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what do you prefer?
what is the most versitile?
what will do more damage?
what is more intimidating?
Defilers are scarier to the novice player. Running in pairs they are a devastating combo for swarm's or MEQ equivalents. And backup ordnance penetration against vehicles. Relying on only one would be sketchy. Taking it with two extra close combat weapons is the smartest thing you can do, seeing as each turn you will move 6 inches forward, fire the battlecannon, and eventually be in close combat with 6 dreadnought close combat weapon attacks on the charge. If you take a reaper autocannon, for example, you have to chose it or the ordnance, since you can't fire both. The fleet is nice, too. And one thing is for sure... your Rhinos will have something to take fire for the first turn, unless you are playing someone with lots of experience and restraint. Another reason I like the defiler is that once your army makes it into close combat making a lot of shooting impossible, the defiler can get right in the CC mix.
Predators are more versatile at range. Two variants are popular. The anti-infantry, and the anti-armor. And then the overpriced anti-armor (all lascannons). With a autocannon, havoc launcher, and two sponson heavy bolters you have a formidable amount of fire to put into infantry units, and an emergency light armor counter. With the autocannon, lascannon sponson setup for 15 more points you get very strong anti-armor.
Conclusion: Although I prefer Defilers, I must concede that the Predator is a more versatile tool, with better survivability. Both deal loads of damage (just as a Heavy Slot should), but in completely different ways.
In low points game the defiler should probably sit in foam, because as mentioned, they should run in pairs. When you have 115-130 Points to throw around, a predator is a great addition to balance an army. But remember: a Chaos army with only one or two armor pieces is a easily defeated against certain shooty foes.
Last edited by double.bind; September 18th, 2007 at 03:10.
Air Calv Guard: 3 - 2 - 1
Word Bearers: 23 - 9 - 4
Like double.bind said, this decision depends on points played. In lower point games, take a Pred, higher uo, I'd go with double Defilers.
Overall, I really love the Defiler. It's a huge psychological boon to the enemy, and can either lay down devastating range fire or tear things up in CC. Plus, would you rahter have a boring ol' tank, or a Daemoncally Possessed Explosion-Breathing Steel Crab on Steriods?
Originally Posted by Brett on Quidditch[ 1500pt. Chaos List, C&C! ]
-=W: 2 -D: 0- L: 3=-
To me this question is kind of ridiculous... are we talking about dakka preds or AT preds? Are we talking about pure killiness or psychological effect?
Overall I would have to say that the predator is more killiness for the points though like others have said, the defiler has a distinct psychological effect on the opposition.
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT!
I survived LO Chat thanks to: Karmoon, Rabbit, Process, Tossy and Meish.
I vote Defiler. I'm just too much of a fan of pieplates and good CC performance.Having fleet is nice too.
"The more choices you force the opponent to make, the better the chance for you to capitalize on his mistakes"
The problem with defilers is the fleet. as long as they have fleet there is no point in having any shooty stuff on it as you want it to fleet every turn until you can unleaash 6 dread cc attacks on your foes. they should have made the battle cannon optional and dropped it 10-30 points. it's still good it's just that with fleet that big cannon will not be used or fleet will not be used.
meh.. *grumble grumble*
i just don't like hybrids...
*will still field 3 at first oppertunity*
Fleet is for when infantry units hit the enemy lines, and you don't want to shoot pie plates at yourself.
If it was an upgrade I would agree, but since it comes with the model, its functions exactly as I want it to: moves forward firing off ordnance, then when firing isn't safe or I'm about 14" away, Fleet.
An optional battle cannon would turn the Defiler into a silly looking, glorified dreadnought.
Last edited by double.bind; September 18th, 2007 at 11:47.
Air Calv Guard: 3 - 2 - 1
Word Bearers: 23 - 9 - 4
Since the whole tactical idea of the defiler has been handled well above, I'll just skip to the part where it's a whole lot cooler to have a monster ordnance shooting lobster than a tank. I mean, it's just one of the coolest, if not the coolest, looking models in the game. Like a dread on roids.
With heavy weapons being what they are in the new codex, I like the preds more. CSM squads are well suited to dealing with troops and I find myself scrounging for anti tank/MC ability.
When I play an Eldar player with 2 grav tanks, the avatar, and a wraith lord with eldrad to fortune/guide them a battle cannon isn't going to cut it and if the defiler gets into CC it's still just a AV 12 dread with a lower WS and a lower Init then both the wraithlord and the avatar.
In these cases pounding them with a high volume of high strength shots while my CSMs get into the thick of it with the aspect warriors is far more important to me then trying to lob a battle cannon at direavengers then getting torn apart by the avatar before I can attack.
I love the defiler model, but I just like a good old looking tank for it does. The predator is my favorite because It can fulfill one roll at a time depending on what layout I want. Heavy bolters for killing some geq. or lascannons for taking out those tanks or heavy troops. I like its specialization in configuring it.
On the other hand the defiler has lots of veratility especially when given extra close combat weapons. I just think it tries to do to many things at once and the things it tries to do are both too different. Close combat and ordinance just don't fit well with that high price. I don't think it can make its points back, but I still have one because it looks amazing imo.