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Yes, my friends are idiots and I will destroy them with the nasty surprise
No, rhinos put your troops at risk and a lucky shot could destroy your 200 point squad
Are rhinos really that good. On the boards I hear about a lot mechanized forces. My group though, consistently and unanimously agrees that rhinos (and pretty much all transports aside from land raiders or the army equivalent) suck because they're too fragile. Evidently (I haven't run the numbers myself) there is a 1/3 chance of any penetrating hit to blow up a transport and kill the squad inside. I am currently erring on the pro rhino side, seeing as how you can cruise a rhino up until the turn before contact, pop smoke, and run out under the protection of the smoke (I believe this is called a rhino rush). I also heard somewhere on the board about giving it a combi-melta and hurting something afterwords because your opponent probably will just ignore it.
So, what do you guys think?
i think you guys misunderstood something. the squad in the rhino is not destroyed when the rhino is, they just get a str 4 (maybe 3 not sure) hit with normal armour saaves allowed and stand in the wreckage. just the rhino itself gets destroyed and maybe one marine or two if you're unlucky. so the rhino is very welll worth it, remeber you can just use it as sightblock or roadblock without driving the squad around once in the entire game.
Hmmm.... apparently. On pg 61, the rules state that drivers, gunners, and crew are killed if the vehicle is destroyed. Apparently they missed the rules on pg 67. To be honest, I never bothered to look, as they are generally right. Ah well. Thanks anyway
You're very misinformed. On a 5 the rhino is a wreck, units pile out but no damage is taken on the squad. On a 6 the rhino explodes, the unit inside takes a str 3 hit. Roll to wound then take armor saves as normal. You'll lose 1-2 men MAX and your opponent has only taken out a 35pt box.
Rhino's are excellent use of transport, rhino rushing forward is only one of the ways to use them effectively. After your units pile out, use it to block line of sight between the squad and whatever will be able to shoot at it after it has taken out what it assaults. You can also give it a combi-melta and head for an enemy tank, drawing fire away from your other units.
I use 3 rhinos and my zerkers would not cope without them. It's all about using them effectively.
| Hybrid Warband | __*W:7 *D:1 *L:1__
| Hive Fleet Hybrid | __*Not Unleashed*_
I don't play chaos... thats right ya heretics the emperors finest just crashed your forum!!
Basically yes rhino's are definetly worth there points, it is the back bone of my anti ork tactics. The orks run up, while you fire frag missiles out the top then they charge and kill the transport.... oh no. Then my ten men get out shoot and assault the orks, robbing them of there furious charge bonus and extra attacks. So yes rhino's are 100% worth it as transports.
Also as for the rules fumble... it happens all the time, but this was definetly one of the more painful versions. But then again at least no-one used transports... so it was fair game!
I will add another voice for the defense of our beloved Rhinos.
Seriously, I equip mine with an Havoc Launcher and a Pintle-Mounted weapon and they always deliver the goods. I usually use 4 of them and they bring back their points just by protecting my precious marines and killing some troopers while their done (don't understimate a S5 blast template). Also with their integrated smoke launcher they have a 50% chance to just shrug off any kind of hit because they are obscured.
Yes they are fragile, but even if they blow up they usually don't kill the CSM they are carrying and since the transport and the CSM inside are considered separate units, the unit that blowed up the Rhino can't shoot at the squad that comes out of the rhino.
Rhino's are great, during the last tournament I played the last game I moved them constantly 12" and my opponent couldn't get any hits in because of their speed, they protect the troops inside from bolters and even some other heavy fire and on top of that, SMOKES!
I vaguely remember something in 2nd edition 40K where a destroyed transport also nuked its passengers, or was this 3rd edition? Perhaps this was where you got the idea, maybe?
In our previous codex, most players opted for infiltrating their troops, since it was cheaper, especially when playing Alpha Legion. Infiltrate gave strategic board position as well. However, with 4th edition, GW has made it very clear that rhinos are to be our primary mode of transportation for our troop spearhead, or else we must footslog them across the table and endure the incoming range hate. There are, nonetheless, some chaos troop choices that work well without rhinos, such as ranged-based Noise Marines, Thousand Sons, and large quantities of Plague Marines. Yet, on the whole, even these infantry types benefit from using rhinos in order to seize objective markers and advance their ranks into the optimum board placement post-deployment. You might also bear in mind that chaos, along with most other 40K races, follow a general rule of thumb, that is, "field lots of vehicles or none at all." A 1000 point list, for example, that includes a prince, 2 marine squads in rhinos, and 2 predators, provides good synergy among a number of high-priority target that our enemies must then choose what to address and in which order. Often an opponent considers it far more imperative to take down the preds and the prince, so the rhinos are relatively untouched (i.e., their target priority is downshifted due to the need of managing more immediate threats). If, on the other hand, you take the same 1000 point build without the rhinos, let's say, substituting in additional troops for the rhino cost, then you've just made the decision of what our opponents should target much simpler, because now, he/she can address the preds and prince on rounds 1-3, while the slow moving spearhead of marines spends the first few rounds advancing towards enemy lines. This creates an ideal scenario of a little thing I call the hunt-n-peck mode of war, where our troops can be dealt with after the other threats are under wraps. In essence, not having rhinos allows an opponent the option of dealing with our units one at a time, and at a very leisurely pace, as compared to fielding the troops in rhinos, which then puts our marines in a viable combat skirmish by as early as round 2, and thus, our opponents are required to address them as well as the preds and the prince- a much trickier juggling act. Does this make sense?
Now, when it comes to chaos builds that do not make use of our vehicle options, such as preds, defilers, dreads, land raiders, rhinos certainly become much less viable, as they would be the sole targets for enemy tank busting, and therefore would not last long. In this type of army list, which takes advantage of such units as havocs, raptors, and chosen, you'll find our troops work best without the aid of transports. Of course, these builds also typically field marines that are capable of handling themselves without the need of the rhino's increased movement, such as Thousand Sons, Noise Marines, and the durable Plague Marines.
Side: Rhinos are not merely transports or hidden combi-meltas; they are also mobile walls for blocking and controlling enemy hordes, as well as screening more expensive units, such as bikers and raptors. Actually, it is against the horde where I find my rhinos to be most valuable, when I deploy my marines behind cover, and rush the rhinos forward in order to block off my flanks and other key locations of the board.
EDIT: WOW! Talk about unanimous vote! I think this speak for itself...
Last edited by Rabbit; February 9th, 2009 at 05:28.
Spambot kill tally. . .337
I haven't been playing for that long, but one thing I have realised is Rhinos rock. They have got so much going for them while costing only 35 points. Just the marine sitting on top with the twin linked bolter is worth at least 15-20 points, meaning you pay about 15 points for the transport. The lights are great for dawn of war, race up to a target, use the lights to see it and then proceed to shoot the living day light out of the target with your defiler parked way at the back. A strenth 4 hit on the inside means you will lose 2 marines max, and a strength 3 hit on the outside will rarely result in any casualties, 1 max.
I love my Rhinos, they can be a cheap 35 point transport, or pack some punch for 70 points (havoc launcher, extra armour, combi-melta)
Adeptus Mechanicus Marines: http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...ml#post1655065