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Hi there, I can usually be found fiddling with Dark Elves in Fantasy, but I thought I'd return to 40k after a longish absence, and play around with some Daemons.
I used to play Tau, but to be honest I find the models very very dull, and think the new Daemons look awesome, thing is, I know very little about them, especially with the new 5th Edition rules.
How do they compare to Tau?
Can someone give a girly noob the lowdown on how best to field them? My main enemies will be Space Marines (Grey Wolves and Dark Angels, but more likely to be playing standard SM rules now) and Eldar.
Generally, Daemons play like a lot of other armies at this point. Things such as Daemonic Instability that caused them to die faster are gone. That said, the Daemonic Assault rule that governs how you deploy your army makes them a bit random.
Daemons are broken into their four respective gods, and each one provides a decent summary of their abilities. You're not limited to taking just one god at a time.
Khorne - Smash you in the face. Standard troops are MEQ statlines with power weapons, 2 base attacks attack and furious charge. Only have a 5+ inv. save though, and nothing to boost their movement speed. Other Khorne daemons are variations of this for the most part. Very assaulty, to play Khone is to have trouble getting them to assault, and then slaughtering your opponent in its entirety once you get there.
Nurgle - the Tough guys. Nurgle's followers like poisoned attacks, and with only one exception, are exclusively close combat. They are very, very slow, but with a 5+ invuln, FNP, and a higher T base than you see in most armies, they're rock solid and not going anywhere. Nurgle Daemon Princes are, IMO, the best in the new Codex. Plus, the special character Epidemus can make things....interesting.
Slaanesh - Speed. Slaanesh is all about speed. Again, looking at another all-assault army. This is the army of fairly weak models with a lower toughness, but an I through the roof and a devestating number of attacks. Virtually everything has fleet, half the stuff has beastial charges, and some models can even move your opponents around however they like. Slaanesh lists are swarmy, and they're all about breaking your opponent's face before he gets a chance to break yours. However, given the low T of the various models and nothing more special than the 5+ invuln, you're going to find many of the models are kinda fragile.
Tzeentch - I'm a mono-Tzeentch player. With three other assaulty type gods (the strong, the tough, and the fast), you might be asking where the shooting is, especially since you're a Tau player. Well, it's here. Tzeentch has almost every kind of gun you can think of, and the ability to fire nonstop until the field is fried. The bigger stuff can multi-target between units, Tzeentch MCs can fire up to three weapons a turn at three separate units. The standard footslogger comes with a three shot AP4 bolter (assault, not rapid fire)with a respectable range; highly effective when you take a ton of them. Aside from the MCs available to the other armies, Tzeentch finds itself the most capable of dealing with vehicles, given its better guns and Screamers. Finally, Tzeentch grants his minions a boon to their save - 4+ instead of the Daemonic 5+. That said, for their powress in shooting, they give up combat abilities; only a Lord of Change is respectable, and even then pales compared to the other three GDs. Every standard trooper has the same stats as a Fire Warrior, and you know how those fare in CC.
There's other units you can look at too, not aligned to any particular god. Cheif among these is the multi-tasking Defiler-on-Crack Soul Grinder. Thing's amazing. Go look it up.
SMann hit the most important points.
Your entire army deep strikes and you only have half of your army to starts with (and not always the half you want). Daemons leave a lot of their gameplay up to chance. If you roll badly for scatter and deployment you will have a difficult time getting into a good position. This is moreso than any other army.
That said, you can get the drop on most armies and have a unique style that people may not know how to counter. Plus, the army's just a lot of fun and the models are great.
Had any ideas for a list? Give the Codex a quick run through and see if you can't bounce some ideas off of us.
OK, I've come up with a basic 1000 point army...
1000 points Daemons 40k
HQ: Herald of Khorne on Juggernaut
1 Herald of Khorne @ 120 Pts
Blessings of The Blood God; DGK: Fury of Khorne; DS: Juggernaut of Khorne
Troops: Bloodletters of Khorne
9 Bloodletters of Khorne @ 154 Pts
One with Fury of Khorne
Troops: Pink Horrors of Tzeentch
9 Pink Horrors of Tzeentch @ 193 Pts
Bolt of Tzeentch (x1); DG: Chaos Icon (x1);
1 The Changeling
Elite: Flamers of Tzeentch (3#, 135 Pts)
3 Flamers of Tzeentch
Bolt of Tzeentch (x1)
Fast Attack: Screamers of Tzeentch (3#, 48 Pts)
3 Screamers of Tzeentch
Heavy Support: Soul Grinder of Chaos (1#, 185 Pts)
1 Soul Grinder of Chaos
Mawcannon - Vomit; rW: Mawcannon - Tongue; rW: Mawcannon - Phlegm;
Heavy Support: Daemon Prince of Chaos (1#, 170 Pts)
1 Daemon Prince of Chaos @ 170 Pts
Mark of Nurgle; Cloud of Flies; Daemonic Gaze;
Total Roster Cost: 1005
It feels pretty troop light to be honest - mainly because I've put in both a Daemon Prince and a Soul Grinder. How feasible is this? Also on Army Builder it gives the option to have all three Mawcannons on the Soul Grinder - can these be used at the same time, or is it a case of choosing one?
My Codex is in the post, so waiting on that!
Oh, another thing - I can't find any mention of Psykers - do Daemons get them?
Last edited by Naetha; December 31st, 2008 at 15:56.
daemons dont get psyckers becuase they are the things that are the perils of the warp. So instead we have things called daemonic gifts. Which are our version of powers, but more like weapon upgrades.
as for your list. Soul grinder can only fire one type of maw cannon per turn. So i see it as best to just give him phlem becuase tounge has a 50/50 chance of hitting while phlem is just a scatter dice. Your daemon prince looks good. But yeah your a little troop light. At 1000 points i dont think you need the screamers, and drop bolt of tzeentch from the flamers and horrors, and use the extra points so you have at least 2 icons, and get a few more bodies in your troop selections.
Yep, Daemons don't have psychic powers per se. We don't take tests, so they're essentially just guns.
Grinders can only use 1 maw weapon per turn.
As for the list, it does seem light on the Troops. You could swap one unit out for Plaguebearers and it would be better I think, they are exceptional survival units and can make up for going Troops light.
What the others said, except that Flamers can't take Bolt of Tzeentch at all. Be cool if they could, Flamers have a respectable BS.
Actually they can, but since it costs almost as much as another Flamer you don't see it very often.
Really? Hunh. Must have subconsciously dismissed it then. If it's the standard 30 points per, then yeah, there's no way that'd be worth it.