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Map = 18. After the Siege
First Turn = gingerninja
The White Host of Caranthir Elensar
Caranthir Elensar: Lorekeeper of the White Tower
Book of Hoeth
Lore of Shadows - Steed of Shadows, Creeping Death, Shades of Death, Pit of Shades
Elrohir Elensar: Dragon Mage of the Flame Peak
Dragon Mage: 435pts
Ring of Fury
Lore of Fire - Flaming Sword of Rhuin, Fiery Blast, Conflagration of Doom
Elessar Arnatuilë: Junior mage of the White Tower
Staff of Sorcery
High Magic - Shield of Saphery
17 Spearmen: 176pts (Mage here)
14 Swordmasters: 315pts (Archmage here)
Banner of Sorcery
Bladelord has the Skeinsliver
6 Dragon Princes: 200pts
14 White Lions
2 Repeater Bolt Throwers
2 Great Eagles
PD: 9 + D3 + up to 3 ‘free’ dice + 1 Bound
DD: 6 + +2 to dispel
Silver Wand – Bearer knows 1 extra spell
Ring of Fury – Bound lvl 3 – casts fury of Khaine
Banner of Sorcery - +D3 power dice
Skeinsliver - +1 to first turn roll
Book of Hoeth – All spells successfully cast, including any double, except double 1, are irresistible force
Staff of Sorcery - +1 to dispel
Legion of the Scorpion King
Collar of Shapesh
Armour of the Ages
Vambraces of the Sun
Cloak of the Dunes
Staff of Ravening
Casket of Souls
24 Skeleton Warriors
Banner of the Undying Legion
20 Skeleton warriors
1 Scarab Swarm
Screaming Skull Catapult 110pts
Skulls of the Foe
Incantation Dice: 2x1D6 + 4x2D6
Bound Spells: 1xPL3 + 1xPL4
Power Dice: 2
Dispel Dice: 5 (and -1 to enemy casting rolls)
Collar of Shapesh:- Transfer a wound on a roll of 4+ to a model within 4”
Armour of the Ages – 5+ armour save, +1 wound
Vambraces of the Sun – 1 model in base contact loses 1 attack
Cloak of the Dunes – May fly
Hieratic Jar – Cast 1 extra spell for one turn
Staff of Ravening – Bound level 4, range 18”, 3D6 Str 2 hits
Golden Ankhra – 4+ ward
Banner of the Undying Legion – Bound lvl 3. Casts summoning spell on unit.
Last edited by Spector; March 11th, 2008 at 14:07.
OOOHHH YEAH!!! Spec are you sure you arent fixing this?? Never mind, this is the match i wanted! Been waiting for this, my turn to silence Ginger and his Elves! Good luck G, let battle commence.
Tomb Kings have a pretty good time against High Elves, the design of the army is perfect to face them. ASF means nothing, the elves would go first anyway. Their small units play straight into the hands of the Tomb Kings, and fear will be brilliant for me here.
IMPORTANT TACTICS REVISION
Knowing that Ginger has the Pit of Shades spell, and with him being so intent on using it on may Casket Priest in turn 1, he has unintentionally left himself completely open.
The Pit has a 24" range, meaning he will have to advance in order to be able to aim it at the Casket. Given that my Casket will be deployed towards the rear, then in moving forwards it will leave the HE mage plenty within the Magical Charge range of the Tomb Scorpion
Even with the chance i may be the Casket and one Priest down, two spells from the King, two Priests and the Hieratic Jar will be enough magic (See below) to get a spell off, and they will all be concentrating on getting the Scorp in combat with the HE Mage. Once there, the ASFing elves will be unable to kill the Scorp before he surely delivers the killing blow to the Mage. The Scorp will probably die from Res, but he will have not died in vain.
And THAT, is how i will be taking this game.
Oh, and also ive realised that the Carrion will be more than a match for the Dragon Mage. Charging in, the mage atacks and wont do much, then with their 8 S4 Attacks back, the mage will fall. The Dragon will likely wipe the Carrion out in the same turn or the next, but with that second mage also gone, the battle is clearly mine to clean up.
Ill begin by looking at my Magic. At first it may not seem to dominant, what with the elves +2 to dispel. BUT, look who forgot to bring any scrolls... With just 6 Dispel Dice, i'm sure Ginger will be wanting to save at least 2 of those to stop the Casket. 4 Left. Now, he King has 2 spells on 1D6, and i cast no matter what i roll, even on a 1. So if G wants to stop those (which he will) then he only has 2 Dice left. 2 Dispel Dice going against 3 Liche Priests and 2 Bound spells, doesnt look so bad for me any more does it And with that kind of superiority, the SSC will be magically firing, things will be Moving fast and Charging hard.
