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So here's the deal,
I have a friend who plays Dwarves and the best I can do when I play him is draw. He sets up in a corner with all of his units packed so close together that I can't use my detachments or cavalry to flank his units, and he can blow the hell out of any shooting units I have before they have enough time to do any real damage.
So how do I beat Dwarves with an Empire army? They are the only army that routinely give me trouble.
Any help would be wonderful. Thanks.
I've found alternating lists randomly between total gun line and highly manoeuvrable infantry cavalry mix works well.
Gun line lists involve loads of magic, to overload the dispel dice he gets, with a few cheap core infantry (Halberdiers/swordsmen) with lots of handgunner/crossbowmen detachments. Add a captain on pegasus or 5 man pistoliers to work through gaps that appear in the line with their fast cavalry reforms and you can hit his artillery with lots of S4 -2AP attacks.
Infantry/cavalry is traditional list with knights on flank duty and infantry core. However vs Dwarves I tend to pack a two unit rock, one with BSB and Greatswords the other has all you other heros in front rank and is best as unit of halberdiers. Both these units should hit hard and hopefully will have the charge. The halberdiers unit should have 2-3 heros in front rank (inc army general) sending out loads of attacks, make one character good for challenge (WP with VHS + Crimson Amulet- avoids cannon snipers and nasty surprises) and other good for infantry kills (general with Hammer of Judgement or Runefang). All units basically march to enemy, attack simultaneously, maybe even keep Cavalry unengaged to attack units that are drawn out of line. Lots of warmachines should finish off the list. Happy shooting
ANyway, these two tactics used in random sequence should help keep him off balance,
Cheese… milk's leap toward immortality
Outgun/range him. He's pretty slow, and we have crossbowmen. So does he you say ? True enough, but ours are 3 pts cheaper, and we also have skirmishing archers which, in huge squads, could pull some kills in his less than appropriate gun liners armour save (6, 5+ with upgrades). Of course, they are T4, but remember that for every 32 point you spend on Crossbowmen, you get 4, while he get's 3, for the same range and ballistic.
What is your opinion on the Stank? I recently got one but I am a little afraid of fielding it due to his tendency to field at least three or four big war machines per game.
I've never used Steam Tank, though it sounds pretty cool from forums on here. I would probably not field it against Dwarves because of their cannon, it would have to duke it out with them before it could start laying into the rest. But after that I suppose it would be quite good against rank and file!
Worth a one off try if you got one, worst scenario, you lose, but he always has possibility of facing a tank and prepares army as such (perhaps allocating points better used elsewhere)
Cheese… milk's leap toward immortality
That is sort of what I hope to do. If I can get him to target it then the rest of my troops can get in close safely, or if he chooses to ignore it then it can hopefully be devastating in his line.
Because I'm hilarious, I'd get an army of free company...entirely. There'd be so many illiterate men running at him that he would have nothing to do but hope to God that he's got enough bullets to shoot you all. 5 points a model, additional hand weapons, you're not getting saves against handgunners so why worry. At 1000 points, I'd go with 150 free company plus a captain with a sword of sigmar's mightiest of wrath to provide higher leadership to the men and the ability to actually kill something. Plus the free company sergeant is the only infantry champion with 3 attacks, always a plus. Let's look at the math (6 wide with sergeant = 13 attacks, 6/7 hits, 2/3 saves should equal to 1 dead with 3+ save, if against thunderers your chances are even better)
The biggest weakness' of dwarfs: speed and numbers, looking at that I'd say go all mounted, knights galore! Or, go for a standard infantry base, with artillery, crossbowmen especially as Black Mamba said above(his rep could do with boosting, hint, hint), and take a large units of knights using cover to charge in and hopefully break the enemy. That said, dwarfs are mean, especially to T3, they don't seem to believe in anything S4 or lower. Play smart, deploy wisely, use terrain and hopefully we can get you a win.
If someone helps you, rep them.
In a votewar you don't vote on a single match, you vote on the entire round. Got that?
I was talking to the only other Empire player at my local game store and he suggested this strategy. I take in two large blocks of 20 spearman and 20 swordsmen both with two detachments of handgunners, a big unit of knights and a lot of artillery (like two or three cannons and the helstorm). Basically just blow up his warmachines with mine and march up 8 inches away from his line and blow them away with all 40 handgunners. Essentially, if I successfully blow up all of his bolt throwers and cannons in two or three turns he will be defenseless against all of my guns. Then if he moves in closer to me then I just have to charge his now closed in units with my infantry and knights. Hopefully I will have done enough damage to him that I can win with static combat resolution.
What do you guys think?
My usual opponent is a dwarf player. I actually really enjoy playing dwarfs because you get to ham up your shooting quite a lot and basically just trade fire for a large part of the game.
I wouldn't recommend running a Steam Tank unless you are also planning to run a War Altar, Pegasus Captain and some squishy fast cav. Just a ST will get gunned down super fast, but if you are prioritizing your opponent's shooting, then at least your 300 point pin-cushion is serving a roll in your army [protecting your other squishy targets by drawing fire] other than sucking.
That said, I prefer to run 2 Helstrom Rocket Batteries. Especially with all the clustering your opponent is doing, 2 pie-plates thundering down from above has a really good chance of ruining his day. 2 Cannons to sniper his war machine crews, 2 rocket batteries to batter everything he has, 3 wizards to accompany your Arch Lector on War Alter and swamp the magic phase. Maybe take 2 groups of pistoliers/outriders to protect your artillery park from Gyrocopters and Miners. A few wings of knights to fill your FoC and draw some shooting.
Helstrom rocket launchers are actually my favorite thing about playing dwarfs; most armies get too close to your line to make them usable [safely] in the late game. With dwarfs, you can just lob rockets to your hearts content. I guarantee you he will try to eliminate them with extreme prejudice by the second game, if he isn't doing so in the first.