1000 pts on the nose, 3 troop choices. Farseer rides with Avengers in Serpent, Guardians park on objectives in my terriotory and fire off scatter lasers. I don't have a huge amount of money, so my goal is to create an all comers 1K point list that can utilize most of my 500 pt list. Dropped duel cats on my DA exarch inorder to fit in an entire GU squad. C and C is of course greatly appreciated.

[TooMad]

Looks good I wouldn't change a thing until I ran it once or twice. If you magnetized all the better the changes you are likely to make are to the weapons on your WS and Walkers.

[Hamsterball]

Although I agree that the list looks promising, I think the 1000pts list suffers from the same problem as the 500 pointer, Anti-tank. At 1000 points, the chance of a thick-plated tank or two showing up is very much higher, so I think you ought to switch some things around:

hq
Farseer 123
-Singing Spear, Spirit Stones, Guide, Doom

(IMO, you don't need both powers. Doom is hands-down the more effective of them, and will carry the day perfectly fine on it's own, since the avengers you intend to run him with have a nice BS of 4. This cuts him down to a healthy 83 points and frees up a great deal of points that can be put to better use elsewhere.)

elites
Waveserpent 100
-Twinlinked Shuriken Cannons

(Since this transport is going to carry something as juicy as a DA bladestorm unit and a Doomseer it'll likely attract the enemy's attention and heavier weaponry. The last thing you want is for that unit to get stranded, and the easiest way to avoid that is by constantly keeping your WS on the move. Spirit stones ensures that it'll keep moving even if it suffers a crew stunned result. While it doesen't happen often, it does happen, and with Eldar that can mean the difference between winning and losing. for a mere 10 points spirit stones are no-brainers on every transport, at least in my army.
I'd also considering upgrading those shuricannons to Bright Lances, or at least EML:s, for some added Anti-tank. Contrary to what many believe, Wave Serpents are one of the most reliable places to mount one-shot weapons, since mathhammer has proved that twin-linked BS 3 actually tend to hit more often than a single BS 4 shot. If you search around on the forum I'm sure you can find the calculations.)

troops
10 Dire Avengers 147
-Exarch, Bladestorm

(If you could find the points to outfit the exarch with twin avenger catapults you would turn this already excellent squad even better! It's just 5 points for a healthy boost in shots.)

10 Guardians 95
-Scatter Laser

(I'm not sure if the points will allow you to field warlocks in these units, but if you can squeeze a conceal-lock in you will increase the unit's staying power by a great deal. Another bonus with this is that with conceal the group isn't dependant on hugging cover and can focus on finding the best position to fire that lazer.)

10 Guardians 95
-Scatter Laser

(see above comment)


Heavy Support

2 War Walkers 140
-4 Eldar Missle Launchers

(I'm not sure about EML:s on these, simply because I've never tried it. test it out, but consider switching them out for Scatter Lasers. They simply rock!)

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

(Great!)

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

(also great!)

That was my 2 cents. The list was really good as it was, I just tried to improve it in the one area I felt it was lacking. If you don't like my changes, by all means play with the original list; I'm sure it will perform great!

With regards
Hamsterball

[akaean]

You guys are way to nice to me. Anyway since I got rather glowing reviews of my 1K point list, its time to be ambitious and see if I can write up a good 1500 list... with absolutly 0 game expirience and only my codex and forum lurking knowledge and impressions! Horray for the internet

HQ
Farseer 83
-Singing Spear, Doom

Autarch 130
-Jetbike, Mandiblasters, Power Weapon, Fusion Gun

troops
10 Dire Avengers 177
-Exarch, power weapon + shimmer shield, defend, bladestorm

Wave Serpent 110
-Twinlinked Shuriken Cannons, Spirit Stones

10 Guardians 85
-Shuriken Cannon

10 Guardians 85
-Shuriken Cannon

fast attack
4 Shining Spears 177
-Exarch, Power Weapon, Withdraw

8 Warp Spiders 213
-Exarch, Duel Death Spinners, Power Blades, Suprise Assault

heavy support
2 War Walkers 140
-4 Eldar Missile Launchers

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

total:1500 points, 3 troop choices

notes:Farseer rides with Dire Avengers in Wave Serpent, Autarch rides with the shining spears in an epic calvery of doom unit. Warwalker outflanks behind enemy tanks and blasts thier rear armour with EMLS, Warp Spiders Deep strike where needed.