Having seen Gingers magic list, the Pit may prove a worry, But there is no guarantee it will cast 1st turn. I'm not quite sure how 80% Irresistible comes about.. that seems a little exaggerated to me But even so, any double 1 overrides whatever other results come up, so casting on 5 dice is just making the possibility of a Miscast even greater.
With the elves having 1st turn, no doubt the magical onslaught will begin straight away. My Magic defense looks bad ill admit, but given failed casting rolls etc then I should be fine mostly. And being able to resurrect troops, i can afford let the odd Elf spell off. He has to be able to hurt my army somehow and if so it will be in the magic phase, because his troops wont be able to hurt me much elsewhere. Once mages start dieing ill be fine. Need to see what spells they get first though, before i can say anything solid.
Also remember, the Casket gives -1 to enemy Casting.
Im going to go with a central deployment, at the point between the hills in my Zone, based around the SSC and Casket as usual.
One Scorp and the Swarm will begin underground, aiming to ICFB and clear up the bolt throwers.
The other Scorp will be making a (possibly suicidal) direct line for the Elf Mages, prioritising the Archmage (As now stated above in the tactics rethink)
The Carrion will be going for the Dragon Mage, as also stated above, and will likely take him out.
Once finished with the Bolters (or before, if they scatter and the oppertunity presents itself) the ICFBing Scorp and Swarm will also be looking to hunt down the other mages. And as the mages Fall, so will the Elves power. Without its magic that army is nothing.
Onto the SSC. Its flaming, so the Dragon Princes will be immune to its effects (stupid armour, huge oversight there by GW...) However if it lands a hit on the Dragon and Dragon mage then it will cause a lot of pain. Even on a scatter, if it hits any elf units then it will kill lots, what with them only being T3. And then they need a panic check at -1 too.
Archers will begin in ranks 10 wide, aiming their arrows at the Eagles i think. They will reform as soon as necessary into their combat units.
And when it comes to combat, Ushabti, with their high Str, will be lining up to take on the Dragon Princes, and with a Priest keeping them healed after the initial charge then they will tear through the elven cav.
The bolters wont really have enough time or oppertunity to hurt the Chariots or Ushabti before they hit combat, as the Scorp and Swarm should deal with them pretty fast, and i wont be giving them a clear line of sight anyway.
Chariot charges, with their Impact Hits (remember Impact hits go before ASF) should see off the few remaining elves nicely, especially when combined with the awesomeness of the King (not a lot that can hurt him) and mass of Skellies.
Last edited by Phoenix; March 11th, 2008 at 19:09.
This bout is definatly going to be about the magic phase. With both the Kings and the Elves predominatly featured around this.
The kings like Phoenix said will of course have there fair share of hurt being dished out but i can't see them doing anywhere near the amount the Elves will.
I don't see fear being much of a problem for the elves with there relativly high leadership and the bolt throwers will see off any major threats quickly before there eaten alive by the scorpion.
I think this is going to be another really close one but the Elves just clich it for me.
My homage to my time spent at Libararium Online:
Right then. It's a battle I wanted, although I would have prefered it a little later on, (as with all my current battles!!), here we go.
My deployment is pretty simple. All lined in the centre, with the bolt throwers peaking through the gaps in the buildings, close to the right hand hill, archers right by them. The troops the other side. The Dragon Princes will deploy on the otherside, allowing them to pop round the hill for some flanking charges later on.
My magic can't be decided till it is posted, so I will just say that I have a couple of evil plans, that just need confirming for my irresistable force mage
And here they are. I got the no 1 spell I wanted here, which again is Pit of Shades!!! As I have previously described, if I throw 5 dice at a spell with my Archmage, I have about a 75-80% chance of having irresistable force, thanks to the Book of Hoeth. I will cast this spell, first turn on the casket. Now it can't destroy the casket itself, but it has a 2/3 chance of killing the Liche Priest outright. If that is successful, then the casket will never fire a spell all game, and the TK will have lost 2 of their 2D6 incantations without ever having cast them, making my magic even stronger.
This will allow the Dragon to fly around and pump all the rest of the dice into him, casting his destructive fire spells into the flanks of the Tomb Kings, and releasing his bound spells into their lines. He will magically target the SSC first, taking this out of commision, or at least killing the crew. His bound spell will be used on the carrion, hopefully whittling down their numbers a little, leaving the TK too much to heal, and not enough dice to do it with.
The rest of the time, the archmage will cast pit of shades on the Tomb kings unit every turn he can, causing large damage to it, while the dragon uses its magic to soften up the TK shooting.
I will of course march forward in my first turn, as I need to get to combat relatively quickly. The dragon will fly out, aiming to be in range with his magic of the SSC.
