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Well I just got a look at the new marine codex and I was blown away. I'm not going to go on a huge post about how good or cheese I think it is, tho it looks really good on paper havent played against it yet.
So I wanted to know about the experiences other chaos players are having when playing against the new marines and your thoughts on this codex. Also I would like to add, this is how I wished the new chaos codex would have been. Ofcourse without the new technologies and more deamon tech.
Wasnt shure this was the right the forum to post it on if not please move it.
If the war by heavens gate released desire
In the line of fire someone must have known
That a human heart demands to be admired
Cuz in the center of the universe we are all alone
CSM codex is still very good. Plague Marines are nasty and tough, Lash of Submission is evil and Obliterators have been powered up. Still plenty going for you
"Well... that hurt" - Vampire Jon Skellan (Mannfred's right hand man) after being beaten up, falling down an underground waterfall and being impaled by a stalactite.
You want some CHEESE to go with that WHINE!?!?!?!? You are a TRAITOR MARINE boy!!!! You are an AGENT OF CHAOS!!!! We do not fear rotten cheddar like that of the "Space Marines" - our swords and bolters are stronger than their breed of monterey jack! We will destroy them simply because they are weak and we are strong - the Chaos gods are with us!!!!! We will always win!!
And that's that.
"If you can wait til I get home, then I swear we can make this last."
We are chaos, regardless of if they get bigger weapons or not they still die the same. There have been no ground breaking additions in their codex and the new codex won't alter my strategies. Death to the loyalists as always
I think we need to look at what the new marine codex bring befor we start screaming chaos rules.
In my view our greatest threat is their combat tactics. Those say that space marines can voluntarily fail Morale tests. This coupled with the ATSKNF which allow them to regroup automatically can really disrupt our close combat.
Ex: My squad of CSM with 2 plasma guns engages a unit of marines with their ranged weapons, killing 3 (over 25% loss). They choose to lose their Morale check and fall back out of assault range. In their own turn they get to rally automatically because of their ATSKNF and can shoot the crap out of us etc etc.
So, to be able to get through this problem we need to engage Marines in one of the two ways, not both because they'll take advantage of that. So we have to chose either to outshoot them or outfight them. For those of us that have fought marines know that we just don't outshoot them. But we have really good means to outfight them. We need to close distances fast and deliver killing charges (berzerkers/termies in rhinos or land raiders or raptors with IoK). But we can't afford to fight them on their own terf, the shooting range. Their elites choices reflect this splendidly with their sternguard and vanguard, both of them specialists in shooting and close combat. The Vanguard can assault directly after a deepstrike and the sternguard has got CSM-killing rounds. But vanguards are dangerous to play as they can fail their deepstrike, there is no such danger with the sternguard. In tournament play you dont want risk elements and so the vanguard wont be so popular. But they're still very dangerous with their relic blades.
"The more choices you force the opponent to make, the better the chance for you to capitalize on his mistakes"
You will see a ton of Sternguard and we'll be worse for the wear. Sternguard (I don't think I've seen a good list from the new 'dex that doesn't have them in it) and voluntarily failing morale checks/ATSKNF combo are the two big things that are going to make them more of a challenge under their new 'dex than the old one.
Hahaha hotspike, your post made me LOL the night away!
Everyone seems pretty worried about the new codex, makes me regret having got my friend into space marines recently. -__-
Then again, as a lot of people are saying, it might be ok once theyve been played against a few times. Mr Wayne seems to have them pretty sussed already anyway.
Just today I played against a "Vulkan" list and it was in fact about as bad as I'd feared--I conceded on turn 5 with only a Land Raider and a couple Possessed left in an 1850 game (compared to killing a Sternguard squad, three Terminators, one Landspeeder and six Marines). Droppodding Sternguard were particularly nasty but the centerpiece of his army were the assault Terminators. Twinlinked hammers with the new storm shield rules...I can't even think of a listhammer solution to them.
"My tanks have names, my men have numbers." -Col. Edmund Grahvess, 23rd Kronecker Prison Guard
While yes, the Loyalists did get some spiffy units, their generic characters have certainly been knocked down a peg. Support characters such as Chaplains and Librarians stand little chance against even our basic CSM in CC. As far as combat, they're little more than two wound marines.
Not to mention that the Loyalist dogs no longer have the option to throw artificer armor on just about everyone.
"It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous."
---Ogvai Ogvai Helmshrot, Jarl of Tra, VI Legion Astartes
look at it this way: if your starting a CSM army, your traitor legion would have come from the new SM book XD
Funnist warhammer moment ----> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kr2jlCyCJBI