The calvery cruises around and countercharges, or joins the fray if the Dire Avengers or Warp Spiders get engaged.

I'm a bit worried about my anti tank, as it was noted in my 1000 pt list that I didn't have enough, despite the 2 prisms and 4 emls, and this list has little more. But with outflanking the Walkers should be able to bring down at least one vehicle, and the Autarch and his Spears should be able to effectively hunt tanks in a pinch.

ok get mean people! This looks good to me and I think it works well togeather- but I'm not good at this game- I just want to be

and once again I'm not limited by models, as these lists are more for me to figure out what I'll be buying. GW is expensive =(

[Hamsterball]

How true! However, it's good you are not limited by models, that makes our task way easier =). Once again, you're list is good in its foundation, but there are some minor things that you could change around to optimize it!

HQ
Farseer 83
-Singing Spear, Doom

(Excellent!)

Autarch 130
-Jetbike, Mandiblasters, Power Weapon, Fusion Gun

(Since he's going to be riding with the shining spears he's practically got to have a laser lance. with bike, mandiblasters, laser lance and fusion gun he becomes truly fearsome. Very fast movement, occasional tank-popping capabilities and a whopping 5 S6 power weapon attacks on the charge!)

troops
10 Dire Avengers 177
-Exarch, power weapon + shimmer shield, defend, bladestorm

(Ehum, I'm assuming this squad goes in the serpent? if so, pw + shimmershield isn't very effective. Twin Avenger catapults get the job done waay better in most cases. on this squad you can drop both PW + SS and Defend, you won't be needing them.)

Wave Serpent 110
-Twinlinked Shuriken Cannons, Spirit Stones

(I see you added spirit stones to the tank. good move =) However, I'd still like to see an anti-tank weapon of some caliber on this one. Preferably Bright lances or, if you're short on points, EML:s. You're list just doesen't pack enough anti-tank punch for 1500 points.)

10 Guardians 85
-Shuriken Cannon

(hmm, I liked these better when they were fitted with scatter lasers. The 24" range of shuricanonns just isn't long enough. Guardians are best when shooting their platform from a distance, preferably while sitting on an objective in cover, so range is everything. Definitely put the scatter lasers back on these!)

10 Guardians 85
-Shuriken Cannon

(see above comment)

fast attack
4 Shining Spears 177
-Exarch, Power Weapon, Withdraw

(this squad looks ace,not sure about that power weapon though. I probably would've stuck with a lance, but I haven't played enough with shining spears to say for certain. The points cost is the same anyway, so leave it as is for the time being. try it out! )

8 Warp Spiders 213
-Exarch, Duel Death Spinners, Power Blades, Suprise Assault

(This squad is, contrary to what many people believe, quite bad in close combat. Since you already have a CC-dedicated shining spears unit with a nasty Autarch attached to them I think you should use these in a "shooting only" role. They are excellent support units and one of my overall favourites, but without an autarch attached to them their performance in CC is pitiful. Make the most use of the assault phase jump while shooting instead and drop Power Blades. Oh and in 5th ed, ALL jump infantry are allowed to deep strike, including Warp Spiders, rendering Surprise Assault worthless. You are basically paying for nothing with that power, so I suggest you lose that one as well.)

heavy support
2 War Walkers 140
-4 Eldar Missile Launchers

(you mentioned outflanking these guys. Don't do that. they're way to fragile to end up behind enemy lines. Park them in your own deployment zone (close to the guardians would be a good idea), preferably in cover so they get that nice obscured 4+ save.
Are the EML:s working for you? I'm still not sure about those,but seeing as how you're lacking in Anti-tank you're probably better off keeping them. It's just that I don't trust the war walkers measly BS of 3 with 1 shot weaponry.)

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

(Just as great as in the other list. One has to love the awesomeness of prisms!)

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

(See above comment)

Ps. as a side note, in my 1500 list I've managed to squeeze 3 Bright lances for pure anti-tank purposes, leaving my prisms free to fire pie-plate templates on unsuspecting infantry ^^ just a hint as to why I feel you're lacking a bit in the AT department. Ds

With Regards
Hamsterball

[Hamsterball]

By the way, the reason why I don't count Fire Prisms as capable Anti-tank units is because of the new rules for shooting template weapons at vehicles. If the center hole of the template scatters off the hull of the target vehicle (which happens quite often) the strength of the shot is halved. Sadly that rule has severely crippled the prisms tank-popping capabilities. They are way better at killing off, well practically anything and everything else (a pie-plate or two into a 30-man boyz mob or a linked one into a bunch of marines just feels sweet!)

