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After a brief excursion into the realms of the Druchii and realising I did not enjoy playing Dark elves one bit I have decided I would pursue my interest in Empire.
My other main army is Orcs and Goblins so although I was interested in Empire for a long time I wasn't sure I wanted another hordy army. Alas the lure of the infantry has brought me back to low stat combat res hording guys again
This is all future plans so i can change anything now, would rather know if my ideas are crap.
So my questions for you guys are to make me sure I want to start empire, by clearing up a few queeries. (don't want another failed experiment costing lots of money).
1) Firstly, shooting, while I like empire gun infantry and artillery I don't want what I would consider a shooting focused army design, that is, I don't want the shooting phase to be my only place of victory/fun. Is it possible to do this with empire without going all out knights? By a reasonable amount, for example I was thinking :
10 handgunners with a repeater handgun on champ
5 pistoliers with repeater pistol on champ
10 hunstmen with no upgrades
1 Great cannon
1 Hellblaster volley gun or rocket battery depending on mood
1 tank (although it's shooting capabilities are questionable)
Is this enough shooting for 2250 points? Would this be considered heavy shooting?
2) Secondly, infantry, is it feasible to have flagallents and greatswords in the same list? they are both expensive and by taking both of those and my ranged units + characters im fairly limited in state troops selection. I have one unit of swordsmen with a detatchment of halberdiers and my greatswords have a detatchment of swordsmen. Is the steam tank going to add a great deal of punch to my melee units or would i be better off with knights and more state troops?
3) characters, I currently have 4 characters that are eating more of my points than I would like. I have the war alter with lector on it, armed with dawn armour (for a 2+ re-rollable save (4+ for armour and +2 for chariot right?)) and possibly the mirror item though i find it mundane to use the same magic items as every empire general ever, though obviously I don't doubt it's usefulness.
I have 2 wizards, one with rod of power and powerstone and one with doomfire ring. My final character is a BSB with gryphon banner (for the greatswords unit, is it worth using this banner in greatswords x15 ?)
Could i drop the second wizard, give the ring to my lector and try to get by with those two alone magically? with the lector's 2 bound spells at power level 4, one at 5 and the wizard with bound 3 ring i have a decent magic i think but is it enough or is the second wizard essential to get through dispel dice?
Thanks alot for any help folks, greatly appreciate the time and sorry for the wall of text
As for missile units, I prefer crossbowmen above all else. they also you to shoot into your opponent's deployment zone if you are forced to go first. They also have the greater short range distance, and the difference inbetween 12 and 15 inches is pretty big game wise. cavalry will typically not be able to charge you from outside your shortrange distance. you are also more likely to get 2 volleys at short range rather than one. I have found it well worth it to have these advantages at the expense of armour piercing.
The difference inbetween greatswords and flaggellants is deployment. greatswords can benefit from detachments and already have leadership 8, so they are very independant but will still be in the middle of your battleline because of it. flaggellants have potential three times the damage output of greatswords via martyrs. since they do not have deteachments and care little for leadership, they hold flanks extremely well. Just be careful with the frenzy. They are also unbreakable, which trumps fear. This is a problem for great swords, as investing in a large unit because expensive just to make sure fear does not trump your stubborn. This will likely change next edition this summer however.
I currently do not use greatswords because of this. They also require the investment of a battle standard bearer even with stubborn on an 8.
The steamtank is there only the intimidate your opponent. It will lie in your lines until that threat your infantry cannot deal with shows up. if a monster comes around and managed to survive your cannons, the steamtank will mop it up pretty fiercely with D3 +D3 per steam point impact hits .
The war altar is a large target and cannot join any units. Even with a 4+ ward save, a signle S7 hit wrecks it. you lose out on granting a unit of your own hatred because of this. I would rather a lector on foot or steed in your units instead. Much safe for your general, especially in a gunline. You will need some dispel scrolls to bank against undead and magic heavy lists. so at least 2 battle wizard is madatory.
The banner of the gryphon is best ina unit of swordsmen. since your greatswords and stubborn anyways, they can take the charge and lose without running like little girls. 2 rank bonus is wasting the potential of the banner as well. 25 swordsmen will give headaches to your opponents with it.
you could drop 1 wizard in favour of a warrior priest. It grants another unit LD 8, hatred and still brings prayers and a dispel dice. He can also carry your ring.
Well what I can tell you from my experience is that a really "strong" shooting phase will not work that good. I find the more balanced the list you have the better your game experience will be. infantry works good, if not better than knights, I don't know how many times my knights have gone in not even taken a wound from their crazy armour save but still get broken from combat because of static res. using knights and infantry in conjunction with each other works well and have some small shooting detachments that way it doesn’t matter if you lose them as they will lose usefulness as the game progresses. That’s just some of the thing’s I have found so far but the empire is for sure a good and fun army to play
5000 Pts of Undeath descend upon you....
I just invested in Empire, and while I've only played one battle, 1000pts vs Lizardmen, I can say that the mvp of that battle was definitely my Handgunners+Marksman with HLR. They were able to brutalize nearly everything the LM player could throw at me, with the exception of the EotG. I was winning up until the Stegadon terror bombed my state troops, but even then, the handgunners managed to kill the skink on top of the EotG and the enemies general, killing nearly 4x their cost.
That's a good point about the fragility of the Walter...but a poor one on taking an AL if he's not going to take the chariot. The only advantage to taking an AL over a WP is...an extra DD. You won't get much use out of the second prayer since so many prayers are RIP. If he's there to support a unit, the extra points and the lord slot just aren't worth it when you could get almost as much benefit from a simple warrior priest. Hell, a WP with heavy armor and a great weapon is only 98 points...I don't see much added value in paying to upgrade him to an arch lector...in fact, even if I was playing at 2k points, and didn't have any other use in mind for the lord slot, I'd take four heroes before I'd take a non-walter arch lector and three heroes. The vulnerability of the walter to S7 attacks is a risk, but it's the only way to field an arch lector, IMHO... it's like you're actually fielding the Walter, not the lord, and taking the AL along for the ride is a necessary evil...The war altar is a large target and cannot join any units. Even with a 4+ ward save, a signle S7 hit wrecks it. you lose out on granting a unit of your own hatred because of this. I would rather a lector on foot or steed in your units instead.
IG since 1999 __ DA since 2002 __ Tau since 2005 __ SoB since 2007
Brets 1997-1999 __ TK since 2009 __ Empire since 2010