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I think I'm probably blasting some tyranids with my World Eaters army later. Not played very much at all, so looking for some tips against them. It'll be a 1500pt battle, and i pretty much know what i'll be facing:
1 Hive Tyrant w/ 2 Tyrant Guards
1 Broodlord with 8 genestealer retinue
3 genestealer broods, about 8 in each
1 hormogaunt brood, about 10 models
1 termagaunt brood, about 15 models
That's roughly it.
So far thinking of rolling with a boss daemon Prince lord, a bloodthirster, predator, dreadnought, and loads of bezerkers.
Well, I am far from a Tyranid expert, but since no one's commented yet, I'll throw in some pointers to try and help with what I can.
Broodlord - Must be stopped as quickly and efficiently as possible. This guy can tear through an entire army and still have enough wounds left to eat his own arm. Isolate them, and shoot the crap out of them. I would strongly reccommend NOT placing your units as close to the main battlefield during deployment as you can, this is a great way for them to get a 1st turn charge.
Tyrants - Not much experience here, same with 'fexes - Just make sure you have some reliable heavy weaponry to take them down, and make sure each unit has something to help itself if they get caught - like a Powerfist or some Plasma Pistols
Lictors - Don't let them scare you into altering your battleplan. Part of the reason Tyranid players love these guys so much is because their opponenents will clump together to avoid them. I am not saying you should make it easy for them, just don't go overboard, they aren't that tough to kill.
Fire Control - Make sure you are very careful about your fire control. Even though that gaunt unit only has three guys left, that may be enough to survive a turn and keep you from shooting at the genestealers the next round, which is bad. Just keep in mid that Tyranids use fodder to prevent shooting casualties on their important stuff. Just food for thought.
I hope this helps - sorry I couldn't do more.
"If you can wait til I get home, then I swear we can make this last."
Well my basic plan so far is utilise my lascannons on my predator and dreadnought to try and take out his zoanthropes and a few wounds of his carnifex or Tyrant.
My daemon prince will have daemonic flight, and he's going to be majorly tooled up, and attempt to take out anything else big that needs taking care off.
Bezerkers are to advance through cover, firing the odd shot, but hopefully being in cover when those genestealers charge, taking a few out before slugging it out with them.
Might see about a unit of chosen terminators? Autocannons/combi weapons? Or maybe some chosen with daemonic flight? (i'm into jump infantry by the way!).
It doesn't look like the Nid player has that many synapse control models. The tyrant and probably one of the zoa's, and perhaps the brood lord (can't remember off the top of my head). Take out his synapse will effectively cause both gaunt squads to flee.
His list isn't too competitive, so this should definitely work to your advantage.
What does your Khorne army look like? This will determine your tactics.
Spambot kill tally. . .337
dakka or sniper? if he has a venom cannon and barbed strangler, you will want to take him out before the hive tyrant but after most everything else. If dakka, well, ignore until later or simply powerfist to death1 CarnifexDie horribly to ap2 guns. And powerweapons/powerfists will also get it done with them. Keep your marines in cover and your vehicles outside of 18" if possible=)2 Zoanthropeseasy 80 points. simply punch with any set of 4 marines and it's dead.1 Lictorthis is usually used as bait. Namely, he deploys relatively close (18") and wants you to shoot it ignoring everything else. Yes, it can put out the hurt, but it only moves 6 and assaults 6", with no fleet so long as the broodlord is alive.1 Broodlord with 8 genestealer retinueas long as they are outside of synapse, they act like normal units, so 25% casaulty for fallbacks and such=) Usually target #23 genestealer broods, about 8 in eachwith a 24" move and charge possible, make sure you deploy back from your front line. They will usually die horribly to bolter fire. If you can drop them below 6 members, they shouldn't be much of a problem against any of your squads. Target #1 until they are at or below 1/2 since they can tie up your stuff.1 hormogaunt brood, about 10 modelsas fast as GS but less dangerous. Can still hurt you with s4 reroll wounds on their guns.1 termagaunt brood, about 15 modelsSounds like you prefer CC... This may or may not cause problems. If possible, heavybolters and ACs are your friends, but pretty much any gun you can shoot will ignore almost all his armour. As a suggestion, deploy 25" away from him. stay 25 from hormies, and 19" from GS until you are ready to go for the kill. If you can get a GS squad at 19, you're set. they will advance 6, fleet up to 6". Then you advance, and assault, getting the charge (very important vs GS). If possible, and you have frags, try and catch the GS in cover, so yo ugo simultaneous. Or let them charge you if you have superiour numbers and are clustered enough to get in lots of attacks.So far thinking of rolling with a boss daemon Prince lord, a bloodthirster, predator, dreadnought, and loads of bezerkers.
