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  1. #1
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    Starting Chaos Space Marines

    Howdy all,

    Long time lurker, first time question-asker.

    I've been thinking of doing a little side project on top of some other things I've got going on at the moment, and I was wondering whether you could give me some advice on a decent 1,500pt CSM list.

    There's a couple of things I'd like to include:
    I'd like it to have the Mark of Nurgle all the way through as much as possible, since I love the models (Nurgle Daemon Prince is awesome!) and Grandfather Nurgle seems like a cool guy. I realize that this limits my tactical options, but I really like the idea of a mono-mark army.

    I'm on a slightly limited budget, so anything you can do to help me in regards to saving money will be nice.

    Anyway, that's all that I can think of, thank you!

    +++XENOS SPOTTED+++ thrilling battles within the Vitorina subsector: http://xenosspotted.blogspot.com/

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  3. #2
    Senior Member stayscrunchyinmilk's Avatar
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    Right, there's a list of competitive things for csm that is:
    Lash prince (with wings) and plague marines. Oh, don't forget obliterators.

    So, you're doing nurgle huh?
    May i suggest converting marines with GS into plague marines? Much cheaper than the metal gw or same price yet jaw droppingly exellent forge world ones.

    Other goodies - terminators? (also jaw droppingly good fw ones) you could convert them (and obliteratorss) with GS and bits,
    a squad of 3 with combi plasma/melta (and maybe a h flamer / pfist) is competitive.

    The problem with doing icons throughout the army is they're so cost inefficient on small squads.
    However, if you are doing it you may as well take some lesser daemons for the deep striking troops with invun save.
    They aren't that good, but they're quite resilient.

    I'd also recommend chosen (who outflank) - a 10 man squad with icon and a bunch of flamers/meltas and fist work well.

    For your hq a prince with fly-wings (think tracing paper and wire with pva glue) would work well.

    so that's hq, a few troops, a elite or two, and a Hvy Support

    Oh, and you can get duffed up marine tanks / apc's off ebay and GS nurgle bits over the appauling mould lines / inidentifiable bits.

    p.s. a pack of nurglings for bases/vehicles would work wonders if you like that sort of thing.

    Good luck!
    Last edited by stayscrunchyinmilk; August 5th, 2010 at 13:15.

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    Thank ye kindly, Crunchyman!

    I was thinking the same thing about the Plague Marines, although I was considering getting the Death Watch shoulder pads to make them look a bit more authentic. I also plan on painting on oozing sores in the creases and crevices of the armour, and the Nurgle symbol on the shoulder pad.

    I had exactly the same thoughts about wings for the Nurgle Prince, maybe using blister pack plastic? I'll have to test different materials of course, but thanks for the tracing paper + wire suggestion, I hadn't thought of that option.

    So the 1,500pt army would look something like this:
    HQ: Daemon Prince of Nurgle

    Elites: Terminators? Dreadnought? (I'd be converting the SM Ven Dread of course, I love the model)

    Troops:
    4 units of 7 Plague Marines, because Nurgle will reward me if I use 7.
    They might have Rhinos...not sure...

    Fast Attack: Raptors seem interesting, and I could easily convert some Assault Marines into Nurgle Raptors. Are they useful though?

    Heavy Support: I was thinking a Defiler here, but I'm wide open to suggestions. Havocs look like the Chaos answer to Devastators, how accurate is that comparison?
    Predators have always been attractive as well, since I've never used a real tank before.
    +++XENOS SPOTTED+++ thrilling battles within the Vitorina subsector: http://xenosspotted.blogspot.com/

  5. #4
    Member Jgroover's Avatar
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    HQ: Daemon prince is great, everyone will tell you to buy him wings and warptime though.

    Elites: Basically terminators are the only good option. Unless you feel like outflanking chosen in a rhino, pricey though. Our dreads suck because they try to kill us with their special rules.

    Troops: Your plague marines should have rhinos. They might seem tough enough to survive on their own but there are plenty of large blasts that can wipe a unit like nothing.

    Fast Attack: Raptors cost way way too much. I don't know any chaos player who uses anything out of the fast attack section.

    Heavy Support: I use defilers because I love the model so much and I just can't make myself not play them. They hardly ever seem to make their points back though, very fragile. If you want a really strong list either use 3 squads of oblits or 3 vindicators. AP 3 just doesn't cut it anymore. I wouldn't bother with a pred, oblits are better IMO and can do the same job and more.

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    Due to the current environment, competitive CSM lists tend to focus on close combat. This doesn't mean we can't excel to some degree at range. Oblits, for example, are a glaring exception to our otherwise hand-to-hand orientation. Predators, too, aren’t a bad choice; it’s just not *that* amazing when put up against our other options.

    Funny thing about Chaos Space Marines: Previous codex editions tended to revolve around specialized units (save for our troop choices). Nowadays, it’s almost as if every competitive choice for us is a renaissance squad. Go figure!

    Chosen: Popular opinion holds pretty fast to the statement that Chosen are only suitable when supplemented with a rhino, in the outflanking position. Allow me to challenge this notion by proposing a more well-rounded option:

    Chaos Chosen Squad
    *8x chosen with IoK
    **3x plasma guns
    **1x champ with fist

    The above unit has a couple main advantages over the rhino-chosen configurations. For one thing, we have very little when it comes to infiltration, which is such a tactical advantage to a veteran traitor. Two, they’re an excellent support squad for your spearhead, and help direct the skirmish in your preferred region of the board (a kind of board control). Three, they can handle just about anything your opponent throws at you.

