Some of my experiences with Empire.... - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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    Some of my experiences with Empire....

    I have just started playing Warhammer about 6 weeks ago & have been playing with a Tilean themed empire army. As such I do not use Flagellants, Greatswords, Steam Tanks, Handgunners, and I try to stay away from HRBs & HVGs. Yesterday I played two games against much more experienced players, one as Dark Elves and one as Beastmen, and was able to get two massacres, ending my month long stretch of draws! I feel that after all that playtesting, I've finally found out a lot of what works with my play style & wanted to share some things I've realized for discussion.

    First of all the army I used consisted of an AL on Walter (Myrmidia conversion instead of Sigmar), Lv4 Life Wizard, BSB, 2 Engineers, 2x35 Swordsmen, 40 Halberdiers, 7 Outriders, 2 Cannons, 2 Mortars, and a HRB (I couldn't resist!). This was for a 2100pt game.

    The AL makes a great general. The 18" LD bubble was crucial in keeping my foot troops in the fight, as many times they were steadfast & close to the BSB. Whats even better though is the benefits he provides to the magic phase. +2 DD is amazing when paired with the Rod of Power, many times I could easily tailor my magic phase to my current situation with great effect. The Walter comes with any Lore of Light spell going off as a power level 5 bound spell. Honestly there is only 3 LoL spells I would use, the first being banishment. Two power dice thrown at banishment took out


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    a Pendant of Kaeleth DE general in one turn! The other two being Birona's Timewarp to set up charges, and Light of Battle to rally troops that would other wise need snake eyes & deny the enemy precious VPs. Honestly I wouldn't leave home without this guy.

    Life Magic is fantastic, keep Throne of Vines up & hit them with Dweller's every time you can. The other two spells I would try to get is Stone Skin & Regrowth, if not then get Earth Blood. Earth Blood isn't as good as Stone Skin because it only works on the wizard & his unit, but a good trick I used is I only gave my wizard the RoP & the Crimson Amulet. The Crimson Amulet is only a 6++, but he passes all tests automatically except LD tests. This saved him from a Purple Sun twice! Use Earth Blood to give him regen, & use that instead of the weak ward save.

    Play your BSB's defensively, I go for FPA & Holy Relic. Use the other 5 points if you have them on the Charmed Shield or Ironcurse Icon. The engineer's are CRUCIAL. Don't bother to give him a weapon or anything, put him around 2-3 war machines & you'll be using that re-roll every turn just about.

    Cannons are great, I would always take two. If they are lacking targets, just keep trying to snipe his characters or war machines. If he fails his look out sir roll, good bye general! In the game against Beastmen, they earned their points back in a big way. They sniped a
    Last edited by astorre; August 31st, 2010 at 02:28.

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    shaman, killed a chariot, a giant, 4 minotaurs, and some rnf troops all for 200 points. Mortars are fantastic too, I will take 3 in larger games. I'm not completely sold on the HRB, but they are great fun. Maybe I'm biased because mine misfired, misfired the re-roll, and blew itself up against the Beastmen.

    Outriders can be a great unit to have as well, just make sure you get them in a good spot with vanguard. Never flee, just stand & shoot, and if they overrun make sure it will put them out the game for a turn or two. Don't bother with champions, keep the unit cheap. I just used a musician.

    Swordsmen & Halberdiers are great at dying fantastically. Unless they are buffed up! I use Swordsmen to transport characters and the Halberdiers on a flank lined up 6x6 with a few extra in the back. In a display of greatness, my Halberdiers took a charge from 4 Minotaurs, beat them, broke them, and ran them down one game. I didn't miss the detachments. Maybe in larger games I'll take one for my BSB's unit, but they really aren't needed.

    One of the biggest things I learned is you really need to whittle down your enemy with shooting and magic before you get into close combat. You usually have only two turns to do this, so target priority is key. Learn your enemy.

    Hopefully this longwinded post will help somebody, and feel free to add or debate anything. Thanks for reading!