16,000+ of Eldar (only need flyers)
7,000+ of Nids (want heirophant)
6,000+ of Space Marines (need rever titan)
4,400+ of Cygnar (all models for the faction)
1,500+ of Legion (just started)
I have a good deal of experience against 'Nids and might be able to lend an insight or two.
Firstly, the good thing about all those genestealers is that your opponent doesn't have enough points left over to bulk up on Warriors and Monstrous Creatures. Bad news is that he has a bunch of 'Stealers.
Stealers can be given some additional abilities some of which grant additional movement before the game starts, or can improve their armor saves. The scuttling is one to worry about for first turn charges, so Hotspike was wise to warn against hugging the foremost edge of your deployment.
The only Stealer unit that will be able to infiltrate is the Broodlord with his retinue so do be careful of him. He will be close and anxious to get to grips with as tasty a chaos unit as he can tag early in the game.
One of the best things to do with Stealers is shoot them. I know that is bad news for a CC army like yours but even with the improved armor save biomorph they WILL fall to massed shooting. In CC these guys are nasty and will give your 'Zerkers a run for their money as they are faster than you (reducing the number of attacks back you will get), and their rending claws pretty much make a mockery of power armor. Expect to lose 'Zerkers if you charge full strength 'Stealer broods. Put as many pistol shots or other support fire into them as you can afford before charging/receiving a charge.
The Tyrant with Guard is going to be a tough nut, but at least he has to footslog it across the board. That unit will have a hellacious amount of T6 wounds that will take serious dedication to getting rid of. Sometimes this unit is best dealt with by not dealing with it. Deployment can really help you here if you take the battle to an area of the field where he isn't. Given that you have one Predator, even if it is a TriLas config, if you dedicate him exclusively to taking care of that Tyrant it could take upwards of 4-5 solid turns of shooting just to knock out the Tyrant and Guards. And that is assuming you have an open firelane every turn. And if your opponent is worth their salt that won't happen.
The Carni can be a really nasty unit if equipped correctly. He can be dropping very high strength Pie Plates on you every turn and can fire 2 heavy weapons each turn. Good news is that you will most likely get your armor saves against pretty much all his weapons but be careful if he starts dropping Barbed Strangler hits on your Pred/Dread. With the proper upgrades he can make short work of your prized vehicles - and by no means let him get into charge range of any vehicle. I am guessing by your opponent's list that he is using the Carni as a shooting platform, so for some degree you can also manuever around him as well, but be careful as you might not be able to ignore him if he's played properly.
Be very carefull about getting up in this guy's face to try to deal with him. Carni's can have an array of heinously effective short range weaponry in addition to their long-range shooting, so beware the 18"-12" range around him. Spine banks, devourers, and other abilities can pump out more shots than you can shake a stick at at close range and it will be at surprisingly high strengths. Your Bloodthirster/DP can probably take him but be aware that the Carni can have an upgraded T7, and 4-5 Wounds. Keep this in mind when calculating your ability to take him out in CC, as you will strike first, but those hits back (if they come) can be devastating.
Also depending if you're using the new or old Chaos 'dex will have a bearing on certain units performance as there were some significant changes to those minions of Khorne (not the least of which involves the removal of Khornate Chainaxes).
Also a note of caution about the Horms and Terms. The termagants you will be able to scythe through with your troops. But their shooting could take a toll on your Bezerkers due to sheer volume. Overall a very good speedbump unit that can dish out some shooting pain in a pinch and prevent you from getting your bloodthirsty madmen where and when you want them there.
The horms can actaully be a CC problem again due to volume. If they get a full charge you could be looking at saving 15+ WOUNDING hits. Losing 5 bezerkers from this type of charge will be painful. Thinning by shooting is recommended once they start getting close and remember these guys have leaping - so they can charge 12" and will be fleeting to get to you ASAP.