    Having dinked around with the rhino-chosen, I can’t really see their benefit. Outflanking is highly unpredictable. Plus, any decent opponent will easily gun down their transport and leave the chosen high and dry. Basically, there’s serious issue with getting them to the enemy lines. Now, let’s compare the rhino-chosen to the following terminator squad:

    Chaos Terminator Squad-
    4-5x termis
    4-5x combi-weapons
    1x power fist (or chain fist)

    Roughly the same point cost as the chosen, but with additional close combat finesse to support your spearhead once the combi-weapons are exhausted. Additional perks come in the form of their deep strike delivery method, which tends to put your termis exactly where you want them. Overall, I’ve found the unpredictability of deep strike far more manageable than that of Outflanking, especially once you consider the dilemma of getting your chosen to the proper spot on the table.
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  7. #6
    Senior Member stayscrunchyinmilk's Avatar
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    370 (x8)

    Well, I do like :
    10 chosen
    IOK (thus why the squad is 10 strong, to maximise the investment r.e. Icon)
    flamers and melta's
    champ and Pfst

    - No rhino. they come on outflanking and charge that turn.

    Heck, it works for me, esp as alot of opponents seem to "castle" in the corners vs my rhino bourne bezerker hoarde

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jgroover View Post
    Elites: Basically terminators are the only good option. Unless you feel like outflanking chosen in a rhino, pricey though. Our dreads suck because they try to kill us with their special rules.
    I really wish people wouldn't condemn dreads right away. I did the same thing for a long time till someone suggested a DCCW/Missile Launcher build because nowhere in the rules does it say we can't declare which missile's firing if he's crazed. So if your troops are closest, fire a krak missile. tank nearby? fire a frag. And I'm pretty sure that that build comes at the base cost of the dread.

    OP, one thing that I found on coolminiornot was an excellent tutorial for nurgle slime. if you spread wood glue onto the spot where you want the slime, then before it dries pour some super glue into the wood glue, it shrivels up and turns into a slimey mess and looks AWESOME when dried. here's the tutorial (I used this on my rhino for my plagues and it works wonders): http://coolminiornot.com/article/aid/646

    As for your question about Rhinos, yes always take them. footslogging doesn't work now adays with all the template spam thats possible. I'd rather have low armour then no armour at all.

    Don't worry about fast attacks.... our bikes suck and for our raptors, the best build uses the mark of khorne and since you wanna stay fluffy (which I commend) that really wouldn't work.

    For heavies, yes the defilier is amazing. Run him with 2 extra CCW, since when he's targeted, if they blow off the battlecannon, he can still raise hell in close combat. And as for obliterators, I still say they are the best HS in the game, but thats just me. I never run a list without at least 2 of them.

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    Hooray! I love the defiler model, and was probably going to use one anyway even if it wasn't particularly strong, but it's good to learn it isn't a bad choice.

    What's the collective opinion on Typhus? I think the model is great, and his rules seem to make him a pretty potent psyker and a pretty good character-sniper. What do you think?
    +++XENOS SPOTTED+++ thrilling battles within the Vitorina subsector: http://xenosspotted.blogspot.com/

  10. #9
    Senior Member Ghost of Rage's Avatar
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    Typhus costs too much for anything under 2000 points and is also killed very easily by high strength shots due to the fact he doesn't have Eternal Warrior. Your best option for HQ is definately a Nurgle Prince with wings and warptime, these guys are absolutley insane. I'm also going to agree with Demoneyesko on the Dreadnought topic, I'm actually a big fan of them with the Missile Launcher build. I've never had them do anything to my units with a Missile Launcher and they still absorb shots because they're still very deadly if left alone.
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  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demoneyeskyo View Post
    I really wish people wouldn't condemn dreads right away. I did the same thing for a long time till someone suggested a DCCW/Missile Launcher build because nowhere in the rules does it say we can't declare which missile's firing if he's crazed. So if your troops are closest, fire a krak missile. tank nearby? fire a frag. And I'm pretty sure that that build comes at the base cost of the dread.

    OP, one thing that I found on coolminiornot was an excellent tutorial for nurgle slime. if you spread wood glue onto the spot where you want the slime, then before it dries pour some super glue into the wood glue, it shrivels up and turns into a slimey mess and looks AWESOME when dried. here's the tutorial (I used this on my rhino for my plagues and it works wonders): http://coolminiornot.com/article/aid/646
    Most new-comers to Chaos tend to roll their eyes at our dreads, because of comparisons to our loyalist counterparts. This is a grave error, since our dreads fill slightly different purposes. In fact, the majority of our support squads (i.e., non-troops) are cheaper versions- and therefore generally less impressive on the surface- than the loyalists, which makes sense, seeing as how we’re deep in the warp without the means for maintaining them. Furthermore, we tend to put more stock in expensive troop choices rather than elites and fasts.

    But to bring this post back on topic, our dreads are best considered as a “bridge” unit: They assist at range for the first half of the game, then assists your spearhead in close combat for the later. I rank this particular role fairly high, because we don’t have any cheap long-range tank busting when it comes to dealing with light armor (enemy rhinos mainly). While there’s no shortage of options when it comes to las-preds & oblits, at the same time, neither are cost-effective ways for dealing with light armor. Hence, the missile dread fits this need almost to a “T.”

    Further success with our dreads can be demonstrated against some of the more recent codex updates, such as Space Pups & Blood Seraphs, which can field some rather impressive amounts of close combat hate. For us traitors, having 1-2 dreads in a 2000 point list can help restore our melee dominance.

    On modeling: Here’s the product I use, along with a couple images of the end results. Note: The grapes are rubber, and make excellent pustules when cut in half.







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