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    Great report! I might increase the swordsmen to 40 per unit, then break the halberdiers into a 20 man detachment for each, but that's me, not you. I'd also probably change one of the engineers to a priest, then decide before each game whether the remaining engineer is going with the mortars or the cannons, based on enemy threat.

    I have been debating whether I should take life or light for my own L4 wizzie...since I'm not taking a walter, I can't really have both...if you didn't have the walter, would you take light instead for the wizzie lord?
    IG since 1999 __ DA since 2002 __ Tau since 2005 __ SoB since 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marnepup View Post
    Great report! I might increase the swordsmen to 40 per unit, then break the halberdiers into a 20 man detachment for each, but that's me, not you. I'd also probably change one of the engineers to a priest, then decide before each game whether the remaining engineer is going with the mortars or the cannons, based on enemy threat.

    I have been debating whether I should take life or light for my own L4 wizzie...since I'm not taking a walter, I can't really have both...if you didn't have the walter, would you take light instead for the wizzie lord?
    Wow! That's a really tough choice. Especially now that you have to chose your lore when you write your list.

    They are both defensive type lores. Both can effectively protect your otherwise vulnerable infantry, the backbone of your army.

    Whats great about light is that most of the spells are relatively easy to cast. Banishment is the great damage spell this lore has, and is more effective with multiple Light Wizards. The other huge benefit is Light of Battle. Now that they have to kill every unit to a man if you can rally a unit thats been diminished to less than 25% and hide you can deny your enemy VPs. If you want to run cheap wizards, maybe a Lv 3 & a Lv 1 or 2, I would chose light hands down.

    Life magic is fantastic. I can't say how POWERFUL Throne of Vines + Dweller's is. I usually target this spell at the unit his/her wizards are in due to their (usually) low strength. If I can take out say, Teclis or a Slann (both S2), with an irresistible Dwellers, and then avoid the miscast on a 2+, I'm basically free and clear to own the magic phase after that. This spell can also take out Cauldrons of Blood, Anvils of Doom, Casket of Souls, ecetera automatically, as if you don't have a characteristic you fail the test. If you are taking one Lv4 with all the bells and whistles, I'd take Life.

    Light magic has more offensive buffs, while Life magic keeps your soldiers alive longer without really being able to improve their killing ability. And don't forget Life's ability, Lifebloom! Every time a life spell goes off, you can restore one wound on a model within 12". A great trick with this is to give your Wizard the speculum. Even if he challenges a unit champ, who usually has two attacks, the champ can only do one attack in return. In your magic phase, cast a Life spell, and bam! He's fully healed. Keep him near your BSB, and they should keep each other alive throughout the game.

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    Hmmm...I bought the old mounted light wizard model before 8th came out because that was my chosen lore in 7th...he's kitbashed onto a pegasus (what a pain...who would have thought that GW would sell metal monstrous mounts that aren't actually designed to work with a mounted character model? I felt so cheated, but I made it work, and it's not too terrible), primed, and the mount is painted...but I've been holding off on painting the wizzie since I'm torn between light and life...to the truly knowledgeable, the model is more than obviously a light wizard, but with a life wizard paint job, I think I'll be fine.

    Given how powerful the throne of vines is, isn't it hard keeping it up? I'd think that any opponent with half a brain would sell his own mother's immortal soul to dispel it! I do like the idea of VHSing him, especially since he's already on a pegasus for mobility and added (moderately decent) attacks. Plus, hiding in a combat that he can't lose is a decent way to keep him safe from the more dangerous varieties of shooting.