With Regards
Hamsterball

[akaean]

with that in mind I did a bit of reworking

the changes are thus

Dire Avengers down to 152 points (dropped shimmer + defend)
Warp Spiders down to 193 points (dropped powerblades + Suprise)
guardians up to 95 points each (Skatter Lasers)

This leaves me in a sticky situation since it appears I'll need the brightlance on the Wave Serpent, and to get that I'll need to free up exactly 10 points.

from what I can see I can either drop spirit stones, or keep one of the guardian squads at 85 points, I'm leaning towards gimping one guardian squad, as with an expensive brightlance it will be good to afford the serpent a bit more protection. unless of course I can do a bit more trimming I didn't notice.

EDIT: to make things easier I'll reiterate the list with changes here.
HQ
Farseer 83
-Singing Spear, Doom

Autarch 130
-Jetbike, Mandiblasters, Power Weapon, Fusion Gun

troops
10 Dire Avengers 152
-Exarch, duel Shuriken Catapults, bladestorm

Wave Serpent 145
-Twinlinked Brightlance, Spirit Stones

10 Guardians 95
-Scatter laser

10 Guardians 85
-Shuriken Cannon

fast attack
4 Shining Spears 177
-Exarch, Power Weapon, Withdraw

8 Warp Spiders 193
-Exarch, Duel Death Spinners

heavy support
2 War Walkers 140
-4 Eldar Missile Launchers

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

total 1500

[Hamsterball]

It's either one of those OR you could settle for Twin EML:s for 15 points less than the Bright Lance if you're short on points. Think you are going up against many Land Raiders and other heavy-duty tanks? All the other changes you made look super though =)

With Regards
Hamsterball

[nakaruru]

Alright a few things to note first off is the laser lance for the bike autarch it makes him a monster on the charge ( 6 not 5 attacks at str 6 ). I love shining spears but they are not very tough and low model count. With the few attacks it is important to get as many as possible (up the unit to the full 5) loosing a couple of them will make the unit all but useless. I generally spurge for the starlance for exarch str8 has its uses. You dropped the extras on the DAs so no agruements there. Like the guardians with scatters more but maybe an EML? Not great for shooting at heavy armor but can get lucky against most transports and the blast using the scatter dice lets them hit fairly often if shooting at infantry. Personally feel the power blades on spider exarch is personal taste some like them others feel the points are wasted. lastly would prefer to see stones on the prisms but can't get to mad if they are not there.

On seeing the list my first thought is to remove the bike autarch, up the shining spears to the full 5 man squad and use the remaining points for better weapons on serpent and guardian squads. would probably have a few points extra to up the body count of a couple units also.

[akaean]

I was looking over the list, and the the impression I get from the spears is that they are a fantastic counter charge unit, but since I'm not finding the points for starlance/laser lance autarch and max squad size they aren't as effective as they need to be to make up for thier cost.

Also considering the importance of troop choices in fifth I've decided to change these things about the 1500 list

Droping the Autarch, and the Spears frees up 307 points!

so lets add
10 Storm Guardians w/ warlock 130
-2 flamers, singing spear, destructor

Wave Serpent 145
-tl brightlance, spirit stones

an additional warp spider, and upgrade the other GU cannon to a laser.

so to reiterate for clarity

HQ
Farseer 83
-Singing Spear, Doom

troops
10 Dire Avengers 152
-exarch, duel shuriken catapults, bladestorm

Waveserpent 145
-twinlinked brightlance, spirit stones

10 Storm Guardians w/ Warlock 130
-2 Flamers, Singing Spear, Destructor

Waveserpent 145
-twinlinked brightlance, spirit stones

10 Guardians 95
-scatter laser

10 Guardians 95
-scatter laser

Fast Attack
9 Warp Spiders 215
-exarch, duel death spinners

heavy support
2 war walkers 140
-4 Eldar Missile Launchers

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

Fire Prism 150
-Holofields

total: 1500 pts, 4 troop choices, 6 vehicles

this takes the power of the spear's countercharge and exchanges it for 3 fire templates, another tl brightlance, and an additional spider.
if I would be better off with enhance on my Storm Lock, I would stick with 8 spiders and give my seer runes of warding, brining the total to 1498.