Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
I'm currently designing my Black Legion army. According to the fluff they place a high value on being possessed, and have experimented as far as 'unpossessing' marines. Logic would dictate then that the Black Legion have a higher proportion of possessed than other Traitor Legions. After reading around the forum for a while it seems however that ~80% of players rubbish them. I like the models, and the stats seem to be alright so I can't really see why they're so bad. Bear in mind that I haven't played 40k since 2nd ed. so I'm quite rusty with rules, unit comparisons etc.
What would be a better pick for Black Legion? I guess Terminators would fit in with the fluff somewhat. I won't be including any deity-specific units such as Bezerkers/Noisemarines.
I did a write-up about possessed before, here: WH40K: Possessed, a Chaos Space Marine unit review Wargamer Haven
In short, they're not terrible per say, but they're not good either. Thier chief problem is that 5 times out of 6 our basic troops can do everything they can do, but better, and with more versatility to boot, and all for the same points cost.
I adore the sculpts though and would recommend picking up at least 1 box or the ones in the battleforce purely for the bits. They're that neat.
On the table though? Meh.
*edit* As for other things to include:
Termies can work quite well. A good starting point is the Karmoon Special, 4 termies with combi-plasma and a power fist, deepstriking, maybe throw in a heavy flamer.
Obliterators could be quite fitting, and they're always useful.
I've heard of some unusual tactics with CC-oriented Havoc squads that looks quite sound indeed (4 flamers, power fist, rhino).
Our basic chaos marines are awesome all arounders. You have a hard time going wrong with them.
Chosen can be handy as either a greater daemon-deployer or an out-flanking unit disrupting enemy plans.
Chaos dreads can be fun, and with a little work, even used competitively by some.
Defilers are very fluffy in a Black Legion army. I seem to recall it was Abaddon who originally commissioned them.
And Summoned Lesser daemons can be useful as suprise reinforcements and shock troops, or to hold a home objective for cheap while you're out giving the enemy a bloody face.
Last edited by Xardian; March 24th, 2009 at 02:09.
Wargamer Haven, my little cyberspace blogspot.
Generally speaking, it's the randomness factor. Since their powers are decided randomly at the start of the game it's hard to fit them into a specific role when designing the army that couldn't be performed better by a squad of berzerkers or raptors for less. They also don't have any ranged weapons or upgrade options (save the rhino and champ) which basically makes them an unreliable CC squad with invulnerable saves.
It's hard to say what would fit in your army better without having a look at your army list, but you generally can't go wrong with termies, though a unit of raptors can always help.
Veni Vidi Variant
I came, I saw, I got a different type of Leman Russ.
The spikey ones go faster.
98% of the teen population has smoked weed, the other 2% went straight to crack.
Saga of the Ages. Click it.
Rules for grenades are on page 72 of the rulebook.
your 80% approximate statistic is off by about 20%
i dont think anyone uses them
but uhh, ill try and answer your questions:
their stats are barely better than that of your standard marine, but cost 1.75x the cost of a space marine. BARELY BETTER. (discounting their inv save)
terminators, on the other hand, have stats more akin to a space marine (with a better save), but for a bit more points (than the possessed), you're getting:
1) terminator armor
2) power weapon
3) twin-linked bolter
the above 3 are not included in the possessed space marine's armaments.
you can also upgrade your terminator's weapon choices.
id show you with number-crunching, but its against forum rules...but terminators are much better.
and i applaud that you're not using god-favored units. i think that's cheap to be sporting everyone under one roof, or else i WOULD have done that (before 4/5E came out)
EDIT: on another note, possessed HAVE NO RANGED WEAPONS
Last edited by vertejaune; March 24th, 2009 at 02:37.
Im bowling with 5 Nurgle possesed, why you ask?
1. I have one of every other cult unit and need a nurgle one, iv made my list and possesed fit, so possesed it is
2. the models look freeking awesome
3. i like the fluff
you see for me gameing isnt about winning, its about fielding an army that looks cool, fits the fluff and is fun to play, i enjoy rolling to see what devilry the buggers will do at the begining of the game!
PROUD TO BE IN THE BRITISH ARMY.
~~ Surrender and serve me in life, or die and slave for me in death~~
Horus I'm with you (its like the heresy all over again)
Anyway my feelings mirror yours, I was bought a box of possessed by my fiance for christmas. I wasnt planning on putting any possessed in my army, But I'm not a hugely competetive(sp) player, and the models are ludicrously cool. I'm much happier fielding an army that looks interesting and hopefully cool. Rather than a min maxed las/plas fest. I do want to win games, and so I do take advice from wizened forumites on a lot of things. But sometimes a model is just so cool I have to have it regardless of its efficency.
I'm currently having such a debate over my last heavy support slot, i know the wise choice is a predator, but the big kid in me wants a land raider.
I would say that there are better things to take than possesed (like termies), but let the numbers speak for me:I'm taking 15 possesed to an upcoming torney in my city.Call me crazy, but possesed are crazy fun for me
People keep saying Terminators are better but then they only recommend the min-maxed Karmoon special. There's something fishy about that.
"My tanks have names, my men have numbers." -Col. Edmund Grahvess, 23rd Kronecker Prison Guard
If you want Possessed in your Black Legion army then use the bits on your champions and scatter the odd arm and possessed head here and there. Dont bother with the squad of them-terminators will work out better.
Even if you dont go the combi-plasma/melta route you can still make them Marine killers with the IoS or the Mark of Khorne twin lightning claw all champion squad of many points.
Also dont be afraid to take the cult troops-loads of Black Legion fluff has mention of Bezerkers for example.
Currently play: 4000+ of Black Legion
People keep mentioning it because it is the tried and true ( and generally accepted to be the best ) termi setup available for us. The CC termis with mark and claws can be fun but nothing ruins someone's day like a bunch of deep striking plasma shots.People keep saying Terminators are better but then they only recommend the min-maxed Karmoon special. There's something fishy about that.Mars, the above is the answer you're looking for. basically posessed are only really worth it if you roll power weapons, otherwise Zerkers cost less and kill more. Also posessed champions do not have access to fists which means a smart opponent can tarpit them with a dread or wraithlord.Generally speaking, it's the randomness factor. Since their powers are decided randomly at the start of the game it's hard to fit them into a specific role when designing the army that couldn't be performed better by a squad of berzerkers or raptors for less. They also don't have any ranged weapons or upgrade options (save the rhino and champ) which basically makes them an unreliable CC squad with invulnerable saves.
I would suggest mixing posessed bits with some standard marines bits and use the Zerker rules for them. You don't have to call them zerkers, just use them as "Counts as" Zerkers, that's what I do...
Hope it helps!
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT!
I survived LO Chat thanks to: Karmoon, Rabbit, Process, Tossy and Meish.