My bolt throwers and archers will aim for one of the chariot units first, which should seriously damage one of them, again reducing their effectiveness. The Ushabti will be the next target, as their strength 6 attacks are capable of doing some nasty damage.
Beyond that, there is little to say. In close combat I have the edge, as I will be striking first, always hitting on 3's and never wounding on less than a 4+ against the skellies, and most other things on that because of the high strength of the white lions and swordmasters.
Important tactical point as well
There is indeed no guarantee that my spell will cast first turn, nor is there any guarantee that it will kill the casket first turn. There is also no guarantee that the tomb king magic will go off at a high enough power level to worry me in his turn. If you take that the average dice roll on 2 dice is 7, the Tomb kings will on average be casting on a 5. If I throw 2 dice at this, it should dispel it. I have 6 dice to dispel with. He will be concerned with killing the archmage, so that is where his movement spells will be going.
He can cast the urgency spell a maximum of 5 times, and that is including if his tomb king is within 6" of the unit in question, which he won't be of the carrion or the tomb scorpian if that is the only thing going forward, meaning it is only 3 of his 2D6 spells maximum that can be cast. The dragon can always flee, and if that is neccessary to make sure it survives, then it will be done. making a charge failed, and therefore half distance.
If his Tomb scorpian doesn't make it first turn, it will be bolt throwered to pieces. 8 hits at less than 24" range should see to that, even if only 2-3 wound, its charge is pointless as the 2 swordmasters in base contact will, on average to 2-3 wounds themselves, meaning it will be dead before it hits me.
Even if it does make it, it will be hitting the mage on 4's and wounding it on 2's. It only has 4 attacks, so unless it gets the 1/6 chance of a killing blow, it will have failed in it's task. Making it's suicide pointless.
Last edited by gingerninja; March 12th, 2008 at 18:28. Reason: Tactics complete
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I'll wait to see magic results, but one losing combat and elf units auto-flee. Me likey the Tomb Kings for now.
EDIT: Okay, looking at things again with the spells in mind, I just don't see HE pulling this one out. Leadership doesn't matter when you're outnumbered by fear causers. And that archmage is going to take some work to stay alive. With him gone, it's that much easier.
Tomb Kings for the win.
While I think that both generals are banking on a best case scenario on turn 1 to turn the battle markedly in their favor, I think that the TK has the better shot of this working. It seems he has prepared for the Elves even if they do accomplish their goal on turn 1 and he has a good backup plan in place(actually it seems that Plan A is counting on the Elves Plan A working). The Tomb Kings should be able to get into combat with(if not kill off) both High Elf mages(not counting the lev. 1 junior mage as much) and I think it will be downhill for the Elves at that point. The Mages may surprise be staying alive for a while but I think that the probability is not on their side. Tomb Kings will take this one in a battle probably determined on turn 1 but hotly contested the rest of the game.
i'll be throwing my vote at the high elves. there are reasons for this but its a VERY close run thing. i will however point out that the tomb scorpion making a run at the archmage isn't enough to change my mind. crunch the numbers if you will, the scorpion has a 11/36 chance of taking out that mage, thats under 1/3... it can't be banked on or assured and to be honest... i dislike gimmicky tactics
consider of course that a high elf bolt thrower could be redirected turn one and be fired at the scorpion. might not kill it, but it doesn't need to, the swordmasters will do the rest
the game will eventually fall to combat and i reckon the elves have the advantage here. with so many multi attack troops i'm not sure if the static res of the relativly frail skellies can prevail. the ushubati are probably the most dangerous unit the tomb kings have for this battle, but i doubt even they can tip the scales.
spambot kill tally: 79
[16:19] <@Alzer> Arky's right though
[16:20] <@Kaiser-> I know he is.
[16:20] <@Kaiser-> He usually is.
[16:20] <@Kaiser-> Sometimes it's intentional.
[00:01] <+zubus> i love you, ya skirt wearin nothern monkey! ^_^
I dont see HE winning the battle of attrition here, so Tomb Kings ftw.
TK spells should still get through, allowing plenty of raising to be going on, soaking up missiles. Meanwhile, that SSC only has to hit a unit once, and it's decemated.
So, not enough units on the table to deal with the TK's.
In a close fought battle of magic, I expect the High Elves to come through albeit by the narrowest of margins.
I am confident that something can take out the casket before it dishes out some serious hurt on the elves.
Watch this before posting:
Posting and You
~I'm going to have to lean towards HE for today. What I'm seeing is that even though there are a lot of TK magic users, they will end up dying. If the casket is destroyed, then there will be significantly less magic on the undead side.
~High Elves ftw.