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I've been sitting here going back and forth on whether to use Obliterators or Havocs. 3 Obliterators cost 225, while 5 havocs with missile launchers cost 155. That's a 70 point difference (3+ Khorne Berzekers!). It seems like the Obliterators would be good for armies that have a lot of vehicles, while the Havocs are good for everything else. I realize Obliterators can move a little bit and fire too, but really you aren't going to be moving them a whole lot since they are your heavy weps. Is there any reason to take Obliterators instead of Havocs when you're going against an army with very few vehicles (or none, like Tyranids).
*edit* Ignore me, I figured it out. *stats removed by Rabbit* That's why you take Oblits
Last edited by Rabbit; October 13th, 2010 at 04:32.
Don't forget that they have all of those heavy weapons armed on them all of the time and they can swap between them on the fly.
World Eaters: W-47 D-10 L-9
Necrons: W-19 D-3 L-2
Protectorate of Menoth: W-36 D-0 L-7
I removed the stats you listed for the obliterators, since that particular information is under copyright protection.
There are a number of reason people usually prefer oblits to havocs. First, as Ghost of Rage mentioned, is their versatile arsenal. You just can't beat it. Oblits are literally useful against anything our opponents bring to the table.
On heavy weapons: Oblits are Slow-n-Purposeful, which means they can move while shooting their heavy weapons. This actually comes into play more than some people would imagine.
On havocs: While your 5 man havoc squad certainly does put out a respectable amount of missiles, at the same time, they have no staying power. You really need seven to eight bodies in a havoc squad if you plan on tooling them up with four missile launchers. That raises their price significantly.
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I always choose obliterators, as mentioned, they are extremely versatile, can move, are tougher, more wounds and a better save, and can also deep strike, nothing ruins your enemies plans more than appearing behind them and unleashing a torrent of heavy weapon fire, taking a heavy toll upon them and forcing them to split their fire. They are also better than havocs in assault.
I always stick with obliterators, more wounds, better save (plus an invuln) Relentless, come equipped with power fists (in case of occasional CC), and their light special weapons (plasma gun, melta gun) are twin linked, allowing for a much more effective unit. Nothing like a hive tyrant moving just short of your oblits and then getting rapid fire plasma'd to death.
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CSM: W:25, D:3, L:9
DE:W:2, D:0, L:0
In addition oblits can deepstrike. I don't do it often but it can be great for instant killing those pesky Tau battlesuits that keep behind cover. All the icons in a CSM list mean you can use them as extra TL-melta or TL-Plasma close range fire support. The PFs as well have their uses in polishing off enemies that get too close.
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I have been using havoc squads with 4 missile launchers a lot of late, they are very handy these days.
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Maybe try taking 2x 3 Oblits and 5 Havocs with 4 Missile Launchers and see how that works. I probably wouldn't take 3x 5 Havocs with 4 ML because Oblits really are great for their points cost.
It's interesting to me that people think so much of Havocs in the first place on this thread. I posted a CSM thread asking people to list their top 5 unit choices and their 5 unit choices that they would never take. The results were overwhelming that most people wouldn't take the Havoc unit and on the other hand, most people wouldn't be without Obliterators. I don't have either unit because I just started playing CSM about 2 weeks ago so I really haven't a clue either way. I would think that if I were playing Havocs and I know they can't move and fire, I'd just stick them in cover and leave them to fire. Right?
It's a matter of zones of threat. Havocs are stationary so yeah, you find a good piece of cover with a wide (or important) zone of threat and leave them there - you hope you don't have to move them since you lose a turn of effectiveness. However, on many boards there's enough cover for your opponent to find ways to move around the havocs' zone of threat, making them less effective. Oblits are much harder to avoid since even their slow progress across the board can often be enough to give them line of sight round a piece of cover, or cover a new zone if the previous one becomes irrelevant.
A slight diversion - has anybody ever tried putting 4 plasmas into a squad of havocs and giving them a rhino (with an icon of some sort and champ with powerfist/weapon optional)? In my head this seems like a pretty potent unit, but of course it does compete with the rest of the heavy support crowd.
Last edited by andrewthotep; October 17th, 2010 at 00:12. Reason: Brainwave!