    Besides the cheapness of the spells, is there any other compelling reason that light magic is more suited to multiple lower level wizards than to a single fully-kitted archmage?
    IG since 1999 __ DA since 2002 __ Tau since 2005 __ SoB since 2007
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    To dispel Throne of Vines reliably means burning up at least two of their dice. I know you don't use the War Alter but for me if I can burn up their dispel dice then that means my prayers and bound spells will be going off. If they use their power dice to do it then I have more to put in the Rod. One thing about the Rod of Power, I get them out each & every phase and if I don't use them just put them back.
    I find that people usually let ToV go through because they are afraid of nastier things, like Dweller's or Banishment.
    Another thing I try to do (because the Life buffs don't really come into play until turn 2 or 3) is stack Remains in Play spells. Unbending Righteousness, Armour of Contempt, Hammer of Sigmar, Lifeblood, make them chose what to dispel. Even with low rolls the AL's dispel dice with RoP means you can absolutely flood the magic phase with cheap spells, all of the above go off on 1-2 dice.
    There's really no reason I would give lower level wizards Light other than to have a very powerful Banishment spell (I'm telling you it would probably bring down a Bloodthirster, it killed a reverse ward save DE Sorceress, it would destroy Phoenix Guard, ect.), to spam arcane items (RoP,

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    Feedback Scroll), the fact that the hardest spell to cast in Light only requires a 12+, the basic light spell is a fireball (remember this is the one that you can duplicate), and the fact that our army could probably get away without a Lv4 if we have some WPs and ALs.
    In 3000 pt games, I will probably be taking an AL on War Alter, Lv4 Life Wizard, BSB, Lv2 Light Wizard, 2 Engineers, and a WP or two. Yes this is a lot of points for characters, but I don't use Greatswords, Flagellants, Steam Tanks, or big units of knights, just State Troops and Artillery with some Outriders to draw them out of position. The idea behind this is to do as much damage with spells and artillery before close combat, and by time that happens you should be steadfast where you can grind your enemy down by buffing your troops. Use the War Alter to hold up his nastiest unit & hit it with Impact Hits, Soulfire and Healing Hand, and then try to tie up his 300+ pt Chaos Lord or Blood Dragon Vampire with the Life Wizard. Put it this way, 35 Greatswords or Flagellants are 350+ pts, while 35 Swordsmen with full command and a Lv2 Light Wizard supporting it is only 335. 40 Halberdiers with full command and a WP with HA & Shield are only 316pts. Which would you rather have?
    Last edited by astorre; September 2nd, 2010 at 00:48.

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    It sounds like our armies are pretty similar, except that I take greatswords as a BSB bus, and I make use of the detachment system. My characters are the L4 Wizard Lord, Arch Lector on foot, Warrior Priest, BSB, and a naked engineer. The AL and WP each lead blocks of swordsmen flanking the greatsword BSB bus in the middle, the WL on peg is independent, and the engineer goes with either the pair of cannon or pair of rocket batteries, depending on which I expect to be more effective against the particular enemy I'm up against. That's usually the rockets, but if I'm up against a dragon, a giant, or something else that only a cannon can reliably handle, I need those rerolls there, instead. Other than that, have some pistoliers and crossbowmen for shooting and charge redirection.
    IG since 1999 __ DA since 2002 __ Tau since 2005 __ SoB since 2007
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    Sounds really effective! I also would use a detachment on my main block, but the problem I find with detachments is the new rules for charges. If they choose to charge the detachment, and you flee, they can take a Ld test to redirect into your main block, thereby not only making one of your units running away but also depriving you of the detachment special rules. You could use two detachments a block, but thats getting expensive, and they do not count towards your core requirement.
    I thought about it and if you want your Lv 4 on the Pegasus, I would chose Light rather than Life. The reason being Life's main spell, Earth Blood, only works on the Wizard and his unit, meaning the only good buff you might get your infantry is Stone Skin. Light has multiple buffs that will be more effective for your setup.
    I would try out some Outriders for a game, take them in unit(s) of 6-8 with a 4 wide frontage. Sounds odd but Ive been using 7 with a musician and that unit comes to 155pts. Failing a charge against them has been brutal and even if they make it these boys have been earning back at least half their points. When they run out of targets charge their war machines if they haven't already been sniped by Cannons or ride behind their lines to pick off the last of fleeing units.

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