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I am planning on using raptors as a main part of my new super mobile chaos force and I can't seem to decide on the best way to optimize the unit. Right now, I am thinking a unit of 10-12 raptors with either IoS or IoK with a sorcerer or regular lord in tow. The question is... which ends up better in the long run... I5 or +1 A? I've ran it through excel a few times and there aren't any results that you wouldn't expect.
Since I am running it with an HQ who will have a higher initiative value anyway, does this diminish the extra attacks vs space marines that I would normally gain? Also, are there a lot of armies out there that I have to worry about having higher initiative? I know Eldar are a pretty quick bunch but I mainly play SM, Tau, and Necrons. As you may tell I have a problem with making decisions when the rewards are so close so I am interested in hearing what your squads look like and why.
Thanks again as always.
I prefer the IoK the +1 attack is a benefit in every assault.
You should also consider a smaller raptor squad of 8. They're easier hidden than 10-12. It also conserves points, naturally.
As for which Icon, you're on the right trail. Khorne or Slaanesh are the two choice options. First, how do you plan on equipping your a.c.? Fist or lightning claw? With the fist you should always take the IoK, as the IoS does nothing for the champion. With claws, it's a mixed bag, and like so many other things, it depends on your environment. The IoS is conditional, whereas the IoK will always come in handy. Plus, I've found that the IoK enables the raptors an effective counterattack for those rare times when they are being charged and no the other way around.
Spambot kill tally. . .337
If your mainly fight Tau and Necrons, with some SM thrown in, the +1 Initiative won't help too much. Your either going before, and at worst, simo. The best one here is IoK to maxamize the damage done to those pesky fire warriors, or those Necrons who never die.
I'm going to go against the grain and suggest that you take the Icon of Slaanesh for the sole reason that as long as your Lord doesn't have the same Mark, he'll be striking at the same time as the Raptors. Let's all be honest. How many times have you had an Independent Character kill everyone in base to base contact, and therefore deny his accompanying unit any attacks? For me, it happened all too often with my Chaplain and Death Company with the old set of Blood Angel rules, so perhaps I'm a bit biased here.
As has been said above, you'll want the Icon of Khorne if you're going to give your Raptor Aspiring Champion a power fist, as the Icon of Slaanesh won't increase the speed of his attacks any, and will waste valuable points. In this case, I'd go with a humble power weapon instead. It's hard to complain about however many high I power weapon attacks from your Chaos Lord, plus 4 more power weapon attacks and a truckload of normal attacks from the rest of the unit all striking at the same time. With this loadout, I think it's a good bet that you'd slam almost every unit that you come across.
Hmm... I'm not very good at Mathhammer, but here's the numbers as best I can figure them.
Chaos Lord with MoK: 6 attacks on the charge of which 4 hit, and 2 cause wounds on Marines.
Raptor Aspiring Champion: 4 attacks on the charge of which 2 hit, and 1 causes a wound on Marines.
7 Raptors: 2+1 attacks per model will result in a mighty 21 attacks on the charge, of which 10-11 will hit, and where 5-6 will cause wounds. Then we're talking about 1 or 2 Marine kills.
As you can see, so long as you get your Lord into base to base with an enemy model and all of your Raptors engaged in the combat, you can expect to drop 5 Marines in a single round of combat with this unit, before they even get to strike! Not bad, I say... especially if you were to give your Lord a Bloodfeeder... hm...
Last edited by Katie Drake; September 5th, 2007 at 22:34.
I alwaysw goes with the Icon of Slaanesh. Hitting first is my to priority. But then again, I run a very small unit of six raptors of which two's carrying meltaguns. Having them cheap and expendable, yet going in for the tanks are my gebeit.
But aybe I'll try the 8 raptor squad with IoK and P. Fist.
Anyone can suggest which weapon upgrades are best with that? Should I keep my meltaguns or go with plasma, or just keep them assault-orientated?
So, everyone pretty much is thinkign along the same lines as me. Perhaps I should have 1 unit of each?
Yup, certainly nothing wrong with that configuration.But aybe I'll try the 8 raptor squad with IoK and P. Fist.Well, I'd think that you'd do best with taking a pair of meltaguns, but only if you're lacking in anti tank throughout the rest of your army. Perhaps a single flamer is a better idea? The Icon of Khorne will ensure that you're not really losing out on much by taking assault weapons instead of a bolt pistol and combat weapon.Anyone can suggest which weapon upgrades are best with that? Should I keep my meltaguns or go with plasma, or just keep them assault-orientated?
Here's a configuration that I just thought of. I used something similar with my Blood Angel army, and much to my surprise, they performed quite well.
- Bolt pistols
- Close combat weapons
- Plasma guns (x2)
- Jump packs
- Power armor
- Frag and krak grenades
I don't have my Codex with me, but I'm pretty sure that I got the points right. Either way, I'd use this little unit as a counter attacking squad. I've deliberately left Icons and Aspiring Champion upgrades out of the equation, as I feel that the cheaper this unit is, the easier it will be to earn its points back.
In order to get the best out of this unit, I suggest that you stay out of close combat at first. What I would do is keep this unit near (or even inside) my own deployment zone and wait for one of those nasty units that is looking to get into combat with your army to show up (we all know the ones... Genestealers, Deep Striking Terminators, etc). When they get close to your lines, move up with this unit of Raptors and let them have it with a volley of plasma. Then, come the assault phase, have another unit nearby charge in.
In your next turn, it's your choice if you'd like to continue to hop around and plasma things to death, or to charge into the unit that they just shot to help out.
Perhaps not the most efficient choice, but something that I believe bears at least a bit of consideration.
If anyone tries these guys out, please let me know if they work for you.
Too bad the Ancient Enemies rule is gone. Would be real fun seeing Slaaneshi Raptors and the Khorne Raptors getting fed up with one another.So, everyone pretty much is thinkign along the same lines as me. Perhaps I should have 1 unit of each?
But seriously, one unit of eash would be perfect. Then you could really pick your targets in a way you wouldnt be able to do otherwise. But be careful. Raptors will get shot up. And thats a fact.
To me, a unit of each sucks up too many points. I mean, they are already expensive as is, so your just giving up points if the enemy has a good firebase.
@Katie - The only thing I see wrong with the Plasma Raptors is the tendency of Overheating to happen during Rapid-fire. I mean, it is statistacally going to happen 33.33% of the time per Plasmagun so your really running a gamble. If only your could have a grunt die for your plasma overheat, like if someone else picks up the weapon or something.