The Zoey's are going to have the only shooting that is going to deny you armor saves but at a relatively short, bolter-type range. BUt the Warp Blasts are high strength and low AP. The Zoey's are slow, but can cause some hurt to your vehicles or HQ units if they get the chance to ping them.
Also, one last thing to note. Your opponents has VERY little synapse coverage in his list (unless he is running Zoey's with synapse which always seemed a ridiculous waste to me). This is good for you, as it means his Carni has a big liability. He is going to have to stay within 18" of the Tyrant if he doesn't want that big beastie to go stupid. This means he is going to have to tip his hand a bit during deployment as after the Carni is placed you can bet the Tyrant is going to be somewhere within 18" of him. If not, make darn sure that Carni is taking his Instinctive Behavior test every turn until he is in Synapse range. This synapse coverage goes for the Horms and Terms as well so keep a careful eye on whether these units stray outside of Synapse. If the Zoey's are being used for synapse your initial plan to pop them is a great idea as your opponent will very quickly start losing control of sections of his army as his synapse dwindles. And don't forget that the Zoey's have a 2+ save - so they will also take some dedication to get rid of reliably by shooting.
That's about it off the top of my head. Any other questions feel free, and good luck!
Against an army like ths, just go with a simple attack force of Berzerkers. Add a Dreadnought to take out the Zoanthropes and then just swarm the rest of the force as they come. Don't go for suicide charging the Tyrant, the Hormagaunts he is baby sitting will be simple to down, just be sure to get a charge in first. The Stealers then will be vulnerable to a long battle against Zerkers and a Lord.
Asking for suggestions without knowing what you're planning on doing is like asking a blind man what color shirt matches your eyes.
I have to agree with Tarzen- the Broodlord, whilst intimidating, is bait. Remember it can't fleet of foot, so has limited movement speed whilst Mr Lord is alive.
Gene's need Bolter attention- they hurt in HTH, but if you can knock down their unit strength before fighting, he has less chance of rending you to death, and you're free to annihilate them under the amount of Khorne dice you'll have
The Carnifex is always a problem, but it too has limited movement- you need to either go for it, or leave it, nothing inbetween. Same goes for the Hive Tyrant.
With the Hive Tyrant and Zoanthropes, Warp Blast is a real possibility (I love Warp Blast ). Dakka Preds should mince those Zoans from range, whilst the Tyrant guard give the Tyrant some extra HTH ability. Just like the Gene's weakening their unit strength and using multiple units in combat with them should do the trick, as you have sych a high HTH dice output.
Try keep the Dread alive to tie up those small broods- it won't kill them all, but it maens they won't be tying down your other units, and also the Dread will be safe from any anti-tank shooting due to being locked in HTH
Good luck Chief! Tell us how it goes
LO RULESOriginally Posted by Jaffar_Hasad
Thanks for all your advice! I did in the end lose, primarily down to two really big things:
1) Rending. He rolled rending 6's like I've never seen. One of my squad's of bezerkers were wiped out to a man on the first charge of genestealers as he rolled 8 rending out of about 24 dice. hardly any attacks seemed to hit - it was rending or misses. Gutted.
2) BroodLord. I totally underestimated his Broodlord, and charged in with my Chaos Lord thinking he'd have a chance! oops! My opponent has NEVER managed to use his Broodlord well, so I've never seen just how hard they are. Insane. I won't ever make that mistake again.
I got a fair few blood frenzy rolls, and ended up having to charge Termaguants then get slaughtered by genestealers on the charge next go. We were playing a recon mission, and in the end he managed to get a hormagaunt unit and his Hive Tyrant into the scoring zone, i got nothing!
So.... learning points!
1) Shoot the hell out of a Broodlord!
2) I need more firepower to take out some nids. Thinking about a Defiler to boost the firepower. And maybe another dreadnought instead of a predator - which got shot by those pesky S10 shots from his carnifex and ended up shaken for half the game!
So, to expand the army, I'm looking at:
A unit of possessed (i'm thinking giving them daemonic flight, i love jump infantry)
A second dreadnought (one took out a whole unit of genestealers on it's own!!!)
Thoughts? (oh, and I'm using old codex, not new)