Help Choosing a New Army - Post HERE

[Spector]

Of those four, probably looking for speed and melee as the priorities.

And the winner is...Bretonnia!

Fast troops, with all Knights having an 8" move, 16" charge. Great melee fighters, are devastating on the charge (hitting at S5 and S6 with only a 3 man front) and almost all knights have a 2+ armor save .

Other potential armies: Chaos (Khorne); not as fast, buy Chaos is the best close combat army in the game according to most (but I still think Bret's can be better if used properly)

High Elves; the all cavalry High Elves are very popular at the moment (I dare say moreso than their footslogging bretheren). Also, Elves in general have better movement stats then most. Only thing about HE is that they are almost certainly the next army to get their army book redone/rebalanced for 7th edition. However, these guys will not be as strong as Bretonnians on the charge because of a lack of the "lance formation"

If you need any more help with either Brets or HE, feel free to drop me a PM or post in any of the army forums. Brets were my first army, and I'd be happy to lend you any advice I can. Good luck with your choice, I hope you find the army that works best for you.

EDIT: Oh and if I've forgotten an army that should of been listed please feel free to add it. The only one I feel that could have possibly been overlooked is DE and that is because I have no experience with or against DE so I really can't comment on them at all.

[Maneater]

If speed and melee are prioritys use Ogres, easy to paint, movement 6 infantary and arguably the most hard hitting army in the game ( if used right they can be far more manouverable than Brets) at multiple wounds and attacks each.

[Spector]

( if used right they can be far more manouverable than Brets)

I don't really see how a unit of 3+ wide ogre sized bases @ M6 (march 12) are going to be more maneuverable than a unit of Knights with M8 (march 16) in lance formation (3 wide). Even taking into account the depth of the knights (2 or 3 ranks) I'd still say they would run circles around the ogres.

[Undead Bonzi]

Alrighty, this is exactly the thread I need. I currently play 40K and have Daemon Hunters and Witch Hunters. Recently my friend an I were in our local shop and a guy got us interested in the idea of building Fantasy Armies (not that i need to give GW any more of my money but...) and I need a little help to avoid starting an army i wont like.

So anyway my friend and I were looking at the absolutely great deal of the Battle for Skullpass box set that has the Dwarves and Goblins. He's interested in the Goblins and I've been leaning towards the Dwarves and I was just wanting to get a little basic info about some armies I've been looking at before I commit to the purchase.

1st army I'm interested in are Dwarves.
-What are their overall characteristics as an army? Slow/Fast, Shooty/CC, tough/paper armor ect.
-Do they have the ability to make different viable and unique army lists or do I face the cookiecutter setup so common in 40K?
-Have they been recently updated and does GW love them. (I ask because I don't need a third army that GW has put on the backburner for the rest of existence).
-Can I make a solid footslogger force (for some reason I have a dislike of tanks/calvary)

2nd Army I'm interested in is Wood Elves.
-My friend has the codex and I love the look of their models and the waywatchers and rangers sound amazingly fun and strategic in their use.
-Basically all the questions I asked above about the dwarves I'd like to know for WE as well.

3rd Army I'm interested in is Skaven.
-Rats with guns and swords. 'Nough said
-And the same questions again as the D and WE's

Any help you guys can give me I'd appreciate and if you could recomend any other armies I should consider taking into account my dislike of calvary would be great.

[Spector]

First off welcome to Fantasy. Good to see another DH player around . Now I've haven't personally played any of the 3 armies you mentioned. However I can give you some general details about them for the time being.

Dwarves:
-Tough. The standard dwarf is T4.
-Strong shooting. Extremely accurate handguns with armor penetration...OW!
-War Machines. They specialize in them.
-Anti-magic. Dwarves abhor magic. They cannot use it but get extra dispel dice and are arguable the best anti-magic army in the game.
-Dwarves have Movement 3, but always march. (So M6)
-I've really never found anything "cookie-cutter" in Fantasy, unlike 40k. Armies have thier strong points, but anything can be made to work if used properly.
-Dwarves had their army book updated in late 2006, so no they will no be updated again for awhile.
-Dwarves have no cavalry. They can take a gryocopter as a rare choice but outside of that they will be on foot.

Wood Elves:
-One of the 2 very unique armies in Fantasy in terms of playstyle (along with Tomb Kings )
-Variety of special rules for shooting ranging from S4 @ close range to killing blow @ close range.
-Can move and shoot without penalty.
-Can move through woods without penalty.
-Amazing shooting.
-Again, can do a wide variety of armies, from all elves to all forest spirits to a mix of the two.
-Dryads are some of the best core units in the game for their price.
-Almost every unit in their army is a skirmisher.
-Very lightly armored, not much has better than a 5+ save.
-Hit and run/finesse army.
-Support type magic.
-If played well, they are one of the 2 armies (along with Tomb Kings again) that have the potential at the moment to outperform most other armies out there.

Skaven:
-Not much experience against them.
-Very hordey.
-Good shooting.
-Good magic.
-Lots and lots and lots and lots of rats.

Sorry I couldn't be that helpful, I'm limited to what I know from either paging through the army books or from playing against them/seeing people at the store play them.

All 3 armies are well to do at the moment. I've seen/heard about so many WE players winning games something like 1500+ VP to 200 VP lately its not funny. If played correctly they can dictate the flow of a game unlike any army. Dwarves are a very strong army at the moment. Skaven (as far as I can tell from watching them) have always been well off as well.

Also, just out of curiosity, if you had to pick 2 out of the 4 game phases for your army to excel in, which would you choose? Movement, Magic, Shooting, Close Combat.

[Undead Bonzi]

Thanks Spector,

Its kinda hard to say what I want my army to be good at. I know I don't want "space marines" that are good at everything. I like an army that has good strengths and some glaring weaknesses that I have to overcome with good comand. I think as long as I had an army that was good at 2 of the 4 phases I'd be happy.

Movement/Shooting

Movement/CC

Shooting/CC

....I don't have a whole lot of interest in the magic phase of things.

At the moment I'm almost commited to buying the Dwarfs, but I'm still also looking at the Skaven. For now I'm putting the WE's on the back shelf, they seem awsome but I think in my noob hands I would lose alot and probably not like them. So anyone who could fill me in on the Skaven that would be great.

Skaven:

-What are their overall characteristics as an army? Slow/Fast, Shooty/CC, tough/paper armor ect.
-Do they have the ability to make different viable and unique army lists or do I face the cookiecutter setup so common in 40K?
-Have they been recently updated or are they atleast in the works to be updated? And does GW love them. (I ask because I don't need a third army that GW has put on the backburner for the rest of existence).
-Can I make a solid footslogger force (for some reason I have a dislike of tanks/calvary).

[gingerninja]

Skaven rely on large numbers to win battles. They are not very well armoured, but so cheap it's almost scary. The can have some pretty nasty weapons and troops, poison wind globadiers, rattling guns, warp lightning cannons etc.

They are definately a foot slogging army as they have no cavalry of any kind. You can vary the army nicely with magic and specialised clan troops, but I suggest you ask to read a GW copy of the army book to find out more. As a rule you will outnumber any other army, and can have the magic to finish the job.

They are in the works for an update, but they won't be to late 2008 minimum. But at the moment they can be so broken it's unreal.

:ninja: out

[Spector]

Well if you don't like the magic phase, Dwarves are a good choice then sense they have none, but can shut down you opponents magic fairly well. They are slow but steady moving, and they are solid in both shooting and CC. A very good overall army at the moment.

[Sammy the Squib]

If you have little or no interest in magic then I'd imagine you would be wanting to avoid Skaven. They are very magic orientated. This isn't a bad thing as it is devastating for your opponent.

It sounds as though dwarfs are right up your street. They are a very forgiving army with their high toughness, high leadership and heavy armour. They are also a great footslogger army as the entire army is made up of infantry and warmachines (and the Gyro). They also don't have to worry about magic as they have none, but they do harbour a formidable magic defence which can rival even the strongest magic offence.

Their strengths are CC and shooting.

Their weaknesses are magic offence and movement.

Ciao

Stonehambey

[Undead Bonzi]

At this point I'm completely torn between the Dwarfs and the Skaven.

Dwarf Pro's
-My friend wants to start a goblin army and if I start Dwarfs we could get a great deal in the battle for skullpass box.
-No calvery
-Good at what they do, challenging to play
-Recently updated and viable army
-no magic
-Good models
-Great fluff to back the battles I would have against my friends Gobbos.

Dwarf Con's
-Seem a little "smurfy" with their toughness and survivability
-Not an army of large numbers (I play DH 40K, i'd like to have a horde army)
-Fluff seems a little bland and too "been there, done that" fantasy
-Not a lot of interesting units (they have effective units but dont seem to have many fun/unique units or rules)
-No real reason why they could ally with my friends Gobbos for 2 v 2 fights.

Skaven Pro's
-Horde army of rats
-Great and interesting fluff (very unique sort of army in terms of common fantasy genre)
-Funny and fun rules like "fire into combat" and a willingness to kill their own to get the job done
-No calvary
-Magic (which is O.K. since they're great at it and the spells are fun)
-Fun quirky horde to fight my friends fun quirky Gobbo army
-Ability to have fun fluff as to why Rats and Gobbos would team up in a 2 v 2 match

Skaven Con's
-Models look a tad dated
-Cost of making a horde army
-Not updated and not scheduled to be for at least a year.

This is not going to be a fun choice.